Nursery Shimpaku Progression

[Hartinez]

This Shimpaku can also be found in this thread Here. Along with another nursery shimpaku found. The other one was put in the 3 year vault so I decided to start a dedicated thread for this Tree. I bought this tree September of 2020 and left it be till this spring. This tree was part of a bunch of trees at a nursery in SF that had obviously been sitting on these for a while. The nursery can It was in had a very shallow root system to start and an excellent nebari. Repot was pretty straightforward and because of its compact size it did not require much work to clear out a good amount of old soil and pot in to this yixing square i had laying around. I commited to the idea of a semi cascade. At least for now. I was able to get some pretty significant bends in the tree and with the foliage I left it seems to have recovered very well.

I did the big work in mid may and basically let recover and grow since then. Ive been looking at the tree quite a bit trying to decide on final branches, placement and future jins. Maybe you all could help me see through the fog.

As bought.



After repot and main trunk selection



After major bending


Here is the tree as it sits today. Ive removed a bit of backside foliage that were on a dead straight section of trunk and the Jin on the bottom left. The foliage is quite green and healthy and has pushed some extensions.

 

[Pitoon]

I like the design so far. For me it needs to fill in a bit more to get an idea where to start placing pads.

 

[Hartinez]

The tree while seemingly healthy has not put on near the extensions to do any more major work anytime soon but I still want to consider some ideas moving forward. Here are my thoughts. What do you all think?

My initial thought is to eventually remove the first major and downward reaching cascade trunk, in favor of what’s remaining. The style and movement is still present and I could potentially crunch that branch even more towards the main part of the tree for a very cool Jin.


Leaving it is also something I’ve considered. I think though the branching in the back of the tree potentially needs jining regardless of wether I remove the big cascade branch or not. It seems to clean up the image a bit more leaving the remaining foliage to fill in and dense up a bit more.


Maybe something like this awful and way to fast virt.

 

[Hartinez]

I’m hoping by summer maybe fall of 2022 I can start branch selecting and wiring branches. Growth permitting.

 

[Hartinez]

I like the design so far. For me it needs to fill in a bit more to get an idea where to start placing pads.

Yes definitely. I’m hoping by mid to late next growing season Ill have what I need to shape. I just want to get my head wrapped on the idea and what I‘ll need to do.

 

[Hartinez]

@Brian Van Fleet . I’d really love your thoughts on this tree and what you see. Your shimpaku threads are some of my faves and your eye would be greatly appreciated here.
Are my bends too artificial and forced? Or do you feel the compaction will work great once the foliage fills in more and can obscure some of the lines? Do you think the big cascade branch is also too much?

 

[Hartinez]

Here is another option I’m considering. Maybe I’m forcing the cascade and another tree is right in front of me.

 

[birchman]

Handy thread for me, as I have a stock plant very similar. Maybe right down to the variety. I hope the nebari on mine's as good as yours.
I'd favour a fuller cascade, as that's my taste. I'd let it bush out a bit from here then see where you can introduce some space. That is, to leave it largely the way you've started it. Having said that I'm contemplating a straight vertical and straight 45 degree twin trunker for mine, with nice full foliage clouds.

 

[Hartinez]

This tree has developed a handful of brown tips. Seems odd (I think) to be devolopi g this in late summer early fall. Regardless it is concerning and something I’d like to get under control. A couple questions I’m hoping some badasses can chime in on. @Brian Van Fleet @Bonsai Nut . I know there are others.
None of my other junipers are seeing similar conditions. In particular, none of my other shimpaku.

does this appear to be a tip blight issue or a root issue? It’s never humid here and mostly dry if anything. I do water the foliage and soil when i water though.

I’ve treated everything prophylacticly with a cycle of daconil and infuse. Alternating every other month. Do I need to mix in a mancozeb or clearys 3336? Do you know of an alternative? Mancozeb and clearys are both not available here in NM and can’t be mailed in in most cases. I could probably get it if I really looked around.

thanks for the help guys.

 

[Wires_Guy_wires]

To me it looks like a sap flow or root issue.
Tip blight produces sporulating structures that look like black specks. If those aren't there, it's probably not tip blight.
No fungus in the world kills its host without having an escape route. Because if it would do so, it would cease to exist within a generation.

 

[Hartinez]

To me it looks like a sap flow or root issue.
Tip blight produces sporulating structures that look like black specks. If those aren't there, it's probably not tip blight.
No fungus in the world kills its host without having an escape route. Because if it would do so, it would cease to exist within a generation.
View attachment 396507

Kind of what I was thinking also. It had been growing just fine all year until the last couple weeks. What all of sudden could be the root issue cause? Too wet I suppose?

 

[Wires_Guy_wires]

Too wet or too dry for a minute amount of time both have the same result ending up in the rejection of the tips. Although.. Too dry tends to show up all over the tree whereas too little air / too much water tends to be more localized in my experience.
I have some plants that do this randomly, just the ends of a single branch on an otherwise lush and healthy tree. Not sure what that's about.

But if it's all over, I'd check the bottom holes of your pot, see if they're plugged or something. It's a deep pot too, so overwatering could be an issue. But it's hard to estimate what happened from a computer screen.

 

[Hartinez]

Too wet or too dry for a minute amount of time both have the same result ending up in the rejection of the tips. Although.. Too dry tends to show up all over the tree whereas too little air / too much water tends to be more localized in my experience.
I have some plants that do this randomly, just the ends of a single branch on an otherwise lush and healthy tree. Not sure what that's about.

But if it's all over, I'd check the bottom holes of your pot, see if they're plugged or something. It's a deep pot too, so overwatering could be an issue. But it's hard to estimate what happened from a computer screen.

The depth of the pot makes sense also. I repotted a very similar shimpaku at the same time in a much shallower container. It gets watered and fertilized the same. But it is experiencing no browning.

 

[Wires_Guy_wires]

Just pitching an idea.. Is the pot standing tilted? That might cause water to pool on the lowest side if there aren't any holes.
Other than that, I think the deep pot might play a role in the sense that fertilizer, dandruff and roots might stop air from flowing in and hinder water flowing out.. But that's just guesses.

I'd try a chopstick in the soil for a couple days to a week, maybe probe what's going on in there. It wouldn't tell you what happened in the past but it can help you establish a view of what the current soil conditions are like.

 

[Brian Van Fleet]

Sorry to have missed the tag earlier, but I do like where you’re taking it. It is a natural, not forced cascade, so I’d go with it until you’re tired of the awkwardness of moving a cascade tree around. At that point, I like the jin solution and keeping it as a pretty severe slant. Don’t tilt it up.

 

[Hartinez]

Sorry to have missed the tag earlier, but I do like where you’re taking it. It is a natural, not forced cascade, so I’d go with it until you’re tired of the awkwardness of moving a cascade tree around. At that point, I like the jin solution and keeping it as a pretty severe slant. Don’t tilt it up.

No prob at all Brian. I appreciate the response. It does make me feel a bit better about the direction I’m headed. I like that I’ve got options moving forward.

any thoughts on what is causing the tips to brown? Guy wires was thinking it could be a root issue rather than tip blight which was my first thought. But I still cant fully distinguish the two from each other. Thanks again!

the cascade branch doesn’t seem to be infected. That’s my main thought as to why it is maybe a vascular issue starting from specific sections of the roots

 

[Brian Van Fleet]

I’m thinking fungal, but not sure what. If the pot is deep, the top could be dry and the bottom still wet. That could be an issue as well. Deep pots aren’t good for bonsai trees. Yours doesn’t seem too bad, so long as it’s somewhat root-bound.

 

[Hartinez]

I’m thinking fungal, but not sure what. If the pot is deep, the top could be dry and the bottom still wet. That could be an issue as well. Deep pots aren’t good for bonsai trees. Yours doesn’t seem too bad, so long as it’s somewhat root-bound.

Dam. Hoping its not a fungus. I’ll focus a little harder on watering and moisture levels. I ran a chopstick from top to bottom in several spots to ensure better percolation. Im also going to order mancozeb and have it shipped to my mom in Miss. then have her ship to me!! Thanks Bri.

 

[bwaynef]

Infuse GRANULAR is Clearys3336/Thiophanate Methyl/Thiomyl (which treats for Kabatina also, which is sometimes confused for phomopsis) . Infuse LIQUID is Propiconazole.

Others:
bacillus-amyloliquefaciens.txt: Phomopsis
captan.txt: Phomopsis Cane And Leaf Spot
clearys3336.txt: Phomopsis (Twig Blights, Cankers, And Diebacks)
copper.txt: Phomopsis Leaf Blight
infusegranular.txt: Phomopsis (Twig Blights, Cankers, And Diebacks)
infuseliquid.txt: Phomopsis Blight (Phomopsis Juniperovora)
mancozeb.txt: Phomopsis
phyton27.txt: Phomopsis
phyton35.txt: Phomopsis
potassium-bicarb.txt: Phomopsis Blight
propiconazole.txt: Phomopsis Blight (Phomopsis Juniperovora)
serenade.txt: Phomopsis
thiomyl.txt: Phomopsis (Twig Blights, Cankers, And Diebacks)

 

[ChristianDGreat]

Dam. Hoping its not a fungus. I’ll focus a little harder on watering and moisture levels. I ran a chopstick from top to bottom in several spots to ensure better percolation. Im also going to order mancozeb and have it shipped to my mom in Miss. then have her ship to me!! Thanks Bri.

whats your update on this tree hartinez?