New coast redwood...thoughts appreciated!

[coh]

In my "recent acquisitions thread", (http://bonsainut.com/forums/showthread.php?11733-Recent-acquisitions-(new-projects)) I showed a coast redwood that I recently acquired from a local club member. It's an interesting piece of material with significant trunk movement and deadwood, and thus a number of potential fronts. As a relative beginner I have some difficulty seeing the future in raw material, so I wanted to find out if anyone has any thoughts or suggestions. I took photos from a number of angles but it's not easy to get good shots of the trunk with all the foliage (though I pulled it out of the way as best I could). Also, the camera lens has a blemish that creates a blurry spot just above the center of the image. Unfortunately not much I can do about that.

The original owner had acquired a bunch of these from Mendocino Bonsai a couple of years ago. It's obvious that he hasn't done any significant pruning/styling, but overall the tree seems healthy and well established in the container. It is growing well all over, though some of the branches were damaged a bit in transit.

Photo 1: for reference, the base in this view is about 4" at the soil line, and the height to the top of the original trunk (marked in red) is about 11". The total height is 16". This view presents both a wide base plus some interesting deadwood and trunk curves. Top of trunk bend to the right and back from the viewer.



Photo 2: Deadwood at top of original trunk. The whole side is dead but only part of the bark has worn away.



Photo 3: Rotating clockwise, we come to this view. Narrower base but still lots of deadwood and movement.



Photo 4: Rotating further, almost (but not quite) the opposite view of photo 1. Wide base and good taper but very little deadwood in this view. Top leans strongly toward viewer.



Photo 5: Last one is roughly the opposite of photo 3. So reversed lean, but not much deadwood in this view.



Thanks in advance for any thoughts or suggestions!

Chris

 

[Redwood Ryan]

Beautiful! But, uh, how're you going to over winter it?

 

[coh]

I've overwintered 2 others (one for 5+ years) without any problems. They go into an unheated mudroom that stays between 35-45 deg most of the winter.

 

[Redwood Ryan]

I've overwintered 2 others (one for 5+ years) without any problems. They go into an unheated mudroom that stays between 35-45 deg most of the winter.

Ah I see. They've never managed to really make it through my winters, drop too many needles and just go belly up...

 

[october]

Wow.. This is a beautiful tree. Reminds me a bit of the one I used to have. I could never keep it healthy due to fungal disease.

Rob

 

[coh]

Wow.. This is a beautiful tree. Reminds me a bit of the one I used to have. I could never keep it healthy due to fungal disease.

Rob

Yes, I remember that tree from the other thread. Really sorry that you lost it.

Curious whether any of the photos strike you as a "best front"? I know you can't see all the details of the trunk...but from what's there?

Chris

 

[october]

You know, I am not sure what ever became of my redwood actually. I gave it to the nursery and they could not keep it healthy. They ended up selling it in a summer sale. The tree could still be alive or maybe even somewhat recovered.

As far as yours. There seems to be a few workable fronts. The first pic and the last pic seems to show a very promising informal upright The second to last seems to be a pretty powerful upright. The nebari is amazing on the last pic. However, the area right above that is not as good as in pic one. I would narrow it down between the first and last pic. However, overall, the first pic makes the best front imo. Reasons are you get good nebari and a smooth trunk line with a subtle curves. I think this might be one of the best pre bonsai redwoods that I have seen.

Rob

 

[Redwood Ryan]

You know, being down for so long I'm really starting to wonder, how successful would a Coast Redwood survive if it was grown like a tropical. Indoors, in a good amount of humidity, and under bright, bright lights. Hmmmmm.....

 

[october]

You know, being down for so long I'm really starting to wonder, how successful would a Coast Redwood survive if it was grown like a tropical. Indoors, in a good amount of humidity, and under bright, bright lights. Hmmmmm.....

Hi Ryan.. Glad to see you posting... There is a bonsai nursery in MA that has coastal redwoods once in awhile. If I remember correctly, in Summer, they are outside. In Winter, they are in a greenhouse treated like a tropical. They keep them like you would a ficus. Their redwoods are very healthy, especially for this part of the country.

Rob

 

[Redwood Ryan]

Hi Ryan.. Glad to see you posting... There is a bonsai nursery in MA that has coastal redwoods once in awhile. If I remember correctly, in Summer, they are outside. In Winter, they are in a greenhouse treated like a tropical. They keep them like you would a ficus. Their redwoods are very healthy, especially for this part of the country.

Rob

Feelin' good Rob, thanks. I've got quite a few Coast Redwood seeds in my fridge, so I'm really tempted to sprout 'em and keep 'em pruned under bright bright fluorescents, see what comes of them.

 

[fredtruck]

I have a coast redwood. I kept it in a room that hovered between 35 and 40 degrees F. last winter, and it did fine. Light was what came in large southern exposed windows. There was a very small amount of dieback, and the tree rebounded easily. I think they need some cool down to grow well.

 

[coh]

You know, I am not sure what ever became of my redwood actually. I gave it to the nursery and they could not keep it healthy. They ended up selling it in a summer sale. The tree could still be alive or maybe even somewhat recovered.

As far as yours. There seems to be a few workable fronts. The first pic and the last pic seems to show a very promising informal upright The second to last seems to be a pretty powerful upright. The nebari is amazing on the last pic. However, the area right above that is not as good as in pic one. I would narrow it down between the first and last pic. However, overall, the first pic makes the best front imo. Reasons are you get good nebari and a smooth trunk line with a subtle curves. I think this might be one of the best pre bonsai redwoods that I have seen.

Rob

Thanks for your opinions. My initial thought when I first saw the tree was, if nothing else, the view from position 4 could be used to make a strong upright tree with lots of taper, somewhat like the tree you used to have. Now, though, after looking at the tree for about a week, I think it would be a mistake not to try to take advantage of the movement and deadwood visible in photo 1...so that's what I'm leaning towards. I just need to figure out how to use the foliage and growth characteristics of coast redwood to best highlight those features.

It would be nice if your tree was still alive (and thriving) somewhere. I don't know how well these will do long term in this climate...as I said, I've kept one alive and reasonably healthy for over 5 years which is a good sign. Hopefully they'll be OK. I have a bit of a sentimental attachment to coast redwoods, having spent a fair amount of time along the spectacular California coast (mainly the Big Sur region) - they remind me of that time.

Chris

 

[coh]

I have a coast redwood. I kept it in a room that hovered between 35 and 40 degrees F. last winter, and it did fine. Light was what came in large southern exposed windows. There was a very small amount of dieback, and the tree rebounded easily. I think they need some cool down to grow well.

So your winter conditions are similar to mine. I remember discussing coast redwood cold hardiness with Brent Walston. He said his potted redwoods (at his nursery) have survived temperatures well down into the teens, and that there is a grove near him where temperatures can get down as low as 10 F. Those are pretty cold temperatures. I've allowed mine to get touched by frost but haven't dared to let them get below about 28/29 F. I don't think they'd be able to handle our combination of prolonged deep cold and dry winds, but they may be more cold hardy than most of us think.

On the other hand, I wonder if the heat of summer (such as in Virginia, for Redwood Ryan) is just as bad as the cold? The native environment is definitely coastal, very moist with lots of fog. So a string of blazing summer days in the 90s and above might be pretty tough on these trees, especially those in small pots.

I hope others will post about their experiences in different climates.

Chris

 

[fore]

Really nice Chris!! I love this one too, pic 1 being my fav too. I'd love to have one, but I can't provide consistent above freezing here so I've always ruled them out. But if it can be treated as a tropical inside during winter?...humm...

 

[Gene Deci]

Really nice Chris!! I love this one too, pic 1 being my fav too. I'd love to have one, but I can't provide consistent above freezing here so I've always ruled them out. But if it can be treated as a tropical inside during winter?...humm...

I overwinter mine in an unheated shed that is below freezing for three months or more each winter. Last year it got down to 23 F (or colder - I measured 23 F). No problems.

 

[jquast]

I like pic#5 as your front. Shows both nice taper and movement.

 

[coh]

I overwinter mine in an unheated shed that is below freezing for three months or more each winter. Last year it got down to 23 F (or colder - I measured 23 F). No problems.

Really! That's very interesting. Do you mulch the pots at all, or just leave the entire tree/pot exposed to those temperatures?

Have you ever posted photos of the trees? I'd love to see some of them.

Chris

 

[Gene Deci]

Really! That's very interesting. Do you mulch the pots at all, or just leave the entire tree/pot exposed to those temperatures?

Have you ever posted photos of the trees? I'd love to see some of them.

Chris

No mulch, just stuffed in with a bunch of my other trees.

This picture was taken earlier this year - not a great picture but my most recent one. One of the trees I obviously started working on, the other, not so much. But both seem to be healthy enough.

 

[coh]

Thanks for posting those! They both have great potential, though obviously the left one is a little better defined at this point. I guess the remaining question I have is, how long have you had them? How many winters have they experienced in your area?

Chris

 

[Gene Deci]

Thanks for posting those! They both have great potential, though obviously the left one is a little better defined at this point. I guess the remaining question I have is, how long have you had them? How many winters have they experienced in your area?

Chris

Thanks. I have only had them three years, so they are still very much at the "potential" stage. I have not worked with this species before and am not sure if developing ramification is difficult? I have not had much luck with that but, as I say, I'm only just starting on them.