Pine Bonsai Seedling Advice

M_Bonsai

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I grew this pine from seed. It's a couple of years old now. I've pretty much just let it grow. If it's not too early to start on it, what should I do? Root pruning, wiring, styling, etc. If it's too early, how long should I wait to do anything or what should I wait for? Thanks.
 

Wires_Guy_wires

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Hmm, they don't look very dashing. So first thing on my list would be to get them in a good soil and a low and wide container (to prevent the tap root from being an issue later on).
You should do that in spring. A larger container means more roots, where pines get their strength from. A good soil will both help the fine root development as well as nebari formation. A shallow container will limit growth, but if those roots get a deep pot, you will end up having to cut a taproot which can be deadly to older trees that heavily rely on them. Best to prevent it all together and lag behind a bit on the rest of the development for a year or so. Once those adventitious roots take over, you'll be in the clear.

Then after they have a year of solid growing, you can cut back to the low branches. This way you'll have the apex feeding them in 2022 and once you make that cut, you can wire the branches to make a new apex. From there on forward you have a basic trunk structure, and you can do either of two things: keep the trees small and refine them from there on forward, which is a long road.
Or you can let the new apex run free and use it as an escape branch to thicken up those trunks faster.

I'm doing both. The former technique is slow, but it prevents you from having to make large cuts you'll have to mask or hide. The latter technique can give you a nice tree in a matter of 6-10 years, but there will be a large cut somewhere.

As always, there are hundreds of different approaches. All of them are probably fine and will work. It depends a whole lot on what you want, what you want to invest, what you'd want the result to look like.
 

M_Bonsai

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Hmm, they don't look very dashing. So first thing on my list would be to get them in a good soil and a low and wide container (to prevent the tap root from being an issue later on).
You should do that in spring. A larger container means more roots, where pines get their strength from. A good soil will both help the fine root development as well as nebari formation. A shallow container will limit growth, but if those roots get a deep pot, you will end up having to cut a taproot which can be deadly to older trees that heavily rely on them. Best to prevent it all together and lag behind a bit on the rest of the development for a year or so. Once those adventitious roots take over, you'll be in the clear.

Then after they have a year of solid growing, you can cut back to the low branches. This way you'll have the apex feeding them in 2022 and once you make that cut, you can wire the branches to make a new apex. From there on forward you have a basic trunk structure, and you can do either of two things: keep the trees small and refine them from there on forward, which is a long road.
Or you can let the new apex run free and use it as an escape branch to thicken up those trunks faster.

I'm doing both. The former technique is slow, but it prevents you from having to make large cuts you'll have to mask or hide. The latter technique can give you a nice tree in a matter of 6-10 years, but there will be a large cut somewhere.

As always, there are hundreds of different approaches. All of them are probably fine and will work. It depends a whole lot on what you want, what you want to invest, what you'd want the result to look like.
This helps a lot. I only have the one tree so just want to double-check. I'm not doing anything until the spring of 2022? And that's when I will re-pot and change the soil?
 

Njyamadori

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Also another suggestion is wiring it up for movement but yeah wires guy wires is right that it doesn’t have good health
 

ShadyStump

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Tell us a bit about it.
What species if you know? How you've been caring for it? Where you keep it? Where you live?
This would help us know how to get it stronger and healthier so it's ready when the time comes.
 

Potawatomi13

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Also would help if adding location to personal profile;).
 

Wires_Guy_wires

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This helps a lot. I only have the one tree so just want to double-check. I'm not doing anything until the spring of 2022? And that's when I will re-pot and change the soil?
You could do a lot of things now but it would be the best for your plants if you wait until spring. However, if the pot is full of roots you can probably lift it out of the container without much harm and add a coarse drainage layer of soil (some pumice, lavarock, or whatever is the cheapest and easiest to find) on the bottom of the pot and put the plant back in.
This would give the roots some breathing room.
Then in spring 2022 do a repot into a proper bonsai soil. I personally try to leave pine roots alone; don't cut them off at this stage and health status during a repot. They'll need that strength to recover.
The more strength they keep, the faster the recovery will be.
They'll recover in the summer of 2022, you can fertilize a little(!) if they look happy. Then in fall they'll probably be strong enough to take either cutbacks, wiring, or both. Of course, depending on how they look.

Some more info on the species would help, as would your location in the world.
 

M_Bonsai

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Tell us a bit about it.
What species if you know? How you've been caring for it? Where you keep it? Where you live?
This would help us know how to get it stronger and healthier so it's ready when the time comes.
I don't know the species. I gave up on some pine seeds I collected a while back and threw them in the yard. One ended up growing so I let it grow for a while and then dug it up. It's on the side of my yard on a little plant shelf thing. I'm in California.
 

Esolin

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I don't know the species. I gave up on some pine seeds I collected a while back and threw them in the yard. One ended up growing so I let it grow for a while and then dug it up. It's on the side of my yard on a little plant shelf thing. I'm in California.
Were the seeds collected in the wild or from an urban setting? If they were urban, they were probably either Aleppo, Eldarica, Stone or Canary. If they were collected in a native forest, then there are a lot more possibilities depending on the region.
 

M_Bonsai

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Were the seeds collected in the wild or from an urban setting? If they were urban, they were probably either Aleppo, Eldarica, or Canary. If they were collected in a native forest, then there are a lot more possibilities depending on the region.
Sadly I have no clue. At one point I collected from all sorts of areas including urban and forest. I have no clue which it came from. Sorry.
 

ShadyStump

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I don't know the species. I gave up on some pine seeds I collected a while back and threw them in the yard. One ended up growing so I let it grow for a while and then dug it up. It's on the side of my yard on a little plant shelf thing. I'm in California.
When did you dig it up? It could just be reacting to the transplant right now, making it even more important to give it some time.
Keep in a spot outside that's protected from extremes; no hot afternoon sun, or extreme humidity, and sufficient air movement.
 

Fidur

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Probably a Canary pine. The color and shape of the juvenile foliage is right, and mature foliage seems to have (as much as I can see) three neddles.
 

M_Bonsai

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i
When did you dig it up? It could just be reacting to the transplant right now, making it even more important to give it some time.
Keep in a spot outside that's protected from extremes; no hot afternoon sun, or extreme humidity, and sufficient air movement.
It's probably been a year or more.
 

ShadyStump

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It's probably been a year or more.
Then it's likely care. Others will have better advice than I will, but sun and fertilizer until it's healthy then. Don't let the sail stay too wet. Drench it, then wait until nearly dry. Any heavy wiring now would be bad, but some gentle guy wires could help you feel like you're moving things along.
 
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