Planning some surgery for two Adeniums, but want to treat some issues first

[s2kMark]

So my girlfriend's mom picked up 4 new desert roses. I had been taking care of a small desert rose she has for some time now, and then helped revive a much older one that was donated. Of the new 4, I was gifted these two beauts:


Do ignore the mess in the yard. Some landscaping guys misunderstood the word "trim" so I'm revamping the whole thing, eventually.

Back to the adeniums, the one on the right looks to be older, and has signs of some work:






The base of the tree is very thick, about the size of a large fist. It has some growth coming out from it down low, and some roots that want to expand outward.

It has some pretty decent fill up top, but I definitely want this thing to get wider and bushier.



But, I noticed some problems. It has some spotting, and some white stuff underneath some leaves and the branches. I can rub them off, but I want to know what this all is. Any ideas? It almost looks like the spores you'd see on the underside of a fern's leaves:





As for the other plant, the branches are very thin. Also, I noticed roots coming out the bottom of the pot. This one will need a lot of work:





This one has the same spotting and some of the leaves are curling:






Any suggestions?

 

[s2kMark]

So, for the planned surgery, I had been watching these vids, and decided that I needed some adeniums:

Yog seems to specialize in bonsai adenium, and recommends chopping them really stubby to promote a thicker base, and thicker branching. He also looks to cut the root to be really shallow. I am thinking of doing the same methods and using a nice bonsai pot. Any recommendations, or warnings?

Also, for root mix, I've used the following miracle gro soil with an extra helping of perlite:



This soil has worked well with the past desert roses I worked on. Those plants seemed to enjoy more water than I would give to succulents. Any soil recommendations, or should I add anything like wood chips or porous rocks like volcanic stones?

 

[GrimLore]

Also, for root mix, I've used the following miracle gro soil with an extra helping of perlite:

That should work just fine, it does here. The damage I am seeing on those is new to me most likely because we don't seem to have any insect damage. If that is not insect damage I myself would pull them out of whatever substrate they are in and hose them off while checking for root rot and cutting away that and some of the longer roots, then repot larger...
Until they are healthy leave them in the larger containers for at least a season before doing any heavy root work. I am no expert on these as I only have one large leggy one but I have been taking care of it as instructed by my Wife for many years. She gave up on it as it never bloomed and I am now growing it quite differently.
As for chopping the top and such I would also wait until they are healthy. I will do a heavy top chop to mine this Spring to encourage an entire new shorter set of branches. I need to bring it in for the Winter and when I do I let it drop foliage and live off of the water stored in the trunk and will do the chops when it is waking up and gets regular water.

Grimmy

 

[s2kMark]

I removed the white spore looking things. They didn't move around at all, so I am assuming its a fungus. I sprayed some copper fungicide, and will see how that works out (waiting for mancozeb from amazon).

I do want to repot these things soon. The soil moistly topsoil with small amounts of wood chips and a sprinklemof what I believe is perlite. I want to make a very rocky soil and get them into bonsai pots that are around four inches deep. I found a page that recommended a mix: "65% perlite, 10 coir, 10% sand/rock and 15% organic material such as top soil."

https://adeniumrose.com/blog/desert-rose-soil-what-soil-to-use-for-growing-adeniums/

I would just have to water and fertilize often given the high drainage.

 

[GrimLore]

I would just have to water and fertilize often given the high drainage.

They require far less water then one would think. To much water will result in root rot and fungal issues. Mine is still outside and when it comes in for the Winter will not be watered for many weeks. The base/trunk of the plant acts as a storage device similar to many Cacti and other Succulents. When it is firm there is really no need to water it and invite problems. When it softens a bit to the touch is when I water and actually protect it from rain keeping it under a landscape Japanese Maple. Other Succulents and Cacti we keep outdoors never get any rain and are kept on a shelf under eve. They never get watered more then one time a month, sometimes less often if the humidity is high and they don't look stressed.
As for fertilizer I use Jack's Professional 20-20-20 with micronutrients as I do with almost all plant types. Succulents and Cacti get far less here at our home, two or three times a year. They do just fine unlike other plant types.

Grimmy

 

[GrimLore]

I do want to repot these things soon.

This is what you want to see for roots after rinsing them with a hose. Cut off anything that does not look healthy, firm, and bright like these when you repot -





Grimmy

 

[Jarath]

Be safe in Miami. My prayers for you all down there

 

[s2kMark]

So, I had done one treatment of copper fungicide, and the rust disease is gone. I also picked up a third adenium with a fat caudex, but not as fat as the one in my original photos.

This is the plant pulled out and cleaned up a bit:



There were four main sets of roots. Two were thinner and manipulable and can be repositioned to grow sideways:



The other were much thicker. The smaller is slightly manipulable. These two were chosen for the chop:







I also cut the edges of the cut to promote sideways growth of the new roots:



Then, I covered the wounds with cinnamon powder to prevent fungal infection:



As per the videos, I will leave this plant in the shade for a few days to dry out. Then, I'll plant with either a flat rock or a plastic disk beneath the cuts so that new roots will grow sideways, and maybe wedge a small rock between the four main roots to encourage spreading. I will lay out marble chips along the bottom of the bonsai pot, and then use a mix of peat moss, perlite, and black sand as the soil. After potting, I'll leave the plant in the shade for a few more days before placing it back in the sun.

The point of all this is to force the caudex to grow thicker and encourage the roots to grow sideways rather than downwards. It should take about 2-3 years for the new roots to grow in well.

Later down the road, I will also chop the branches to encourage more branches and to build a dense canopy for the flowering.

 

[s2kMark]

Finished product in a YiXing 6 inch pot:



The branches are really tall, and not the shape I'm looking for. I will leave the plant be for a month or two to allow the roots to begin establishing themselves, and to guage the health of the adenium based on the leaves.

After that, I'll chop the branches at just above the first set of leaves, or maybe just above the top (as the first cut maybe, but definitely eventually). I'm training this guy to have wide, horizontal roots, a wide caudex, and want to train branches for a wide and not so tall canopy. Btw, I wedged a small smooth stone between the four main roots to spread them out before potting. Here are some pics of the caudex:







That one piece of root would not stay under the sand/peat moss mixture. I believe I should have cut it, but I want to see what happens. Any recommendations on that?

Oh, I lined the bottom of the pot with marble nuggets. I covered the marble with the potting media (10-15% peat moss, and the rest black sand), and put a small plastic lid to keep the roots from growing downward. I then placed the plant as I wanted, and filled in the media make sure to get it in between the roots.

I will order some fertiziler which I will have to use with just about every watering to maintain good nutrition and bloom. The low amount of organic material will prevent root rot, but will be insufficient for nutrition in the long run.

 

[GrimLore]

I will order some fertiziler which I will have to use with just about every watering to maintain good nutrition and bloom. The low amount of organic material will prevent root rot, but will be insufficient for nutrition in the long run.

They require far less fertilizer then one would think. The one I posted here gets 3 doses a year and grows just fine. Also, I only water when it is actively growing and when it is inside for the Winter rarely, as with Cacti and Succulents.

Once yours starts throwing new roots in that pot I bet in one growing season it will look like it is trying to walk out of it!

Grimmy

 

[s2kMark]

The older brother has been repotted after applying some root cut method:







I used red lava rock with 10-15% peat moss for the potting media.

Btw, I'm following this guide on fertilizing:

http://labellegardenclub.org/docs/DesertRoseCulture.pdf

Apparently, adenia have been bred for constant fertilization.

 

[GrimLore]

Apparently, adenia have been bred for constant fertilization.

I use far less as my mix drains but stays damp a few days. One thing in that pdf I found interesting is I have been trying to Crystal for years is hers needed more water for years. She gave up on it after 15 - 16 years of no flowers and told me to do as I please. I up bare rooted it, up potted it 6 times as deep and will top chop it in the Spring for now.

Grimmy

 

[s2kMark]

So, this is the third adenia, and largest, after some work yesterday, post-root cut. The large visible roots grew horizontally. But, one root eneath them grew downward, so it got the cut and a plastic plate under it. There were many feeder roots



Using the caudex squeeze method, my adenia need water every 1-2 days in the morning.

 

[Rachael]

So, I had done one treatment of copper fungicide, and the rust disease is gone. I also picked up a third adenium with a fat caudex, but not as fat as the one in my original photos.

This is the plant pulled out and cleaned up a bit:

View attachment 161509

There were four main sets of roots. Two were thinner and manipulable and can be repositioned to grow sideways:

View attachment 161510

The other were much thicker. The smaller is slightly manipulable. These two were chosen for the chop:

View attachment 161511

View attachment 161512

View attachment 161513

I also cut the edges of the cut to promote sideways growth of the new roots:

View attachment 161514

Then, I covered the wounds with cinnamon powder to prevent fungal infection:

View attachment 161515

As per the videos, I will leave this plant in the shade for a few days to dry out. Then, I'll plant with either a flat rock or a plastic disk beneath the cuts so that new roots will grow sideways, and maybe wedge a small rock between the four main roots to encourage spreading. I will lay out marble chips along the bottom of the bonsai pot, and then use a mix of peat moss, perlite, and black sand as the soil. After potting, I'll leave the plant in the shade for a few more days before placing it back in the sun.

The point of all this is to force the caudex to grow thicker and encourage the roots to grow sideways rather than downwards. It should take about 2-3 years for the new roots to grow in well.

Later down the road, I will also chop the branches to encourage more branches and to build a dense canopy for the flowering.

Hello!

Could you take a look at my post in TROPICALS? "Adenium (Desert Rose) Caudex & Bonsai Process"... I had a few questions that I'm wondering if you'd be able to answer.

I'm very interested in the progress of your Desert Rose.

Thank you! Happy Holidays!

 

[Rachael]

This is what you want to see for roots after rinsing them with a hose. Cut off anything that does not look healthy, firm, and bright like these when you repot -
Grimmy

Hello!

I'd like to do this to my Adenium in the spring time. I've been watering it once a month now that all leaves have fallen in Winter time. But the caudex is firm so I'm wondering if I should just not water it at all to avoid root rot.

If you'd please take a look at my post in TROPICALS- "Adenium (Desert Rose) Caudex & Bonsai Process, I had a few questions that I'm hoping you'd be able to answer.

Thank you!