Pre Bonsai Japanese Black Pine

Coach

Mame
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First post...learning everyday...best read so far has been The Art of Natural Bonsai by Dave Joyce, also good reads from Peter Chan...still a complete and total novice. I acquired this pine from Don Blackmond (Gregory Beach Bonsai) in Michigan, it was chopped down pretty good but I was super attracted to the flaky bark and trunk movement. Had to bring it back to life after it went into shock (long story). It's healthy now. I "styled" it in the spring. Obviously it's needles are extremely long and I have never attempted decandling.

What's my next move with this tree?

Thanks for reading, I truly enjoy viewing all advice and the art of others on this site
 

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Brian Van Fleet

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If you're in Michigan, it's probably too late to candle-prune. You need about 100 days of growing season after candle-pruning...although it would be the right next move. If the remains growing season is shorter, you'll need to pull needles in the fall to balance the strength, and candle prune next summer in mid-June.
 

Adair M

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Your next step is to read the links in red in the post that Brian has. His information about JBP is right on.

Your tree is ready to "refine". We work on JBP three times a year. Fall: pull needles, select buds if the tree was decandled, wire and style. Late Winter: repot, pull needles to prepare for spring. Summer: decandle.

You missed decandling season for the year. So, there will be little in the "bud selection" to do. You will be able to pull some needles, if you want. However, only do this if you are confident you know what you're doing. It's an optional step. (Or, I should say, it's a more advanced step.)

Wiring and styling: The wire you have on the tree is too light. It's aluminum, and it's really not heavy (strong) enough to do the job. Copper is better. If the wire was the same size as what you used were copper, it would be strong enough. And your wiring doesn't appear to have an anchor. If you want to bend a branch down, the wire has to be wrapped around the trunk. Just wiring on the branch won't bend it down at the crotch where it connects with the trunk. (Which is what you want.)

So, remove the wire that's on it for now, and rewire later in the fall.

Late winter/early spring you may want to repot. And remove more of the original soil. The new soil looks ok, but you probably want to get rid of half of the old soil that it was in while it was in the ground.

Next summer, in early June, decandle. This will build multilple shoots and shorter needles.

It's ok to let the tree "rest" like you have done for a year as it acclimates to living in a pot rather than in the ground. You should have fun with it! I think it will make a pleasing bonsai!
 

Coach

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Thank you for the response Brian! I'm actually in Texas, Austin area...based on my crape myrtles and bermuda grass it won't get cold enough to inspire dormancy here until November or later. Reason I mentioned Michigan in post 1 is the day I got the tree it was 90 degrees in Texas in late October, Michigan was already experiencing super cool weather....I can't be sure but I believe it put this tree in shock (all needles turned honey brown and many dropped). Anyway with lot of tlc it survived (which makes me love it even more). I could leave it alone and have a go at candle pruning next spring but if I can keep it healthy I'd love to give it a go now and get a head start on next season. Would you chance it?
 
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Coach

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Thank you Adair...looks like our posts crossed...I will wait, especially since your post has given me a better understanding of proper seasonal workings with the tree and that decandling should have occurred earlier this summer (I thought that was a spring activity) thank you Very Much
 

Adair M

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Yes, I'd wait until next year to decandle. This is a marathon, not a sprint!

I'm glad my post about the yearly JBP cycle makes sense. You can start at any season, but don't do things out of season. It's important to do the right things at the right time.

Do read Brian's JBP book. It's excellent with wonderful pictures.
 

FrankP999

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Coach,
Watch Ryan Neil's lecture on YouTube - he covers the yearly cycle for black pines. And do whatever Adair and Brian suggest!

Frank
 

Coach

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Update: took a few pics of my JPB yesterday

Been following BVF's advice as written in his online book and Adairs about wiring candles verticle (as much as I could).

Reduced needle length by over half. I'm happy with it so far...the exposed root look is still bothering me...needs to be planted much deeper.

ANNNND I know it looks like a 7th grader with head gear...those are probably the crappiest attempts at guy wires anyone has ever shamelessly posted on this site but they are working for the image I am trying to produce with this tree (I see past the mess). Someday I will work with someone who can teach me to wire these things...I knock off bark and bend needles when I get in there...even from approaching underneath :)

Thanks for looking
 

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Adair M

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Update: took a few pics of my JPB yesterday

Been following BVF's advice as written in his online book and Adairs about wiring candles verticle (as much as I could).

Reduced needle length by over half. I'm happy with it so far...the exposed root look is still bothering me...needs to be planted much deeper.

ANNNND I know it looks like a 7th grader with head gear...those are probably the crappiest attempts at guy wires anyone has ever shamelessly posted on this site but they are working for the image I am trying to produce with this tree (I see past the mess). Someday I will work with someone who can teach me to wire these things...I knock off bark and bend needles when I get in there...even from approaching underneath :)

Thanks for looking
Well... the wire you're using to guy wire is much too heavy! Really thin 20 gauge copper wire is surprisingly strong! That's what you should have used to guy wire.
 

ConorDash

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Well... the wire you're using to guy wire is much too heavy! Really thin 20 gauge copper wire is surprisingly strong! That's what you should have used to guy wire.

Also, not to go incredibly indepth in to how to guy wire, as I don't have experience of it myself, just reading knowledge, but those wires should be tight.
As the tree grows, it will bend that wire out and not do its job.
Although maybe the fact you are using way too heavy wire, will stop that..
 

aml1014

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Well... the wire you're using to guy wire is much too heavy! Really thin 20 gauge copper wire is surprisingly strong! That's what you should have used to guy wire.
Exactly, here's a ponderosa I did a 180°bend on this morning. That's only a 2.5mm aluminum wire.20170218_114022.jpg
Aaron
 

Adair M

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Exactly, here's a ponderosa I did a 180°bend on this morning. That's only a 2.5mm aluminum wire.View attachment 132508
Aaron
Aluminum isn't nearly as strong as copper.

Stainless steel is stronger than either!

In Japan, they're using thin SS wire. It's strong, but fairly stiff. I've tried it on a couple of guy wires. If there's going to be a LOT of tension, go with the SS. For moderate tension, copper is much easier to work with.
 

aml1014

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Aluminum isn't nearly as strong as copper.

Stainless steel is stronger than either!

In Japan, they're using thin SS wire. It's strong, but fairly stiff. I've tried it on a couple of guy wires. If there's going to be a LOT of tension, go with the SS. For moderate tension, copper is much easier to work with.
I used SS on my other one, much more torque needed for that bend.

I must add @Coach , the tree looks very healthy and is coming along nicely.

Aaron
 

Eric Group

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Cute little tree.... is anybody else concerned about the color in these new pics? Looks a bright yellow to me.. maybe needs a good organic fert application, probably a nutrient thing? I know they turn a little bit in the winter sometimes, but that one is full on yellow!
 

aml1014

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I know they turn a little bit in the winter sometimes, but that one is full on yellow!
It looks like it's just the sun causing a weird lighting, in the shaded part on the right side of the tree it's dark green and appears healthy. Though I know mime change some weird colors in winter.

Aaron
 

Coach

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Cute little tree.... is anybody else concerned about the color in these new pics? Looks a bright yellow to me.. maybe needs a good organic fert application, probably a nutrient thing? I know they turn a little bit in the winter sometimes, but that one is full on yellow!

I agree...it's not as green as I like it. First pic is today with very little sun influence. Definitely yellow tones at the tips. I haven't fertilized it in 6 months. I just
hit it with some Peters 20-20-20 (it has always responded well to that fert.)

By the way this tree knows yellow :)...the second pic is as purchased from Don Blackmond in Michigan in January of 2014...after 2 days in Texas it went YELLOW!...last pic is the beginning of it's comeback in March of 2014.

Thanks for inspiring me to fertilize Eric...I know it's probably a sin not to for most on this site but I don't fertilize that often.
 

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