Newbie with another Juniper

[Camo252]

Hey everyone,

This is my 2nd juniper that I'm working on at the moment. It's approximately 8 years old according to the website I bought it from. I've already given it a pretty big haircut but have left the bottom branches on for a bit longer so as not too stress the tree out too much. I've also added some wire to the top branches and will bend them to where they'll work out best. The only real style I can see working with this tree is Literati.

Here are some photos of what I've got so far. If anyone has any thoughts or comments on where I should be going with this tree I'd love to know.

Thanks,
Camo

 

[bonsaibp]

I don't know if you took off the branches in the center or if you got it that way but that may have been a mistake.
Given what you have I would consider airlayering the top and creating two trees from it. You could probably start it now and separate next spring. Nanas a/l easily.
Then you could get two smaller trees with good proportions.
Or like you said there is a possible literati there - in which case I'd lose the lower branches and concentrate on styling the top. Then in the spring repot.

 

[Vance Wood]

I don't know if you took off the branches in the center or if you got it that way but that may have been a mistake.
Given what you have I would consider airlayering the top and creating two trees from it. You could probably start it now and separate next spring. Nanas a/l easily.
Then you could get two smaller trees with good proportions.
Or like you said there is a possible literati there - in which case I'd lose the lower branches and concentrate on styling the top. Then in the spring repot.

What he said. This is a good idea and good practice. Thanks bonsaibp for saying what I was thinking about the middle of this tree.

 

[logan3]

Seems like bunjin maybe the way to go this. Anyway have fun with it.

 

[GrimLore]

With a few hardcore bends that might work itself into a decent cascade...

Grimmy

 

[Paradox]

Id go with the air layering option. This tree has no taper at all. Both areas with the branches could be made into cascade trees.

 

[Camo252]

The branches left on the tree at the moment were the main branches, up through the middle section it was all very thin, just needles coming off the branch for the most part

Seems like Air Layering seems to be the popular opinion for this tree. Will have to a long hard think on it

Any thoughts on where too air layer it? Like maybe above the bottom branches? Turning the bottom tree into a shohin and the top into...a literati or whatever seems suitable?

Thanks

 

[twisted trees]

Not for nuthin but as an admitted newbie trying a literati is like trying to paint the Sistine Chapel after one art class. There is a lot more to a good literati than no taper and a couple of branches. There is a very nice shohin lurking in the bottom of that tree and attempting an air layer of the top can give you two nice trees for the price of one rather than one tree that might not be a satisfying as you think. Good growing dude.

 

[Adair M]

I'm going to make a couple of comments here to help aid you in your study of bonsai. And hopefully will help guide you and other beginners...

All too often, someone new to bonsai buys a piece of material that's too tall and skinny, gets it home and "can't see the bonsai" and then decides to make a "literati" out of it.

These rarely turn out well.

Literati should depict old trees that are in the last years of life, weathered by storms, and depict hardships, past trauma, and survival. Yes, usually they have thin trunks. But thin trunks with great aged bark, snags and jin, maybe some shari, lots of subtle curves and movement that depict the years (decades) of the struggle the tree has endured to survive.

Your young juniper only has a tall skinny straight trunk.

Now that you're insulted (and that was NOT my intention), I do think that airlayering the top would be a worthwhile exercise. For the learning of how to do airlayering.

Once you cut the long trunk off, you just might have something with the bottom section. See if you can find a new leader down there. By cutting that long skinny trunk off, you've started to develop taper.

Ok... next seek out a mentor. Maybe there's a club in your area. That's a great start. or maybe there's a professional bonsai artist nearby where you can take classes. Sometimes there are experienced enthusiasts who will help a beginner get started on the right path.

Bonsai is a "hands on" experience. It's hard to learn from books and pictures. Videos are better, but working hands on with bonsai is the best way to learn.

Good luck, and welcome to the addiction. I've been doing bonsai 40 years. Seek out expert instruction. It's the best "investment" in the hobby.

 

[Camo252]

Not for nuthin but as an admitted newbie trying a literati is like trying to paint the Sistine Chapel after one art class. There is a lot more to a good literati than no taper and a couple of branches. There is a very nice shohin lurking in the bottom of that tree and attempting an air layer of the top can give you two nice trees for the price of one rather than one tree that might not be a satisfying as you think. Good growing dude.

I'm going to make a couple of comments here to help aid you in your study of bonsai. And hopefully will help guide you and other beginners...

All too often, someone new to bonsai buys a piece of material that's too tall and skinny, gets it home and "can't see the bonsai" and then decides to make a "literati" out of it.

These rarely turn out well.

Literati should depict old trees that are in the last years of life, weathered by storms, and depict hardships, past trauma, and survival. Yes, usually they have thin trunks. But thin trunks with great aged bark, snags and jin, maybe some shari, lots of subtle curves and movement that depict the years (decades) of the struggle the tree has endured to survive.

Your young juniper only has a tall skinny straight trunk.

Now that you're insulted (and that was NOT my intention), I do think that airlayering the top would be a worthwhile exercise. For the learning of how to do airlayering.

Once you cut the long trunk off, you just might have something with the bottom section. See if you can find a new leader down there. By cutting that long skinny trunk off, you've started to develop taper.

Ok... next seek out a mentor. Maybe there's a club in your area. That's a great start. or maybe there's a professional bonsai artist nearby where you can take classes. Sometimes there are experienced enthusiasts who will help a beginner get started on the right path.

Bonsai is a "hands on" experience. It's hard to learn from books and pictures. Videos are better, but working hands on with bonsai is the best way to learn.

Good luck, and welcome to the addiction. I've been doing bonsai 40 years. Seek out expert instruction. It's the best "investment" in the hobby.

You two do bring up a good point, and I wasn't insulted at all Adair M. You really did hit the nail on the head though, thats exactly what I did. I ordered the tree online(so I couldn't inspect it before buying) arrived in the mail the next day and gave it a trim only to find that it was a tall skinny tree lacking branches in the middle. So I decided it would be a literati, because that was the only style I could see. Thankfully the internet being the wonderful place that it is, you lot pointed me in the right direction.

So I'll have a good read on doing an air layer and have a crack at it when I can.

In regards to a mentor/club, We do have a club in town that meets once a month, that I do plan on going to, but my experience with clubs(astronomy and scale modeling) is that i go a few times, then things start getting too busy with life, work and what not, and I stop going even though my interest in the hobbies is still there.

 

[edprocoat]

Just to throw it out there, you could easily wrap the trunk with raffia and wire it then bend the top down and around. Good practise too and there could be a nice style in there too.

ed

 

[Adair M]

Use the club to find the mentor.

 

[YukiShiro]

Can he maybe use the upper trunk as a kind of sacrifice branch to help thicken up the trunk before he chops it down to a new leader? I'm of opinion that there is a nice smaller tree hidden in the bottom part, but only if he manages to get some girth going at the bottom.

regards
Herman

 

[Adair M]

Not a bad idea, Herman, but most newbies want a bonsai tree in a pot, not a growing project in the ground.

As an aside, I think there is some value (educational) for a newbie for buying a finished tree, PROVIDING they can take care of it. That is, keep it healthy and alive. For example, I recently purchased a JWP that was recently styled and wired by Peter Tea. Peter and I are both students of Boon, but Peter has far more training since he served as an apprentice in Japan. But we share similar fundamentals of wiring technique. Anyway, I find it interesting to study how he wired the tree, since it was done "professionally".

The nuances: what gauge wire, which two branches were wired together, how he spliced, and crossed wires, etc. are very interesting to me. Peter has worked on trees of the highest quality in Japan, so he knows his stuff. Having an example of his wiring allows me to compare my efforts to see if my wiring is done as well as his.

(I would say my wiring is getting close, but Peter is MUCH faster!)

Sorry to stray off topic.

 

[YukiShiro]

Not a bad idea, Herman, but most newbies want a bonsai tree in a pot, not a growing project in the ground.

True, I've made that mistake as well, when i started out doing bonsai back in 2004. i don't think you strayed too far off topic...you hinted at a lot of ways he can learn better ways of doing certain things...much relevant to a guy/gal freshly starting out.

@Camo - believe me trial and error only gets you so far. It's really important to get a mentor, your learning curve will be so much higher than a guy who tries to teach himself. Michael Hagedorn was in South Africa for the IBC convention, I only had a chance to work with him in one workshop for 4 hours with 8 other people, it made the world of a difference, i learnt more in that workshop from Michael than i did since i've started doing bonsai, it's well worth the effort and money...

haha Adair..I'd figure that working under a Japanese master as his apprentice will give you more than enough practice to be able to wire a tree with closed eyes and one hand tied behind your back

regards
Herman

 

[Camo252]

Hey everyone,

As I mentioned in Chinese Elm thread, I haven't given up Bonsai, I just haven't really had a chance to do much lately as my Dad past away at the beginning of the month after a 9 month battle with Brain Cancer.

Anyway. I finally worked up the nerve and got around to starting the Air Layer on this Juniper. My plan for the top half is too turn it into a semi cascade, hopefully. I Took the bark off the area i'm working, around an inch long, and took it back to the wood where it wasn't so white and a bit more darker. Applied some Rooting Hormone, covered in premoistened peat moss, wrapped some clear plastic around it, then some dark plastic. If the air layer doesn't take will it kill the top half of the tree? or will the cut area just grow over?

Here are some photos. Mostly bad photos at that.

 

[Vance Wood]

Sorry about the loss of your father, that can be a game changer that takes a while to get over. What you have done is a good idea and it should work. As to having killed the upper portion of the tree is impossible to tell not knowing the exact details of how you did what you did.