Preferred Oaks

Schmikah

Shohin
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Can you tell? The idea of oaks as bonsai actually has me interested. I just don't get this "fired up" about Ficus.

off topic, but I personally get excited about the "root-over-insert stuff" styles, and the speed. They can be cool on their own, but I think the strength is putting it in a scene (if that's what you're into). I personally like a diversified field, fast-growing weeds like ficus and lavender star, mid-range of the coniferous variety, and (as I'm just now moving into) slower growers.
 

Tieball

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Are you thinking of the Gambel oak (q. gambelii)? That's the shrubby oak of the Rockies. Blue oaks are only found in California.
That could be the Oak if seen. I didn’t know what it was....but it was unique to me.
 

Tieball

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Can you tell? The idea of oaks as bonsai actually has me interested. I just don't get this "fired up" about Ficus.
Yes....I can definitely tell. And we share a common interest...Oaks. After reading your Oak posts I feel like I just encountered and learned a great deal at the University of Oaks. And I still have a great deal to learn and absorb. Well done! Mighty fine indeed!
 

Mikecheck123

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Oak biodiversity is centered in North America, with somewhere over 300 species. In states like Tennessee and Kentucky you may have 20 different species of oaks. In Illinois we have more than 10 species. Obviously the Japanese never had access to try any of them for bonsai until only recently. So the range of possibilities is largely untested for bonsai. I would not limit my choices to only those species that have a track record as bonsai, as there has simply been relatively little effort to "test" the many different species.

So which ones to seek out for bonsai? All oaks have fairly coarse branching structure compared to an elm or hackberry (Celtis). So with pretty much all oaks, the best use would be for medium to larger size bonsai. Trunks are the most important feature of bonsai, the appearance of age to a trunk is largely due to texture of the bark. There is a wide range of bark textures in oaks, and the textures are not limited to one group or another.

Evergreen leaves are a feature that occurs in unrelated families of oaks, but in common name parlance, "Live Oak" refers to any evergreen oak. So the use of the term live oak can be misleading. Most of the California live oaks, Q. agrifolia for example, are in the red oak family, where the southern live oak, Q. virigniana is in the white oak family.

Red oak - black oak group of some 80 to 90 species only found in North America & Central America. They most commonly have a flat plate forming bark, like Quercus rubra, the northern red oak, or Q. velutina, the northern black oak. It becomes rough with age, but not very dramatic until advanced age. There are some species with more coarse bark, there are some like the cherry bark oak, Q. pagoda, that have smooth bark almost like a young cherry tree. Some species of the red oak group have smaller leaves, for example the willow oak, Quercus phellos, water oak, Q. nigra, and myrtle oak, Q. myrtifolia. Others, such as black oak, Q. velutina have pretty large leaves.

The White oak group includes the white oak, Q. alba, swamp white oak, Q. bicolor, and the bur oak, Q. macrocarpa, The group is spread through the northern hemisphere, so it includes the English oak Q. robur, but does not include the cork oak Q. suber. Most of the white oak group develop a fissured bark, often fractured into a pattern of squares. Bur oak has the most dramatic bark of the group, followed closely by the white oak and swamp white oak. Some have fairly smooth bark, but the majority have coarse, fissured bark.

So which to choose? I would get the best trunk you can find. Collected trees are the best in terms of collecting a trunk with bark that indicates age.

As a general rule, oaks from seed take considerably more time to develop than an Elm or Zelkova. As a general rule, they are medium to slow growing trees. It will take more than a decade for seedlings to begin to display mature bark patterns.

Leaf reduction, my limited experience seems to be that all the oaks I have tried, all the leaves will reduce a fair amount. You will probably be able to keep leaf size under 2 inches on a mature, well ramified tree. This includes bur oak. Many oaks, when in youthful vigor, will throw very large leaves, my bur oak had leaves 10 inches (25 cm) long. But the same bur oak "calmed down" to leaves about 2 inches (5 cm) long as ramification increased.

So check out what you can find of your local oak species. There are some unique ones out there. Local will be best adapted to your winters. Or seek out stock from further north (colder) areas, so that you can get away with putting little or no effort into wintering your oaks.
Let's not forget this fun fact that is sure to be a hit at cocktail parties: the country with the most oak species in the world is... Mexico.
 

Potawatomi13

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Personally oak have so many interesting leaves just pick what you like and work with it. As said before even Daimyo Oak Quercus dentata with gigantic leaves can be Bonsai'd as evidenced by Burlingame daimyo Oak in Ca. Also has pretty red Fall leaves;). Personally love Q. marilandica, stellata and arkansana.
 

PaulH

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I love oaks. I have a bunch and have killed a few. Fungal diseases seem to be the biggest oak killer next to moth larva, I've lost trees to both. Blue oak, valley oak and english oak seem particularly susceptible to powder mildew in humid conditions. Cork oak are pretty much bomb proof. I' had bet results with coast live oak, interior live oak, cork oak, valley oak, Portuguese oak, holly oak, and israeli oak.
 

Mikecheck123

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I love oaks. I have a bunch and have killed a few. Fungal diseases seem to be the biggest oak killer next to moth larva, I've lost trees to both. Blue oak, valley oak and english oak seem particularly susceptible to powder mildew in humid conditions. Cork oak are pretty much bomb proof. I' had bet results with coast live oak, interior live oak, cork oak, valley oak, Portuguese oak, holly oak, and israeli oak.
Did you ever dig them up? I see so many coast live oaks in ditches around here. Surely no one will miss them.... :)
 

PaulH

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Did you ever dig them up? I see so many coast live oaks in ditches around here. Surely no one will miss them.... :)
I've collected oaks on my own property and with permission on other places. I wouldn't advise digging anywhere without permission.
 

Aaronkslater

Yamadori
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Any advice on digging? I had heard you can’t remove the taproot. Or must do it in stages, true? True or not? I’m excited by what Leo is saying about burr oak. I have been eyeing some up but others have said the leaves don’t reduce so I was hesitant.
 

BrianBay9

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Any advice on digging? I had heard you can’t remove the taproot. Or must do it in stages, true? True or not? I’m excited by what Leo is saying about burr oak. I have been eyeing some up but others have said the leaves don’t reduce so I was hesitant.

I would not assume there is a "one size fits all" approach to digging oaks. I'm getting some experience with coast live oak ( Q agrifolia) in coastal California but I wouldn't expect that experience would translate well to, say pin oaks in the midwest. Be specific about the species and location and you're more likely to get good advice.
 

Leo in N E Illinois

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Any advice on digging? I had heard you can’t remove the taproot. Or must do it in stages, true? True or not? I’m excited by what Leo is saying about burr oak. I have been eyeing some up but others have said the leaves don’t reduce so I was hesitant.

Tap roots, there is a lot of mythology around the issue of tap roots. Most of it is from other areas of horticulture. Tap root is a juvenile feature of a young seedling. It is sent down to anchor the young seedling. Once the tap root forms horizontal roots, the downward growing part is no longer necessary for the health of the tree. It is simply there to anchor the tree in wind, and to seek deep water for drought survival. In a pot especially a bonsai pot, tap roots are a problem. Cut them off immediately. If you are collecting at the correct time of year (during a low water demand season) you can do it all at once. Best if done all at once and not drawn out into a series of reductions.

Late winter, early spring for most is good collection time. Some people defoliate evergreen oaks when they collect them. Consult your local bonsai society and find out what they do in your area.
 

RKatzin

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I'm planning a major oak dig this spring. I'm hoping to bring in at least a dozen trees. I'm digging at 4000' in the Cascade foothills.
There's lots of Canyon Live Oak Q. chrysolepis down lower on the mountain, but up here are a dwarf variety called Huckleberry Oak 'vaccinifolia'. There's also a dwarf White Oak called Brewer's Oak. It's going to be a difficult dig to say the least. It's the top of the mountain, nothing but rock and pockets of dirt. Any locals want to come and have a dig would be warmly welcomed. I'm right between Seattle and Frisco.
 
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I think the red oaks of Texas i.e. Buckley’s oak, Blackjack oak and the hybrid of the two show great promise. Most that I have collected have nice feeder roots and seem to be quite hardy. I dug a couple more large ones that hopefully prove to be great pieces in the future. Texas live oak has been used with good results! There are quite a few scrub oak that are untested that I plan to try collecting in the future.
Below are some of the Texas red oak I collected
 

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Mikecheck123

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I'm planning a major oak dig this spring. I'm hoping to bring in at least a dozen trees. I'm digging at 4000' in the Cascade foothills.
There's lots of Canyon Live Oak Q. chrysolepis down lower on the mountain, but up here are a dwarf variety called Huckleberry Oak 'vaccinifolia'. There's also a dwarf White Oak called Brewer's Oak. It's going to be a difficult dig to say the least. It's the top of the mountain, nothing but rock and pockets of dirt. Any locals want to come and have a dig would be warmly welcomed. I'm right between Seattle and Frisco.
Where's the dig site?
 

oddirt

Mame
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Where's the dig site?
I visited @RKatzin this past fall for yamadori digs and highly recommend the trip. I live across the 92 from you. Well worth the trip. Rick and his wife are wonderful hosts. Just be sure to bare root the trees because Dept of Agriculture will ask when you cross back into CA.
 

Potawatomi13

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Tap roots, there is a lot of mythology around the issue of tap roots. Most of it is from other areas of horticulture. Tap root is a juvenile feature of a young seedling. It is sent down to anchor the young seedling. Once the tap root forms horizontal roots, the downward growing part is no longer necessary for the health of the tree. It is simply there to anchor the tree in wind, and to seek deep water for drought survival. In a pot especially a bonsai pot, tap roots are a problem. Cut them off immediately. If you are collecting at the correct time of year (during a low water demand season) you can do it all at once. Best if done all at once and not drawn out into a series of reductions.

Leo; Personally recommend doing in stages due to shortages of side roots. In stages gives these chance to develop more feeders between removals. Seems intuitive to me;).
 

Potawatomi13

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I think the red oaks of Texas i.e. Buckley’s oak, Blackjack oak and the hybrid of the two show great promise. Most that I have collected have nice feeder roots and seem to be quite hardy. I dug a couple more large ones that hopefully prove to be great pieces in the future. Texas live oak has been used with good results! There are quite a few scrub oak that are untested that I plan to try collecting in the future.
Below are some of the Texas red oak I collected

Excellent wonderful potential😍!
 
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