Need some tips for starting bonsai here in canada

LemonBonsai

Shohin
Messages
472
Reaction score
487
Location
Canada, Ontario, Cambridge
USDA Zone
5b
I am going to be planting
Crepe myrtle
Japanese white pine
Japanese red pine
Japanese quince
Flowering jacaranda

So i live in canada so i know i will be needing to somehow shelter my trees from winter months for their dormancy period. (My jacaranda i plan to keep indoors which stays at around 20 - 25 C° or 68 - 77 F° beside a bright window with a humidity tray for the winter months). I need some tips on a cost efficent place to store my trees for the winter. Here in canada in the dead of winter it can get really cold (down to -20 C° or -4 F° sometimes even lower) would my garage be warm enough for these trees to stay healthy? What temperature is ideal for dormancy periods in these trees?

If my garage wont work i would appreciate some ideas on what I could do to keep them alive through the winter. Thankyou!
 

Tycoss

Chumono
Messages
884
Reaction score
1,929
Location
Calgary, Alberta, Canada
USDA Zone
3
I guess I’m not too much help, as I don’t have any of those species. I live near Calgary and keep mostly native and locally introduced species. I do have olives and bougainvillea that overwinter indoors, and a couple box woods that live in the garage in winter. I wish you all the best though!
 

River's Edge

Masterpiece
Messages
4,708
Reaction score
12,605
Location
Vancouver Island, British Columbia
USDA Zone
8b
I am going to be planting
Crepe myrtle
Japanese white pine
Japanese red pine
Japanese quince
Flowering jacaranda

So i live in canada so i know i will be needing to somehow shelter my trees from winter months for their dormancy period. (My jacaranda i plan to keep indoors which stays at around 20 - 25 C° or 68 - 77 F° beside a bright window with a humidity tray for the winter months). I need some tips on a cost efficent place to store my trees for the winter. Here in canada in the dead of winter it can get really cold (down to -20 C° or -4 F° sometimes even lower) would my garage be warm enough for these trees to stay healthy? What temperature is ideal for dormancy periods in these trees?

If my garage wont work i would appreciate some ideas on what I could do to keep them alive through the winter. Thankyou!
Perhaps you could take the time to update your profile with location and climatic zone. Canadian winters vary a lot from coast to coast. Your description may mislead some folks with the conversion error or typo!
I would suggest considering some native species that make excellent Bonsai.
 

LemonBonsai

Shohin
Messages
472
Reaction score
487
Location
Canada, Ontario, Cambridge
USDA Zone
5b
I guess I’m not too much help, as I don’t have any of those species. I live near Calgary and keep mostly native and locally introduced species. I do have olives and bougainvillea that overwinter indoors, and a couple box woods that live in the garage in winter. I wish you all the best though!
Do you know how cold your garage gets over winter? Is it non insulated and non heated?
 

Tycoss

Chumono
Messages
884
Reaction score
1,929
Location
Calgary, Alberta, Canada
USDA Zone
3
I would second Rivers Edge Said about considering native species. When I first became interested in the hobby, I was most interested in traditional temperate species like you have listed. Now almost everything I have is locally collected.
 

LemonBonsai

Shohin
Messages
472
Reaction score
487
Location
Canada, Ontario, Cambridge
USDA Zone
5b
I would second Rivers Edge Said about considering native species. When I first became interested in the hobby, I was most interested in traditional temperate species like you have listed. Now almost everything I have is locally collected.
I also have a couple native species that i have started but wanted to venture out and see if i could make a couple other species work.
 

Forsoothe!

Imperial Masterpiece
Messages
6,878
Reaction score
9,248
Location
Michigan
USDA Zone
6b
Jacaranda is a bad trip for most northerners. The wonderful blue flowers are inviting, but they aren't inviting you. The leaves may reduce a little, but when you start with 18", it's a fool's errand. One of the factors in tree genetics is constancy of characteristics. Plants with large leaves need to have concurrently large internodes, otherwise the successor leaves would shade prior leaves. So, trees with large leaves have large spaces between leaves, and large spaces between branches, and that makes for relatively skinny, airy trees. A lot to overcome in a zone with a short growing season.

If the leaf form is what turns you on, then Honeylocust is a good hardy substitute. 'Sunburst' is a great yellow when leafing-out. If you want blue-ish flowers then Korean Lilac 'Miss Kim' is a good bet.
 

sorce

Nonsense Rascal
Messages
32,908
Reaction score
45,579
Location
Berwyn, Il
USDA Zone
6.2
could make a couple other species work.

This is kind of the same as the frustrations one will get when trying to keep horses in the house.

More pains than gains, so much you might end up hating ponies and not believing in unicorns.

Then bonsai is no longer fun!

Welcome to Crazy!

Sorce
 

Underdog

Masterpiece
Messages
2,677
Reaction score
6,873
Location
Ohio
USDA Zone
6
I third and forth what's been said above. I had plants of all zones but mine it seemed initially but now I look for plants zone 4-5 so I son't have to baby sit and worry all winter. Some are borderline and I've turned to survival of the fittest attitude on many. Your local nursery will stock plants appropriate to your zone only.
Bonsai is hard enough to do well. Don't make it harder on yourself.
 

Bonsai Nut

Nuttier than your average Nut
Messages
12,412
Reaction score
27,823
Location
Charlotte area, North Carolina
USDA Zone
8a
Jacaranda is a bad trip for most northerners.

Jacaranda is a bad trip for most southerners too :) In California it was my least favorite landscape tree. Last to bud out in the spring, first to drop leaves in fall. Large compound leaves that don't reduce. Weak wood, prone to die-back and dropped branches. For one month a year it is the most beautiful thing out there... but you pay for it the other 11 months. For bonsai, particularly in Canada, I would chose something more rewarding that requires less work and heartache (personal opinion).

I agree with the other comments about locating native trees. It is the easiest path to success... because you know you can leave them out in your yard year round as long as you mulch them in and protect the roots. In some cases, all that is required is to throw a tarp over your bonsai bench, place the trees underneath, and mulch in the pots. In terms of cold hardiness ranking:

Most cold hardy (for zone 5b)
Japanese white pine
Japanese red pine

Moderately cold hardy (needs protection):
Japanese quince

Not cold hardy (will die if left outside):
Crepe myrtle
Flowering jacaranda
 

LemonBonsai

Shohin
Messages
472
Reaction score
487
Location
Canada, Ontario, Cambridge
USDA Zone
5b
Jacaranda is a bad trip for most southerners too :) In California it was my least favorite landscape tree. Last to bud out in the spring, first to drop leaves in fall. Large compound leaves that don't reduce. Weak wood, prone to die-back and dropped branches. For one month a year it is the most beautiful thing out there... but you pay for it the other 11 months. For bonsai, particularly in Canada, I would chose something more rewarding that requires less work and heartache (personal opinion).

I agree with the other comments about locating native trees. It is the easiest path to success... because you know you can leave them out in your yard year round as long as you mulch them in and protect the roots. In some cases, all that is required is to throw a tarp over your bonsai bench, place the trees underneath, and mulch in the pots. In terms of cold hardiness ranking:

Most cold hardy (for zone 5b)
Japanese white pine
Japanese red pine

Moderately cold hardy (needs protection):
Japanese quince

Not cold hardy (will die if left outside):
Crepe myrtle
Flowering jacaranda
I understand. I have started some native trees so i will have some easier trees but wanted to challenge myself. Ive always thrived to challenge myself in things that I do. Anyways thankyou for actually answering my question along with some suggestions. For the japanese quince would you think that my garage would be sufficent protection?
 

GGB

Masterpiece
Messages
2,066
Reaction score
2,221
Location
Bethlehem, PA
USDA Zone
7a
Which side of your house is the garage on. That makes a BIG difference. Mine faces south and has a window on theeee. ... . East side. So it actually gets too warm in the winter and brings my trees out of dormancy if I leave them in there too long. I only use it for the coldest nights for my JM. If it had no window and was north facing it would be a way different story, definitely put a thermometer in there to see what temp it is. You probably don't want to hear this but... I personal JUST made complete peace with growing things that belong in my zone. I found that winter wasn't the hard part of keeping something outside it's best zones, in fact it's the easiest part. The lackluster growth and fungal/insect pests are what finally made me quit on my "challaenge trees". I HAD loblolly pines and bald cypress but I was just to far north to make them happy, they started threatening to blight my other healthy trees. That being said I still HAVE jack pine and American larch which are technically not fit for my summer heat but they haven't given me an ounce of trouble yet so we'll see. But I'm ready to give em the ax if that's what it comes to
 

LemonBonsai

Shohin
Messages
472
Reaction score
487
Location
Canada, Ontario, Cambridge
USDA Zone
5b
Which side of your house is the garage on. That makes a BIG difference. Mine faces south and has a window on theeee. ... . East side. So it actually gets too warm in the winter and brings my trees out of dormancy if I leave them in there too long. I only use it for the coldest nights for my JM. If it had no window and was north facing it would be a way different story, definitely put a thermometer in there to see what temp it is. You probably don't want to hear this but... I personal JUST made complete peace with growing things that belong in my zone. I found that winter wasn't the hard part of keeping something outside it's best zones, in fact it's the easiest part. The lackluster growth and fungal/insect pests are what finally made me quit on my "challaenge trees". I HAD loblolly pines and bald cypress but I was just to far north to make them happy, they started threatening to blight my other healthy trees. That being said I still HAVE jack pine and American larch which are technically not fit for my summer heat but they haven't given me an ounce of trouble yet so we'll see. But I'm ready to give em the ax if that's what it comes to
My garage faces south east and has no windows. And thankyou for your experience in trees not in my native zone. I will keep that in mind. I know in the future i may stick more to native trees. As i said earlier i have a couple native ones growing. Just wanted to try some different thibgs and i know most of this hobby is going to be alot of trial and error so just trying to get some basic info on my best shot :p
 
  • Like
Reactions: GGB

River's Edge

Masterpiece
Messages
4,708
Reaction score
12,605
Location
Vancouver Island, British Columbia
USDA Zone
8b
trying to get some basic info on my best shot :p
Local Bonsai Club will have the experience and inside information on what works best in your zone! Ontario has has very talented and experienced Bonsai people.
Planting trees is great for later on! 10,20,30 years! Collecting native species should be considered. Larch, Pine, Spruce, Maple!
For over wintering you could consider some simple structures! Root Cellar concept!
Good book for native collection ideas would be Bonsai from the Wild by Nick Lenz. American author who often references Canadian species and collection.
 

nagatay

Yamadori
Messages
64
Reaction score
26
USDA Zone
9
Nigel Saunders,bonsai zone youtu b might be helpful. However, I don't know how to get in touch with him good luck
 

Mary Katherine

Seedling
Messages
6
Reaction score
2
Location
Guelph, Ontario
USDA Zone
5
I successfully overwintered a 3 yr old Ulmus ( elm ) youngster in Guelph ON by settling into my garden soil and letting the snow bury it. The only issue I had was a rabbit taking the top 6 inches in the Spring thaw.
 

LemonBonsai

Shohin
Messages
472
Reaction score
487
Location
Canada, Ontario, Cambridge
USDA Zone
5b
I successfully overwintered a 3 yr old Ulmus ( elm ) youngster in Guelph ON by settling into my garden soil and letting the snow bury it. The only issue I had was a rabbit taking the top 6 inches in the Spring thaw.
Interesting. Did you just let it grow inside for the first few years and that was your first time ocerwintering it outside?
 

Mary Katherine

Seedling
Messages
6
Reaction score
2
Location
Guelph, Ontario
USDA Zone
5
It's never been inside. The year I decided to 'lift it' I dug a small trench and then cut the roots about 4 inches deep under the sapling tree,
I left it and did it a second time and then lifted it and severely root pruned it last spring. So it's only been one year+ in the pot and over wintered in the pot for one year. I don't see any reason not to do it again.
It is only 2ft tall (after the rabbit.)
 
Top Bottom