NEWBIES......please read

greerhw

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If this doesn't start a firestorm, nothing wiill.........

NEWBIES, if you don't have a 100 bucks to spend, do not get into bonsai !

Reasons:

1. You need some decent material to start with. not expensive but something with potential.

2. You will need some good bonsai soil (very important)

3. You will need a bonsai pot.

4. You will need some fertilizer.

5. You will need a cheap sheet of plastic mesh from Hobby Lobby

6, You will need some good wire, either copper or alumimum, depending on what speices of material you buy.

7. You will need some basic bonsai tools, don't buy the cheapest, buy in the middle range and they will last you the rest of you life.

Sorry if I forgot anything.

DISCLAIMER:
What I'm telling you is the TRUTH as I know it to be, others will disagree, some may even agree, although I doubt it. But I will promise you this, you will enjoy the hobby a lot more than a Home Depot stick and using you wife's best sewing scissors.

Ciao,
Harry
 
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Smoke

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Harry, you spelled scissors wrong you dill bag.









sits back to see what Harry says about my own splelling
 

Cali-Mike

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you forgot....call someone and pay them to trim, style, buy, and train your trees. My god Harry, i sit and read some of your cr@p, and wonder who decided you have any right to give an opinion on some newbee's tree? Do you call Marco, and pay for his opinion before you tell some guy his tree is junk?
I've not posted here because it's "battle bonsai" on here, but god Harry, are you really that arrogant, and self centered to post one of the trees, you pay someone to do, and say anything about you being "serious" about this art? There's a lot of good ideas here, and a lot of junk in between. Harry, in my humble, non-master, opinion you are with out a doubt the worst.

I'll go back to lurking now. ...


Mike
 

greerhw

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Harry, you spelled scissors wrong you dill bag.









sits back to see what Harry says about my own splelling
No I don't think so, check again.

Harry
 

greerhw

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you forgot....call someone and pay them to trim, style, buy, and train your trees. My god Harry, i sit and read some of your cr@p, and wonder who decided you have any right to give an opinion on some newbee's tree? Do you call Marco, and pay for his opinion before you tell some guy his tree is junk?
I've not posted here because it's "battle bonsai" on here, but god Harry, are you really that arrogant, and self centered to post one of the trees, you pay someone to do, and say anything about you being "serious" about this art? There's a lot of good ideas here, and a lot of junk in between. Harry, in my humble, non-master, opinion you are with out a doubt the worst.

I'll go back to lurking now. ...

Mike
Wow, I'm glad you just lurk.........just for the record, I choose and buy my own trees, guilty on all the other counts, except calling Marco for opinions, international calls are too expensive.

Have a good evening,
Harry
 
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greerhw

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Just one thing Cali-Mike

I have two dogs and I mow my own lawn, I don't work at the sewage treatment plant, but I can recognize a pile of shit when I see it.......

Harry, the arrogant bastard offering advice I'm not qualified to offer.........
 
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Smoke

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Wow, Fresno CA is a tough town.

Fresno...home to Al Keppler, Cali-Mike and Ripsgreentree.


BTW I'll be posting a pic of Ripsgreentree at the Kazari this weekend with his vendor booth full of trees for sale.
 

daniel

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Someone posted over on another thread that a true master looks for material in all places, not only purpose-grown trees. Just a thought. The end purpose is to enjoy one's self. Some may get their jollies at Home Depot, some from stumps in squat pots, some from collecting finished trees. Me? I'm all three. I just enjoy the hobby.

To each his own, said the old maid as she kissed the cow...
 

greerhw

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Someone posted over on another thread that a true master looks for material in all places, not only purpose-grown trees. Just a thought. The end purpose is to enjoy one's self. Some may get their jollies at Home Depot, some from stumps in squat pots, some from collecting finished trees. Me? I'm all three. I just enjoy the hobby.

To each his own, said the old maid as she kissed the cow...
Good attitude, I'm just trying to jump start the newbies and let them know what they will need to get started in the right direction. Buying a plant doesn't come with all the other parts to create a bonsai.

Harry
 

Bonsai Nut

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I disagree! You need at least $1,000 :)

$100 is not a lot of money. Put differently, a ficus at Home Depot is going to set you back $60. Unless you live in a rural part of the country with access to yamadori, you are going to need to buy pre-bonsai that starts at $100 and goes up quickly from there. Small finished bonsai of any worth are going to cost at least $200 for a needle juniper or shimpaku, with black pines starting at $500... etc, etc.

However, I have to say that bonsai, if you approach the hobby modestly, is one of the cheaper past-times you can have. Once you get set up with some tools, books and trees, it really doesn't cost that much. Compare it to golf, scuba-diving, skiing, or for that matter, boating or even aquarium keeping, and it is cheaper by a mile. Of course, you can always start out buying $1,000+ trees, but that is the case with any hobby - the high end can get very very high.

And it doesn't cost much to attend exhibits, hang out with bonsai club friends, and visit others' bonsai collections and talk trees.

Best of all - bonsai forums are FREE! :)
 

greerhw

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I disagree! You need at least $1,000 :)

$100 is not a lot of money. Put differently, a ficus at Home Depot is going to set you back $60. Unless you live in a rural part of the country with access to yamadori, you are going to need to buy pre-bonsai that starts at $100 and goes up quickly from there. Small finished bonsai of any worth are going to cost at least $200 for a needle juniper or shimpaku, with black pines starting at $500... etc, etc.

However, I have to say that bonsai, if you approach the hobby modestly, is one of the cheaper past-times you can have. Once you get set up with some tools, books and trees, it really doesn't cost that much. Compare it to golf, scuba-diving, skiing, or for that matter, boating or even aquarium keeping, and it is cheaper by a mile. Of course, you can always start out buying $1,000+ trees, but that is the case with any hobby - the high end can get very very high.

And it doesn't cost much to attend exhibits, hang out with bonsai club friends, and visit others' bonsai collections and talk trees.

Best of all - bonsai forums are FREE! :)
There is a nursery near me that sells staked green mounds for 30 bucks up, you can get a nice 35" one for 40 bucks, you can't start with any better material than that.

Ciao,
Harry
 

milehigh_7

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If this doesn't start a firestorm, nothing wiill.........

NEWBIES, if you don't have a 100 bucks to spend, do not get into bonsai !

Reasons:

1. You need some decent material to start with. not expensive but something with potential.

2. You will need some good bonsai soil (very important)

3. You will need a bonsai pot.

4. You will need some fertilizer.

5. You will need a cheap sheet of plastic mesh from Hobby Lobby

6, You will need some good wire, either copper or alumimum, depending on what speices of material you buy.

7. You will need some basic bonsai tools, don't buy the cheapest, buy in the middle range and they will last you the rest of you life.

Sorry if I forgot anything.

DISCLAIMER:
What I'm telling you is the TRUTH as I know it to be, others will disagree, some may even agree, although I doubt it. But I will promise you this, you will enjoy the hobby a lot more than a Home Depot stick and using you wife's best sewing scissors.

Ciao,
Harry

:rolleyes: Wow Harry, aren't you the emperor strutting around in his new clothes. :rolleyes:
 

Mortalis

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If this doesn't start a firestorm, nothing wiill.........

NEWBIES, if you don't have a 100 bucks to spend, do not get into bonsai !

Ciao,
Harry
Actually Harry I enjoyed Bonsai very much playing around with sticks for several years.
Really I would suggest the other way around don't start with anything with any potential.

Start enjoying Bonsai with that stick in a pot or Bonsai from Lowes. Dont buy a tree for more than $20. Do get some decent bonsai soil or better mix it yourself. As you get to where your keeping that Lowes tree alive and happy for around a year then buy some tools and wire. When you have chopped and wired that one to death buy another one and go easy on it this time.. he he. Now once you have your first few stick in a pot trees happy healthy and growing for around a year. Kill any that don't have any potential and replace them with a piece of stock you have been saving $15 a week for the last two years. Now you have learned enough to not obliterate it.
 

Dwight

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I still consider vmyself a neub and I've basically tossed all the crap I bought at Lowes , etc and gone out and spent a few dollars ( up to $300 ) for some decent prebonsai from reputable bonsai nurseries. Guess when I started really enjoying my little trees. When I got something I c ould actually compare to what I thought a bonsai was. Now maybe I've spent too long lurking on the sidelines and become jaded with sticks in pots ( I've been a bonsai fan since I saw my first one in person back in the early 70's in LA ). I can't pick out good or even decent stock at Lowes , etc but when all the trash is removed and most of what I'm looking at is decent to good stock I'm able to actually choose something I can work with. Maybe being over 60 makes a difference but I still believe only a master can make a silk purse outa a cows ear.

I'm still kinda cheap ( teachers pension and all ) but I've found that if one buys the best stock you're willing to kill 1) it will be harder to kill , 2) it will look much more like a bonsai and 3) it will be much easier to learn on. I don't care what " hobby " you have going cheap always produce cheap.

PS Harry , your clothes look fine from here , Sire
 

JasonG

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LOL, Harry you never cease to amaze me.....but when it comes to bonsai related issues and topics most of the time you are right on. It is your direct approach and in your face honesty that seems to really bother, baffle or knock people off their feet. I like it personally.

I think if you are just starting out in bonsai you shouldn't start with $1000 material, but I say you should start with the best material you can afford. If that is $100 then so be it, if that is $500 then that is great too.

Here is the problem with sticks in pots, Home Depot stuff, and regular nursery stuff....there rarely is in any promise in this that will show results in short period of time that will result in learning. Lets say you buy a $10 mugo from home depot, you are going to hack it up (more than likely killing it) but now you are at least a few years away from any type of results that will A) look like a bonsai B) yield anything to learn from and C) by this time you will have learned and grew much beyond the stock that you started with. That is if you are serious about having a killer or the best collection you can have.

The flip side of this is you buy a collected tree (Without a doubt the most desirable material) for $100-$300 and get a good start with natural shari, nice bark(way better than nursery bark), thicker trunk, movement and a much more promising future as bonsai. Lets say for a minute that it isn't collected material but material with a future trained as bonsai. Not crap material.
The amount of learning to be done on a tree with potential and a good future in bonsai is 1000X greater then the amount of learning to be had on a stick in a pot, a tree from a box store and regular nursery material. Sorry, but its the truth.\

People like Harry are worth their weight in gold for the bonsai community. It is people like Harry who keep the professional bonsai artist earning money and keeping a job, it is people like Harry who elevate the bar in American bonsai, it is people like Harry who enjoy bonsai, thier role in bonsai and readily admit that they love to look at bonsai but pay someone to do the majority of the work. What gets me is when people can't see this. We need more people like him through out the country. If you dont like Harry then here is a challange.... buy a better tree then him, create something better than what he has, but you have to respect him for his role in our hobby and his dedication to bonsai that keeps the pro working.

Just a couple random thoughts..... :D
 

TheSteve

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For years I did the nursery crawling, trying to make a good tree out of crap etc. In the last couple I've stepped up the material I work with and feel that I'm learning all over again. It's basically starting over. All of a sudden the things you've read, heard, whatever makes sense because the tree you're working on offers the potential to do it. Really unless you want to make a procumbens cascade (got em) you'll spend a lifetime trying to find trees that will really pop and offer you the chance to make trees that people stop to look at. I also agree with Harry "buying his way to great trees." It's quite common in Japan for bonsai owners to hire out their tree work. You don't really think bonsai masters make a living working on their own trees do you? Without guys like Harry American masters might as well leave and then come over here to do demo's like the majority of them already do. They need their market too.
 

greerhw

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LOL, Harry you never cease to amaze me.....but when it comes to bonsai related issues and topics most of the time you are right on. It is your direct approach and in your face honesty that seems to really bother, baffle or knock people off their feet. I like it personally.

I think if you are just starting out in bonsai you shouldn't start with $1000 material, but I say you should start with the best material you can afford. If that is $100 then so be it, if that is $500 then that is great too.

Here is the problem with sticks in pots, Home Depot stuff, and regular nursery stuff....there rarely is in any promise in this that will show results in short period of time that will result in learning. Lets say you buy a $10 mugo from home depot, you are going to hack it up (more than likely killing it) but now you are at least a few years away from any type of results that will A) look like a bonsai B) yield anything to learn from and C) by this time you will have learned and grew much beyond the stock that you started with. That is if you are serious about having a killer or the best collection you can have.


The flip side of this is you buy a collected tree (Without a doubt the most desirable material) for $100-$300 and get a good start with natural shari, nice bark(way better than nursery bark), thicker trunk, movement and a much more promising future as bonsai. Lets say for a minute that it isn't collected material but material with a future trained as bonsai. Not crap material.
The amount of learning to be done on a tree with potential and a good future in bonsai is 1000X greater then the amount of learning to be had on a stick in a pot, a tree from a box store and regular nursery material. Sorry, but its the truth.\

People like Harry are worth their weight in gold for the bonsai community. It is people like Harry who keep the professional bonsai artist earning money and keeping a job, it is people like Harry who elevate the bar in American bonsai, it is people like Harry who enjoy bonsai, thier role in bonsai and readily admit that they love to look at bonsai but pay someone to do the majority of the work. What gets me is when people can't see this. We need more people like him through out the country. If you dont like Harry then here is a challange.... buy a better tree then him, create something better than what he has, but you have to respect him for his role in our hobby and his dedication to bonsai that keeps the pro working.

Just a couple random thoughts..... :D
Aw shucks, now I'm blushing.............:eek:

Harry
 
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