Everything was watered heavily on Sunday right before the freeze. I have a ton of mulch in my backyard, but its currently frozen as well. I'm sure I can find something. Worst case, I can use hay or something like that
Overwintering - Guidance
- Thread starter dbonsaiw
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Deep Sea Diver
Masterpiece
It pays to have a wintering over plan…. before winter 
. Like I said, next year you will be much easier.
Around here we use medium bark nuggets sifted as described previously. These have the advantage of not mucking up the media. In the spring we pull the mulch back a bit at a time. Leaving a ring around the trees. That way you can push it back if nasty weather strikes. Later on we use it to help mulch the garden plants, or build the compost.
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. Like I said, next year you will be much easier.Around here we use medium bark nuggets sifted as described previously. These have the advantage of not mucking up the media. In the spring we pull the mulch back a bit at a time. Leaving a ring around the trees. That way you can push it back if nasty weather strikes. Later on we use it to help mulch the garden plants, or build the compost.
cheers
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Deep Sea Diver
Masterpiece
You should of seen my first year!
Cheers
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Just an update - I put the trees on the ground and mulched all around them inside the tent. For now, the pots are mulched over as well. Not sure I like having mulch on top of the actual soil and may just take that off. It was slim pickings around here for mulch and I used larger mulch as well as pine shavings used for pet cages (had it on hand). Seems to get rather wet so I'm debating removing it from the soil.
19Mateo83
Masterpiece
Here’s my setup in North Carolina. Not bonsai but this is how Im overwintering some of my maples. They are up close to the house under some huge crepe myrtles mulched in with leaves. We don’t really get too cold here, maybe in the teens.
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19Mateo83
Masterpiece
Sounds like North Carolina. It was almost 75 last week and now it’s in the 30’s with snow and ice.
That's truly insane. I can at least manage to keep things frozen more or less.
Deep Sea Diver
Masterpiece
Interesting.
Do you have data to support this feeling, or just shooting from the hip?
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Deep Sea Diver
Masterpiece
You get to listen to your hip after a couple years with no losses.Overkill is better than killed!
leatherback
The Treedeemer
To be honest, I have been thinking this myself. I have not responded as I do not know the weather in your location.
I pretty much place the pots on the ground, sheltered from wind and sun in a nice huddle. And let them be, for all except of course tropicals and my mediteraneans. IF temps are expected to drop below -10c (~14f) for more than just an overnight spike, I move my plants into the garage/shed. But in my location that is rare (3 times in 12 years keeping trees in pots). I do not recall loosing trees to frost yet, except for an olive which I forgot and was outside during my sabbatical abroad over winter.
leatherback
The Treedeemer
Is of course a prudent attitude.
rockm
Spuds Moyogi
Not really. Overkill with winter shelter can result in very bad things here in the Eastern U.S. Too warm and too protected will result in bud break in February. We have at least two months left (March and beginning of April) with freezes and frosts. Once deciduous trees open their leaf buds, they lose over 90 percent of their ability to withstand freezing--resulting in winter kill.
Overkill is better than killed!
The last several winters have been very problematic here in Va.--with early warm ups in early Feb. followed by deep freezes later in the month and into March. The pattern is persistent. I've lost a couple of decent trees to it (one was a very nice Bald Cypress and had significant damage to another).
The mulched cold pit with cinder blocks is a good idea. I'd lose the covering, or open it up a bit, with cover only over the top to prevent excess rain from keeping things too soggy. FWIW, I open my cold pit up to every snow storm we get and cover it when it rains (mostly). Snow is your friend. One of the goals for overwintering is to keep trees as cold as they can stand it for as long as possible. Later bud break is better than early.
Deep Sea Diver
Masterpiece
We have had the same issues with early bud break here also. Our flowering Cherry trees were blooming in December this year. It used to be they would flower only in April 25 years ago, then March, February, January and now December . In fact it’s been in the high 50’s this week and today is supposed to be in the 60s.
You are mostly spot on. But overkill is a myth in these scenarios. The safety of the roots is key. Bud break is triggered once the tree deacclimates and warm temperatures push the tree out of dormancy. It takes a long time for the tree to reacclimate and regain cold hardiness. This means it is even more important to protect the roots during these times as freezing weather often returns. This cycle is the time when trees roots are most at risk.
There is another post where we were discussing the very thing a couple days ago.
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You are mostly spot on. But overkill is a myth in these scenarios. The safety of the roots is key. Bud break is triggered once the tree deacclimates and warm temperatures push the tree out of dormancy. It takes a long time for the tree to reacclimate and regain cold hardiness. This means it is even more important to protect the roots during these times as freezing weather often returns. This cycle is the time when trees roots are most at risk.
There is another post where we were discussing the very thing a couple days ago.
cheers
DSD sends
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This is where my head is at. The tent basically stays open unless the wind is intense. The tent really does zero to raise/maintain the temps - it just seems to raise the humidity (which I still don't understand given the tent is wide open and there is plenty of air flow). This is my first attempt at overwintering and I simply left some trees outside and move them to the garage if it gets really cold out. Other than the tridents, the other trees in the tent are big box maples that got too much root work at the wrong times and an azalea which I collected a few days before winter. So, at the same time as trying to figure out an overwintering plan going forward, I'm trying to keep the over-worked trees alive.
Temps here tend to stay in the 20s/30s with occasional dips to really cold and some days in the 40s. I mulched on Friday and we've had ups and downs since then. The trees are still frozen.
Not sure if the maples would give off signs that they're not doing well in the winter from all the root work. Trees seem to be filled with buds and there is no increase in die back. They seem fine as far as I can tell, but I guess I need to wait for spring. I'm clueless on the azalea. I cut off the top and stuck the top in a flower pot as a control. The leaves on the severed branch haven't changed at all and look exactly like the ones still attached to roots. So who knows? I'm not holding my breath on the azalea, but it would be nice to have as it has a cool trunk and was hidden in my front yard.
As we move closer to the spring, I can always adjust my overwintering. The tent is light and can be lifted if need be. Trees can be moved into shade or the garage.
rockm
Spuds Moyogi
Nevertheless, once top growth starts, root cold hardiness falls off a cliff.
FWIW, the D.C. area is flowering cherry tree central. Almost everyone has one because of the showy Japanese-gifted trees downtown around the Tidal Basin and the Jefferson Memorial.. I have a big yoshino in my front yard. Sometimes some cherry trees in yards around here bloom in the fall particularly if the area it is in gets afternoon sun. Some, including some Japanese cherries downtown are autumn-blooming varieties...Around here, we have a pretty reliable forecast explicitly for the cherry tree by the National Park Service for the trees downtown.
#BloomCam
nationalmall.org
FOX5: Coastal flooding highlights long-term issues at Tidal Basin — Trust for the National Mall
The Tidal Basin is one of the most iconic spots on the National Mall, but changes in weather patterns and increased risk of coastal flooding have rendered it one of America’s most endangered landmarks.
nationalmall.org
Deep Sea Diver
Masterpiece
Yes. That is the point I was making. That’s why protecting the roots is key. Roots never evolved to be as cold hardy as the buds, branches and trunk. Some researchers believe anything below 32 begins to sustain damage. That’s one of the reasons I started the crazy study of bonsai tree media temps during the winter with pots in various locations this December.
I used to live in Dumfries and loved the spring Cherry blooming! Actually why we’ve got flowering cherry trees in our back yard!cheers
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Deep Sea Diver
Masterpiece
You are doing well for your first year! Vinyl cold frames are mainly for shelter, not increasing the temperature. Yet on sunny days the temps rise and evaporation occurs, raising the humidity inside the structure. This can trigger fungus to form. Good airflow keeps the excess moisture down. That’s why the it’s important to keep things drafty on warmer days, close on freezing days and nights.
That’s the same situation in a greenhouse, but amplified due to the effectiveness of the structure. This is the reason owners always keep fans on for airflow andthe doors and vents open when the temps are above freezing. Here’s the situation in my greenhouses right now. The fans are on and the doors are getting opened as soon as the message is launched.
Not something I’d recommend. But your trees, your choice!
cheers
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