NEWBIES..some advice

greerhw

Omono
Messages
1,978
Reaction score
10
The following is solely my advice, Harry Greer,COLLECTOR, not stylist, artist or bonsai master.

YEAR 1:
Start with something you can enjoy and is easy to take care to begin with.This little plant I bought at my local nursury. It's a dwarf elm, it's a deciduous tree, meaning the leaves will fall off in the winter.It's to late here in my climate to pot it this year. So I will leave it alone and just fertilize and water it this year, and do a little maintenance this growing season. These little trees grow like weeds and will need to be pruned often, using the clip and grow method. All that means is to cut off any new growth (leaves) I don't want on the tree. You need to keep the foliage small on this size tree, so the the foliage doesn't get to large for the trunk diameter.In order to do that you will need a good set of scissors.
YEAR 2:
I will want to pot this tree next spring in a nice ceramic pot, I will need some plastic mest to cover the hole in the bottom of the pot to keep the soil from washing away, for this you will need some alumunum wire to hold the mesh in place, the wire will be used to secure the tree in the pot later and can also be used to wire any small branches on the tree.
When you prepare the tree for potting, you will need to remove some of the soil and roots. Using any kind of scissors for this job. Cut the root ball as flat as possible on the bottom so that when you set the tree in the empty pot the top of the soil surgace is about 3/8" from the top of the pot. Next cut the diameter of the root ball about an inch smaller diameter than the inside of the pot to allow for the new bonsai soil to fit. Place the bonsai soil in the bottom first tp bring the top of the soil on the tree to about an 1/8" below the rim of the pot. Next we will be securing the tree in the pot ( we can discuss this next year).Once the tree is secure fill the remaining space with your bonsai soil. use a chop stick to help compact the soil as much as possible , so that you don't have any air pockets. Once that is done, you need to place some sphagnum moss on the top of the soil to help keep the roots moist, but not wet. These small trees tend to dry out very fast and depending on your climate it may need watering once or twice a day.

Material List:
1. Plant..................14.95
2. scissors...............24.95
3. sphagnum moss.....2.50
4. plastic mesh..........3 for a dollar at any craft store
5. Aluminum Wire........6.00
6. Bonsai soil.................8.00
7. Fertilizer.................5.00
8. Bonsai pot...............10.00
Total.........72.40 not including local sales tax or shipping
 

Attachments

Last edited:

greerhw

Omono
Messages
1,978
Reaction score
10
Page 2......

I prefer Azalea scissors rather than shears, they are easier to work with, the shears seem to be a little clumsy for small work. And last but not least pick out a nice little round pot, almost any color will go with tree. Instant bonsai fun in one year, not ten years.
Ciao,
Harry
 

Attachments

milehigh_7

Mister 500,000
Messages
4,581
Reaction score
5,306
Location
Chandler, AZ
USDA Zone
Hot
Sounds good Harry! Maybe I will give it a try. This makes it sound very doable and is even encouraging! Nice work. :D

--The above is not sarcastic in the least. There is a different tone to this post, at least to my eyes.
 

agraham

Shohin
Messages
276
Reaction score
31
Location
South Texas
USDA Zone
9
Buy two of the little trees.That gets you up to the $100.00 Harry spoke of in another post.Transplant into a larger pot.Trim occasionally.

Or, buy 3 or 4 and don't buy the fancy bonsai soil,bonsai pot,scissors,plastic mesh,etc. until next spring when you will need it.Maybe you'll get lucky and get some of it for Christmas:D.

I agree about the azalea and/or bud trimmers...much easier to work with than those "bonsai shears"...especially on smaller trees.


Andy
 

greerhw

Omono
Messages
1,978
Reaction score
10
Ok, I've tossed down the gauntlet to all my critics to prove my point.The arrogant, uncivil, bull shitter, weak, pathetic, martyr bastard posted someting worthwhile. Lets see something of value you can offer the board, especially to the newbies.

Harry
 
Last edited:

milehigh_7

Mister 500,000
Messages
4,581
Reaction score
5,306
Location
Chandler, AZ
USDA Zone
Hot
Ok, I've tossed down the gauntlet to all my critics to prove my point.The arrogant, uncivil, bull shitter, weak, pathetic, martyr bastard posted someting worthwhile. Lets see something of value you can offer the board, especially to the newbies.

Harry
Yes you did Harry and I gave you props for it.

PS: I never called you bastard ;)
 

greerhw

Omono
Messages
1,978
Reaction score
10
How about you Cali-Mike or agraham any input with some examples, or you better at shooting off you mouth than you are at bonsai. One more thing newbies do your research or ask questions here before you buy. Do not buy anything that is difficult to style or maintain, no matter how CHEAP, you will be sorry.

Ciao,
Harry
 
Last edited:

Cali-Mike

Seedling
Messages
20
Reaction score
0
Location
Fresno Ca.
Sorry Harry, I was at a bonsai exhibit here in Calif....Ok for the newbees.....

1. I suggest you start with juniper, or olive.(at least here in Calif.) They will take some aggresive pruning, and styling, over & under watering, and usually survive. Very hard to kill, although I've done it.
2. Join a local club, Listen & learn, and read books.
3. Use the internet. Learn how to use the "search" function. I guarantee you almost every question you have, has been asked, and documented before.
4. Read & follow Harry's post above.

Harry

First..... I don't shoot off my mouth....you do.
Second..... Your post, in my opinion, should be mandatory reading for any newbee. Maybe a "to all beginners, read this before you post" type of thing. It was excellent. WAY better than "your stick in a pot sucks, trash it".
third..... You are not just a arrogant, uncivil, bull shitting bonsia collector. Your a arrogant, uncivil, bullshitting, bonsai artist. I stand corrected.
fourth... I also never called you a bastard. But I bet you a 2K tree of yours, that many have.....
and finally, read this Harry.....IT'S NOT ABOUT THE TREES. IT'S ABOUT YOU, AND OTHERS BEING A ASS. Civility has nothing to do with how to style a cascade.......sheeesh!

Mike
 

greerhw

Omono
Messages
1,978
Reaction score
10
Sorry Harry, I was at a bonsai exhibit here in Calif....Ok for the newbees.....

1. I suggest you start with juniper, or olive.(at least here in Calif.) They will take some aggresive pruning, and styling, over & under watering, and usually survive. Very hard to kill, although I've done it.
2. Join a local club, Listen & learn, and read books.
3. Use the internet. Learn how to use the "search" function. I guarantee you almost every question you have, has been asked, and documented before.
4. Read & follow Harry's post above.

Harry

First..... I don't shoot off my mouth....you do.
Second..... Your post, in my opinion, should be mandatory reading for any newbee. Maybe a "to all beginners, read this before you post" type of thing. It was excellent. WAY better than "your stick in a pot sucks, trash it".
third..... You are not just a arrogant, uncivil, bull shitting bonsia collector. Your a arrogant, uncivil, bullshitting, bonsai artist. I stand corrected.
fourth... I also never called you a bastard. But I bet you a 2K tree of yours, that many have.....
and finally, read this Harry.....IT'S NOT ABOUT THE TREES. IT'S ABOUT YOU, AND OTHERS BEING A ASS. Civility has nothing to do with how to style a cascade.......sheeesh!

Mike
Everything I post is about the trees, I don't need any attta boys, I try to save the newbies time and money. If it takes an ASS to get message across above the sugar coated comments, then I am willing to take the ASS approach. It's the hobby and bringing new folks into the hobby to stay, call me what you want, I don't give a shit. I want people to enjoy this relaxing, rewarding hobby and saving them a few years of frustration and even keeping them in the hobby. is the important thing. If money is short in your budget for a hobby, I want you to do something that is rewarding and gives you a since of accomplishment and pride without all the heartache I went through to get where I am. Please listen to me and I will save you time and money and make the hobby more fun for you. Otherwise listen to the Home Depot folks, it really doesn't matter to me.

Good luck, and enjoy you're hobby,
Ciao,
harry
 

Thomas J.

Chumono
Messages
507
Reaction score
1,015
Location
DFW area
USDA Zone
7
I'm not a critic of Harrys, but if I may I'd like to offer a few samples of low budget bonsai that hopefully will inspire some newbies. Aside from the low cost, all that will be needed is some time, which we all know can be more precious than money when it come to bonsai.:D

This first sample I've posted many times on other forums because it came out so good and only set me back $6.98 plus tax. It's a common procumbens juniper seen at almost all nurseries. But this one took some time to get from the first pic to the second, about seven years in all. I still have this tree ( 11 yrs now) and it looks just as good, especially since I now have it in a smaller pot. But as I said, time is the factor here, something the newbies will have to see as a virtue.;)
 

Attachments

Thomas J.

Chumono
Messages
507
Reaction score
1,015
Location
DFW area
USDA Zone
7
This second one is also a procumbens, but a bit older and had more potential when I bought it. I paid $40 for this one at a vendors area during a Kimura convention. there's three years from pic one to pic two. After I did the initial chopping for the style, it took that amount of time to get it there.
 

Attachments

Thomas J.

Chumono
Messages
507
Reaction score
1,015
Location
DFW area
USDA Zone
7
This final one is a $10 cedar elm I picked up at a nursery. Heck you can find these growing anywhere here in the south. I bought it because I instantly saw what I could do with it. The styling was almost instant, and I took a pic with a virtual pot that I thought would work rather well after I repotted.

So there you have it. No need not to get out there and do something about those couple of bucks you have set aside for bonsai you newbies. As for those with the big bucks, keep buying those JBPs.:D
 

Attachments

greerhw

Omono
Messages
1,978
Reaction score
10
I'm not a critic of Harrys, but if I may I'd like to offer a few samples of low budget bonsai that hopefully will inspire some newbies. Aside from the low cost, all that will be needed is some time, which we all know can be more precious than money when it come to bonsai.:D

This first sample I've posted many times on other forums because it came out so good and only set me back $6.98 plus tax. It's a common procumbens juniper seen at almost all nurseries. But this one took some time to get from the first pic to the second, about seven years in all. I still have this tree ( 11 yrs now) and it looks just as good, especially since I now have it in a smaller pot. But as I said, time is the factor here, something the newbies will have to see as a virtue.;)
Beautiful trees Thomas, thanks for posting, junipers they are the best bet for newbies, it is hard to screw one up, if you have time, time is on your side ,they will recover. Thomas made a beautiful bonsai in 11 years. You can buy an expensive staked one and save yourself time if you are my age. Junipers are the absolute best starter trees you can buy. My opinion only , check with others in you local, maybe something is better for you. Thanks Thomas, very nice tree.

Ciao,
Harry
 
Last edited:

Cali-Mike

Seedling
Messages
20
Reaction score
0
Location
Fresno Ca.
Good god Harry, let it die........

I wasn't giving you any atta boys. I was being civil. If I would have posted what I was thinking,... (wooopeee, Harry copied 2 whole paragraphs out of some beginners bonsai book) that would have been rude and I was not brought up that way. See the difference Harry? But if you insist.........How in the hell does you being an ass, KEEP newbies in the hobby??? Nobody wants to be treated like an idiot, because they are new. How does that help them out?!?!?! What if money is short for some new guy? Telling him to go take up something cheaper is a good thing?? You think that makes him feel good about himself?? You really think being an ass is helpfull?? My god, your amazing. 99% of the people have tried to do, or have done what Thomas has accomplished. Thomas, well done! Junipers ARE the best plants to start with. ( I wonder where Harry heard that?) To anybody else who has spent time reading this garbage, I apologize.

I've been having a battle of wits, with an un armed man.

Mike
 

milehigh_7

Mister 500,000
Messages
4,581
Reaction score
5,306
Location
Chandler, AZ
USDA Zone
Hot
Everything I post is about the trees, I don't need any attta boys, I try to save the newbies time and money. If it takes an ASS to get message across above the sugar coated comments, then I am willing to take the ASS approach. It's the hobby and bringing new folks into the hobby to stay, call me what you want, I don't give a shit. I want people to enjoy this relaxing, rewarding hobby and saving them a few years of frustration and even keeping them in the hobby. is the important thing. If money is short in your budget for a hobby, I want you to do something that is rewarding and gives you a since of accomplishment and pride without all the heartache I went through to get where I am. Please listen to me and I will save you time and money and make the hobby more fun for you. Otherwise listen to the Home Depot folks, it really doesn't matter to me.

Good luck, and enjoy you're hobby,
Ciao,
harry

Harry,

Thank you for proving my point from an earlier thread. HOW you say things is at least as important as WHAT you say.

The point is your delivery. You said basically the same thing in both threads but in VERY different ways. One was actually effective, (this one) the other was not. What Cali-Mike and I are doing is providing constructive feedback. If you are interested in helping newbies, then hear us when we say that just changing the way you gave the same advice made all the difference.

You said, "If it takes an ASS to get message across above the sugar coated comments, then I am willing to take the ASS approach." What it seems you still don't get is that, "the Ass approach" was useless, no it was less than useless. That type of attitude was and is damaging.

You say, "It's the hobby and bringing new folks into the hobby to stay...". This is an excellent goal. If is truly what you want, than just listen.

If technique and tools matter in bonsai, why would you think these same things do not matter in communication? The tools of communication are understanding what means are most effective to communicate a message. Further, you must be able to gauge how your style is received and modify it if needed. Then you must be able to deliver your message in a way that leaves your hearers or readers feeling motivated to follow your advice.

Now that you have proven that you are able to communicate without making people want to take a road trip to Oklahoma and backhand you, please continue the positive road you begun with this thread.
 
Last edited:

greerhw

Omono
Messages
1,978
Reaction score
10
Harry,

Thank you for proving my point from an earlier thread. HOW you say things is at least as important as WHAT you say.

The point is your delivery. You said basically the same thing in both threads but in VERY different ways. One was actually effective, (this one) the other was not. What Cali-Mike and I are doing is providing constructive feedback. If you are interested in helping newbies, then hear us when we say that just changing the way you gave the same advice made all the difference.

You said, "If it takes an ASS to get message across above the sugar coated comments, then I am willing to take the ASS approach." What it seems you still don't get is that, "the Ass approach" was useless, no it was less than useless. That type of attitude was and is damaging.

You say, "It's the hobby and bringing new folks into the hobby to stay...". This is an excellent goal. If is truly what you want, than just listen.

If technique and tools matter in bonsai, why would you think these same things do not matter in communication? The tools of communication are understanding what means are most effective to communicate a message. Further, you must be able to gauge how your style is received and modify it if needed. Then you must be able to deliver your message in a way that leaves your hearers or readers feeling motivated to follow your advice.

Now that you have proven that you are able to communicate without making people want to take a road trip to Oklahoma and backhand you, please continue the positive road you begun with this thread.

Sorry fellas, like Ron White says "you can't fix stupid", please put me on your ignore list , I don't want anyone having a stroke on my account. Cali-Mike, everything I've learned is from a bonsai master and not the internet. If you don't mind, please show me and the rest of the bonsai nut board some of your bonsai accomplishments. I am excited to see some home grown masterpieces, I love American ingenuity above everything else.

Regards,
Harry






























































mike
 

Cali-Mike

Seedling
Messages
20
Reaction score
0
Location
Fresno Ca.
Harry, we finally agree.....You can't fix stupid. Maybe you could get someone to read the following line to you Its NOT about trees, mine, yours or anyones, it's about being a rude, arrogant ass!.
Maybe someone here can explain it to you. Maybe you could take a class, or something, or have your master read it for you.
I would not waste a second showing you my trees Harry, but I would love to show them to Marco, I hear he's really good. Your an amazing guy.....

Mike
 

greerhw

Omono
Messages
1,978
Reaction score
10
Harry, we finally agree.....You can't fix stupid. Maybe you could get someone to read the following line to you Its NOT about trees, mine, yours or anyones, it's about being a rude, arrogant ass!.
Maybe someone here can explain it to you. Maybe you could take a class, or something, or have your master read it for you.
I would not waste a second showing you my trees Harry, but I would love to show them to Marco, I hear he's really good. Your an amazing guy.....

Mike


Accomplishments talk, bullshit walks, lets see some trees, collected, bought, grown for seed, traded for or stolen, I would like to see where your coming from, otherwise you're a fraud.

Ciao, Harry
 

greerhw

Omono
Messages
1,978
Reaction score
10
Did you ever hear of a baseball player named Dizzy Dean, he was a pitcher. He once said it ain't bragging if you can do it, it becomes fact.

Ciao,
Harry
 
Top Bottom