Multi Trunk JM 2019

[Woocash]

Cheers Bobby. Yea I thought i’d do as much really, just wanted to make sure before I kill my most expensive purchases outright! I wasn’t going to go any further than you went on those two anyway so I think they’ll be fine. Their nice and healthy and all anyway.

 

[sorce]

Thanks for the tips Sorce. I agree on everything but the cuts ;-) They're a bit too low for my taste. I have time to think about it though.

I understand.

My thing is....

The height of the base, or connected parts, kind of determines the length of the next segments, which is why I think them lowest are best.

Don't take this the wrong way.....

Our tastes should determine the material we buy, not how we treat material we have.

The best thing for the material should determine how we treat the material.

For instance.....

You can make this into the BEST it can be, and sell it for 2 trees you like.

Or you can make this into a tree you thought you tasted for, but something will always be a bit off.

I know this isn't such an extreme scenario, but it's quite like if I bought a 50 year 5 figure broom and chopped it to the base cuz I like short trees. I coulda sold it for more appropriate material. Instead I threw money away.

It's not about taste, it's about money, and ACTUALLY getting what you want.
Super selfishness.

Sorce

 

[Shibui]

Your tree, your call on how to grow it but you did ask.
Good bonsai trunks require good taper. Taper is developed best by cut and regrow. Most trees only ever grow larger so cutting lower than the anticipated size is required to develop taper and to have a tree the size you want.
Current trunks have little taper. They also have long internodes so growing branches will be difficult though you may have enough buds to fill the spaces with the 3 trunks. You can keep them intact but I think you will regret that decision later.

 

[ajm55555]

Our tastes should determine the material we buy, not how we treat material we have.

The best thing for the material should determine how we treat the material.

Very much agreed.
Do you think the cuts in the 2nd picture are too high?

 

[sorce]

There is a lot more wrong with those cuts than heights.

The way I see this tree....
The left is the smallest. Thinnest AND shortest.
You could make the middle or right trunk the dominant one.
Right would look silly so middle is dominant, the tallest and thickest.

The most important thing to consider before cutting for heights(the easy part), is getting the girths right before cutting anything. Otherwise you chase your tail to design demise.

The problem with these cuts is they pay no regard to any bonsai design aspect whatsoever.



The purple is the segment length proportions we shoot for. Long Medium Short. LMS.
These cuts have a Short Long Short.
A Medium Long Short.
And a medium medium medium.

It doesn't even make enough sense to get into trunk heights girths or placements.
It's essentially ruined. I mean, sure you can "start it over" from there, but it's a like a human voluntarily going into a coma for 5 years. Why do that to a tree?

I'm talking about growing this out almost as is, until that left space between trunks one and 2 close. Quite a bit thicker. Hopefully managing to make the sizes good and different with leaf pulling. Allowing you to make all the chops at the same time.

There is a "leave it taller" route. But I think there is material better suited.

Your initial cut lines, had 2 trunks about the same height.
One other word of caution, that big branch on the right trunk, is going to get that trunk bigger than the middle fast. It should be cut off, or addressed at least, depending which you want to be the dominant trunk.

Sorce

 

[sorce]

I'm predisposed.


Sorce

 

[LanceMac10]

I couldn't leave this JM on the bench of the local Garden Center. Half price at Euro 25!
I'd like to ask your suggestions on where to cut the next Spring. I rough cut the longest branches, just to make it more compact but will not do any major cut now that Winter is at the door.
It will rest in peace and not being a cultivar, I trust it will make it through easily.
Thank you!
View attachment 271774

I dig it. I grab "landscape yard" stuff like this a lot. Me? Come spring '20, I'd repot in a "sliver of a pot" while I remove 70-80 % of the current root-ball. Don't even touch the top. Bare-root, wash out old soil, just go to town. Wire it in hard, right on the bottom of the container and back-fill with good "bonsai soil".....maybe a handful just to help set a good angle for the future....


….any thoughts?

 

[ajm55555]

Don't even touch the top

How long would you let it grow freely before cutting it hard, Lance?

 

[LanceMac10]

First, you'll need to find where the actual base is, where the roots emanate from the bole. That's why I suggested a bare-root re-pot. Get all the roots sorted, assess best angle/placement because the rest of your decisions will be based how "attractive" this area is. Probably have the ol' "Eagle Claw" base from the roots growing down and not out. That makes things a lot more challenging.


As far as a heavy cut-back, I'd let it go at least one season un-molested. I get "better" results doing hard pruning when the tree is on a fat & happy root-ball. While doing a hard prune in concert with an aggressive approach on the roots definitely decreases "weeping" to almost nil, think of the energy wasted amongst the roots you remove. A healthy root-ball that just had all it's foliage removed will respond quite vigorously. I prefer to do one thing at a time, here.

If you must cut, ( this IS bonsai, people want a bit too much instant gratification ), thin the top out. Lot's of heavy wood up there, cut back to finer shoots and remove down to two shoots any congested areas. I usually just leave the top alone when using this kind of material. Use top growth to signal "the engine room" for more roots. So use a good soil mix.


Nothing wrong with being patient, to the point of "neglect". I have a feeling you'll encounter a bit of a challenge with the base of this material. Sort that first before a drastic prune for taper.

 

[sorce]

this IS bonsai,

Something about the way you put out good information that I just really dig.

Cheers!

Sorce

 

[ajm55555]

If you must cut

I don't have to cut Lance Your observations make perfectly sense to me and I won't be dead in 1 year, at least not with high probability.
I'll do the roots next Spring and the top one year after.
Thanks!

 

[ajm55555]

Spring update. Repotted, pruned to get some shape and growing free for this season.

 

[ajm55555]

Mid May update. I pruned a few branches that were not growing anymore and I'll wait for the remaining ones to thicken before doing anything else. The white stuff on the leaves is a light spray of sulfur-based fungicide. No pests so far apart a few aphids.

 

[AlainK]

It looks nice.

Like others, I would have pruned it much lower, but it looks nice.

 

[ajm55555]

Thanks Alain! For now its main task is to grow. I will make sure it has taper and it's not too leggy but I want it to be a tall tree anyway. We will see!

 

[ajm55555]

Late Summer update. Probably I will change the front like this.

 

[ajm55555]

Belated Fall update.

 

[ajm55555]

Winter update.

 

[AlainK]

I don't like the roots so much. I think the trees should be buried deeper with the top of the soil at the yellow line.

Maybe airlayer it from this line under to get a better nebari...

 

[ajm55555]

I don't like the roots so much. I think the trees should be buried deeper with the top of the soil at the yellow line.

The next time I repot it I'll probably bury it a little bit more, you're right.