Not getting ample growth, other newbie problems

zanna5910

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I'm new to bonsai, but am always reading and learning. I make mistakes and learn, I've killed some nursery stuff (whoops) and am mainly in a stage where I want to get the basics (growing, repotting, pruning) down before purchasing anything really nice. I have probably 15-20 plants, most all pre-bonsai, with a few things I've picked up at a nursery to try layering and some pruning and whatnot as I experiment. A few are in little bonsai training pots and some in 6" nursery type pots, some nursery stuff is still in the 3-5 gallon cans. They are in a mix of basically pine bark, turface, poultry grit, and haydite. I try to water every day, if the soil when I stick my finger in is not moist. I added some poultry fertilizer at the beginning of the spring, and have use dynagro once since then. I keep them outside where they get sun from ~8am-1 or 2pm

I see these blog posts of people with trident maples that explode with 3 feet of growth and trim back in like one season. I know all species grow at different rates, but it seems a bunch of my pre-bonsai that I bought last season just aren't growing like that. They, for the most part are all green, but just dont grow out any.

For instance, I have a 2yo trident maple, all the leaves burst in early spring, are still good and green, but there is no branch growth happening, not last year or this year really. Its really the same size as last year, after the buds popped none of the branches are really extending (trying to fatten the trunk). I had it in a 6" pot until this spring and repotted into basically a makeshift 5 gallon pot that it cut down to like 3 inches, kinda like a grow box. When I pulled it out of the 6" pot, it had roots everywhere, growing really strong.

I also have a few shimpaku that all seem to not have changed size in a whole year. Something just doesn't seem right.

If you made it this far, thanks! I will be happy to take pics to help sort out anything (at work right now). If you're feeling adventurous to read my other random problems to help out, that would be awesome too.

1. One of the shimpaku, when i water it, the water sits on the surface for a bit before soaking in, all the other pots just immediately soak up water when sprinkled on. What's up with this?
2. One of my shimpaku has a few dark brown tips. What does this mean? Is it okay?
3. I have a japanese red maple, it budded this spring, but the leaves wilted away. I knew this wasn't right so I lifted it from the pot and it didn't have hardly any roots. Does this sound like root rot? It was pretty wet at the base of the roots. I dont think I got out all the old soil when I potted it last year so there was old potting soil under the root mass. I went ahead and tried to get rid that old soil and added more bonsai soil. It's been 2 weeks since then and no new buds.

Thanks everyone for the help, its a bit daunting to sort thru all the info online to get what you need, sometimes you just gotta ask for help!
 

Eric Group

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The Trident is probably fine, and should take off once the roots stretch out a bit, but if you want rapid expansion, put it in the ground... Next Spring.

The Shimpaku- probably a root issue, hard to tell though. Spider Mites is the other most common cause of crispy brown Shimpaku growth it seems. Have you checked for spider Mites?

The JM looks dead. Black bark is a clear sign it is a goner. Sorry.
 

edprocoat

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If the Shimpaku that has the browning tips is the one that the pot does not drain through well its probably because the water is trapped somewhere in the pot drowning the roots there. It may need repotted.

ed
 

zanna5910

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Thank you all for the replies. I fear the same for the jm, the bark was about that color since I got it, definitely didn't start green, maybe it was doomed from the start (I probably killed it). It needed a gentler climate anyways it seemed. This is why I'm learning on cheaper plants. I will pull up the shimpaku and check the root and possibly repot. Thanks for all the help. Much appreciated
 

Kelly

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RE spider mites ... read on the forums to check by taking a piece of white paper and holding under the tree/branch and tapping the branch fairly vigorously ... it you find tiny black/red dots on the paper and they smear reddish when you rub them = spider mites. There are many - gentle - garden sprays and cures for them. The shimp seems to have poor drainage so a repot may work .. or stick a pencil or chopstick down to the bottom of the pot creating a hole or channel for drainage and aeration. I use miracle grow for food and mix up a batch once a week - all my junipers and ficus seem to thrive on it - its not the organic or half strength "all natural" method that some recommend but the plants are growing. I also use a hydrometer to check for dryness ... 5 bucks ... and it really helps me learn when to water - you can use it to double check the weight and/or finger and chopstick method - after a while you know. I did this as even the same species in similar pots with the same soil mix seem to be more/less thirsty than those right beside them - I guess due to the root ball or health of that specific plant. Each plant is different especially if they aren't "well". When repotting - I always keep a bit of the old soil and mix it with the new to keep the "good" micro-orgasms intact from the old pot (unless you know it is diseased or has a fungus, etc.) I will make a very watery slurry of the old potting mix and use it as the initial "root set" watering after a repot trying to keep the good funghi etc. and introduce them into the new re-pot. Hope it helps.
 

zanna5910

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Thank you, great advice. It was seeming to me I was having drainage problems, seeing 2 of my problems are both drainage related and they are in the same type garden pot. Then it occurred to me, while the bench has a central drainage slot on the planks of the bench itself, the holes on the bottom of the pot are probably being covered up since there aren't legs on the bottom of the pot. I drilled some holes on the sides at the very bottom of all of these types of pots to ensure water can run out of the bottom while on the bench. Still gonna repot that Juniper though.

Kelly, thanks, I will check for the spider mites, thank you for your input. You are fertilizing once a week? I probably need to fertilize more as I am not doing this enough. I did see peter wall's blog (i think) mention 1x per 10 days assuming fast draining soil and healthy plants.
 

zanna5910

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I went ahead and repotted. Will check for spider mites as well. Here are the roots, do they look okay?
image.jpg image.jpg
 

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Eric Group

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I went ahead and repotted. Will check for spider mites as well. Here are the roots, do they look okay?
View attachment 73322 View attachment 73323
Roots look fine and healthy from the pics... Just make sure you put it in a Free draining potting medium and see how it does. Protect from harsh sun and don't fertilize much for a bit... Probably go ahead and remove the dead foliage and cross your fingers!

Good luck!
 

parhamr

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The maple looks just fine. Give it all-day full sun and moderate doses of balanced fertilizer throughout the growing season.
 

M. Frary

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The maple looks just fine. Give it all-day full sun and moderate doses of balanced fertilizer throughout the growing season.

Don't want to be giving it full sun all day in Texas. That would really shorten the growing season.
 

Kelly

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Hi again ... the roots look good. Yes, I feed or fertilize once a week summer and winter. It seems to work. The key - although I still new with bonsai's (only 3 years) is the drainage in almost all types of plants. I read an article here on these forums (can't find it now - sorry) an excellent article on fertilizer - it showed pictures of tiny root tips - the very ends - wrapped around a fertilizer granule - literally. You can burn plants with fertilizer but if the plant wants/needs food it will seek it out. Search for it. Some use slow release, some natural, some water soluble, etc. Miracle grow works for me - something balanced like 10-10-10 or 20-20-20 or at least all the numbers vs, 25-0-0 which is pure nitrogen. The watering is also important - the moisture meter really helps me ... sometimes the plant is dry on the top 1/3 (hot, windy, dry) of the plant and soaking wet below that. The moisture meter helps that as you stick it down it reads dry and then wet as the tip goes through the soil ... really helps you get a feel for when and how much to water. When its cool and cloudy the plant may not need water for another day or even two. Hope that doesn't sound condescending. The soil mix ratio is super important and there are many experts here and many threads on the topic but you could almost grow a plant in rocks if you give it the right food / sun / moisture. Watch the acidity or ph as most conifers like it slightly more acidic - slightly ... The tropicals or non conifers like a bit more organic soil mass. I am still learning but feel that if the plant has the basics - drainage - sun - water - food it will adapt to your soil if a bit inadequate. Your area counts for a lot too - a wet humid location e.g FL will need different soil and sun exposure than TX or AX so be careful when reading the forums. I also have taken my plants to the local plant experts - there is always someone at a garden place - usually mom/pop vs box store that knows what your area needs and what might be wrong with your plant. Sometimes martini's or wild sex help too - as in leave the plant alone for a while by distracting yourself ... as long as it has the basics - it will cycle through a couple brown tips or whatever and bounce back .. we all have our bad days!!! Everything in moderation ...
 

zanna5910

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Thanks kelly. I tested using a moisture meter (has scale 1-4 with 1 being dry). If I put it in freshly watered pot (where water freely drains out the bottom) a few inches in the pot it always comes back between 1 and 2. That night I checked again, same general measurement, maybe just lower. I can't ever get a wetter measurement but I did learn the soil holds moisture under the top layer better than I thought. I might be watering too much, although the measurement seems to say it's pretty freely draining.
 

Potawatomi13

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If you want a lot of growth you will also need to get your trees out of small containers. If they're not in the ground you'll need big nursery pots or boxes. The roots need to feel free to support a lot of growth.
 

zanna5910

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Well, some updates. I pinched off the brown on the shimps and am fertilizing a bit more, no more recurring brown tips.

It's been raining like crazy the last few weeks in Houston and the trident has some brown tips now, what is the culprit here?
image.jpg
 

sorce

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Lotta rain makes all the bugs hide in your trees.

I found some scale hiding the other day.

Your soil looks loose enough so I'd do a check for bugs.

Sorce
 

markyscott

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I went ahead and repotted. Will check for spider mites as well. Here are the roots, do they look okay?
View attachment 73322 View attachment 73323

Z - Sorry I didn't see your questions earlier, but I'll offer couple of (perhaps too late) thoughts:
  1. May is pretty late to repot here in Houston. I usually do my repotting in January or February. Consider doing it much earlier next year.
  2. There are few others that will understand what you mean when you say we've had a lot of rain. For a couple of week stretch I measured over 8" at my house. More coming today I think. So, although the soil you're using might be free draining, the remaining potting soil around the central core of the rootball on that juniper can make watering pretty difficult. Even when your soil dries out the potting soil can remain quite wet. I like to bare-root new junipers a bit at a time over the course of a couple of seasons to remove all the old soil. Does your trident still have potting soil around the trunk or did you barefoot it completely?
  3. Full sun is fine for tridents, pines and junipers here in Houston, but they can dry out pretty quickly in peak summer. If you see this is the case, rub some orchid moss through your coarsest soil sieve and put a 1/4" layer on top of the soil surface and water it in.
  4. Full sun is ok for japanese maples also until the temps get consistently up into the 90's. Then move it into a place where it gets protection from overhead sun. Morning and afternoon sun are fine.
  5. The pots can get pretty hot when the plants are in the full sun. I like wooden grow boxes to grow plants out - they stay much cooler than ceramic.
  6. Spider mites are insidious in Houston and shimpaku are quite susceptible. I spray them monthly with a mild insecticidal soap. Keeping the foliage dry, keeping it in the full sun, cleaning up dead foliage, etc.. can help as well.
  7. Come to a Houston Bonsai Society club meeting. Bring your tree. Lots of local growers who can help you with your trees.
Scott
 

zanna5910

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Thanks, scott.

#1. I only considered it because its been pretty mild and I didn't think I was doing it right and need to improve and learn, I probably wont do it again unless absolutely necessary.
#2. When I repotted the trident in the the "grow" dish I made, I basically bare rooted that trident and removed all the old soil I could get out, basically like that shimpaku roots you see in a post above. Those shimpaku I got the year before, and when I repotted, I didn't remove all the old soil in the root ball.
#6. Will make sure I'm keeping up with preventative pest control, I am lacking that step. Hopefully that will get me green and healthy looking and help rid me of this stuff.


I need to get involved in some workshops/organizations to have some actual human interaction and learning experiences, its just a little difficult with 2 little ones at my house right now.
 

markyscott

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Thanks, scott.

#1. I only considered it because its been pretty mild and I didn't think I was doing it right and need to improve and learn, I probably wont do it again unless absolutely necessary.
#2. When I repotted the trident in the the "grow" dish I made, I basically bare rooted that trident and removed all the old soil I could get out, basically like that shimpaku roots you see in a post above. Those shimpaku I got the year before, and when I repotted, I didn't remove all the old soil in the root ball.
#6. Will make sure I'm keeping up with preventative pest control, I am lacking that step. Hopefully that will get me green and healthy looking and help rid me of this stuff.


I need to get involved in some workshops/organizations to have some actual human interaction and learning experiences, its just a little difficult with 2 little ones at my house right now.

Bring 'em along. My son loves to come - he's the center of attention and can eat all the snacks he wants. He especially likes the Christmas gift exchange.

Hope to see you one of these days

Scott
 
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