Pinus Sylvestris propagation

BONSAI_OUTLAW

Banned
Messages
150
Reaction score
1
Location
Woodstown, NJ
The "Misho" article in the latest issue of Bonsai Focus sparks these new inquiries.

I found a Scots pine next to my house and it is covered in pine cones. About half of them are open and the other half are closed.

I would like to collect some of these cones for seed. When should I do this as I have never attempted seed collecting from a pine. It seems like I have also heard I may have to steam the cones or something like that.

After collecting said seed would any stratification are scarification be required?

I also noticed some nice branches that looked like they would make good material, but I am under the impression that this type of pine does not airlayer well. Is this true?
 

bisjoe

Yamadori
Messages
85
Reaction score
0
Location
Sammamish, WA
USDA Zone
8B
You need to do a 24 hour presoak then cold stratification for 6 weeks.

I have also heard that pines are hard to layer but have not tried it. The seeds will normally mature, and the cones start to open some time in October, depending on the climate and weather that year. In nature it takes a mix of wet and dry weather for them to open and naturally disperse the seeds, some may still not have fallen until early spring, though most drop by December. Rather than try steam or any other artificial method I'd wait until the cones start to open on their own, indicating the seed maturity, then bring into a warm, dry house and they should open on their own.
 

Graydon

Chumono
Messages
717
Reaction score
7
I also noticed some nice branches that looked like they would make good material, but I am under the impression that this type of pine does not airlayer well. Is this true?

I have never layered one of these pines but I have layered others. It's obviously a spring thing so plan ahead. My success has come with using 0.8% IBA powder dusted on a typical ringed bark cut. If done properly you will get a nice swelling at the cut and plenty of roots in 3 to 4 months. I still wait one year before removing the layer.

I used an akadama, pumice and lava soil mix with no moss and had success. The trick was keeping the soil moist but not too wet, allowing for air circulation and allowing my timed misters to wet the soil twice daily. It was a heck of a rig but I guess it was worth the effort.
 

AlainK

Masterpiece
Messages
4,180
Reaction score
6,966
Location
Orléans, France, Europe
USDA Zone
9A
I've tried an air-layer on a scots pine this year almost by accident: last year I tried to wire a young tree with no real interest, but the banch cracked. Even if it was not good material, I tried to mend it : I wrapped plastic tape around it and secured the wound with copper wire. And I forgot about it.
This spring, I found it again and the wound was sealed, but there was a big swelling above because of the wire.
So I decided to experiment an air-layering at the beginning of May, and I saw the first roots appear at the end of July. I will separate it next year. Not sure I can do anything worth it with either parts, but that's a good training experience ;)
 

Attachments

  • pinus02_070503b.jpg
    pinus02_070503b.jpg
    69.8 KB · Views: 58
  • pinus02_070731.jpg
    pinus02_070731.jpg
    90.5 KB · Views: 54
  • pinus02_070730b.jpg
    pinus02_070730b.jpg
    65.7 KB · Views: 58

BONSAI_OUTLAW

Banned
Messages
150
Reaction score
1
Location
Woodstown, NJ
I hope you will keep us posted Alain. I am very interested. I only have found mature Scots pines in my area for some reason.
 

AlainK

Masterpiece
Messages
4,180
Reaction score
6,966
Location
Orléans, France, Europe
USDA Zone
9A
Since, I have found thsi very interesting tutorial on how to layer black or white pines.

It's in French, but the photos will help and here are a few explanations :

Pin noir = black pine / Pin blanc = white pine

Pin noir du Japon - SORIAGE -
Make 6 diagonal cuts. Lift three of them, insert a link (orange twine), and make a tight knot.
Beginning of June. Wait at least four months. May be separated in Oct.-Nov. if works well.

Pin blanc du Japon - SORIAGE -
8 vertical cuts, as long as twice the diameter of the branch. Insert twine under lifted sections of bark. 2 turns, and knot.
Beginning of May.

Pin noir du Japon - TORIKI -
Remove bark ring.

Never air-layer the same year as root pruning. Scrape the white part clean to remove cambium.

Works better if container dark: no light, but accumulates heat; that's why I use a plastic bottle (to see if roots are here) wrapped in dustbin liner plastic.
 

Graydon

Chumono
Messages
717
Reaction score
7
Thank you Graydon. What type of pine did you try it on?

I have one going on a sand pine (pinus clausa) now as well as the JBP in the photos. I believe pines to be easy to layer if you use a proper strength hormone.
 

Attachments

  • IMG_2769.jpg
    IMG_2769.jpg
    90.8 KB · Views: 46
  • IMG_2762.jpg
    IMG_2762.jpg
    66 KB · Views: 45

Gnome

Mame
Messages
108
Reaction score
1
Location
Western PA USA
Bonsai_Outlaw

I found a Scots pine next to my house and it is covered in pine cones. About half of them are open and the other half are closed.

I would like to collect some of these cones for seed. When should I do this as I have never attempted seed collecting from a pine. It seems like I have also heard I may have to steam the cones or something like that.

After collecting said seed would any stratification are scarification be required?

Collect unopened cones soon, soak them overnight in a fungicide solution and then dry in the sun for a day or two. After this put them in a paper bag and leave them in your house over the winter. They will gradually open and release their seeds. They make a noticeable cracking noise as each portion opens and can be surprising if you are not aware of it.

I did not perform any stratification or scarification on the seeds before planting. I did soak them overnight before planting them, a portion will float and are not viable. After that germination was pretty quick.

http://bonsainut.com/forums/showpost.php?p=185&postcount=7
 

Rick Moquin

Omono
Messages
1,245
Reaction score
9
Location
Dartmouth, NS Canada
USDA Zone
6a
My success has come with using 0.8% IBA powder dusted on a typical ringed bark cut.

Graydon,

Where does one acquire 0.8% routing hormone?

I used an akadama, pumice and lava soil mix with no moss and had success. The trick was keeping the soil moist but not too wet, allowing for air circulation and allowing my timed misters to wet the soil twice daily. It was a heck of a rig but I guess it was worth the effort.

I did a ground layer on a Hinoki in straight turface (the layered part) while the tree remained in it's usual substrate. As you stated aeration is/was a key to success IMO.

I like the way you have performed your air layer (colander) will keep that technique in mind for the future as conventional method did not pay dividends for me.
 

Graydon

Chumono
Messages
717
Reaction score
7
Graydon,

Where does one acquire 0.8% routing hormone?

Thanks Rick. I made the 0.8% IBA because I was unable to find it anywhere. I found pure IBA in a powder form in Canada and cut it using pure talc (not baby powder) on some fancy pants digital scale to get a 0.8% IBA concentration.

It now appears that it is available once again from the hormone company that is evading me at the moment. I think it's hormex. Yep - hormex.com in 1, 6, 12 and 50 pound containers.

I liked the colander. I was able to slowly remove some top soil as I saw the roots beginning to poke out the bottom. When I started the layer I made sure it was buried rather deep. I did some soil moving looking for some future nebari last week when I attended a workshop with Roy Nagatoshi. He seemed interested in the way I did the technique, how quickly it went and the future tree.
 

Rick Moquin

Omono
Messages
1,245
Reaction score
9
Location
Dartmouth, NS Canada
USDA Zone
6a
Thanks I will have to look into it.

Yup, there is alot to be said about pond baskets/collanders wrt root formation.
 

Similar threads

Top