Problem? Common Pear

ConorDash

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Hey,

Just wanted to sound this out, see if there is a potential problem or not.

Potentially this is just general wearing and leaves changing with fall but looks more fungal issue to me, personally. Its my first year with a Common Pear though.
The pear has these looking leaves:
DSC_0943 by Conor Dashwood, on Flickr
DSC_0942 by Conor Dashwood, on Flickr

Not all, just some, perhaps.. 10% of the tree.

DSC_0944 by Conor Dashwood, on Flickr

They have continued and are a bit more yellowing now, since the pics last week.

Problem or not?

It has been treated normally, rotation of 2 different fungicides.. So even if it is a problem.. Im already using all my stuff! Lol
 

ConorDash

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Any ideas?

I’m thinking it’s just the natural coloration for winter but it very much looks like a problem..
The leaves turn mostly yellow and are very easily knocked off.
 

0soyoung

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I dunno, but if it is indeed fungal, the affected leaves are spore sources. As you know, the SOP is to remove the affected leaves and spray. The alternative to spraying a fungicide is continually treating the tree with a systemic fungicide. Just about every tree has 'worn-out' leaves this time of year and this may be normal for yours. I would be very concerned if this was happening in spring or summer.

I have a so-called 'evergreen pear' that isn't evergreen in my climate. Leaves get very sad looking and this year are dropping now. Further, I found a leaf gall on it earlier this year. First time I've seen it on any of my plants. I removed the affected leaves and sprayed two or three times this summer and it stopped showing up. Then, the canopy nice healthy green leaves got ugly reddish colored a little over a month ago and started falling off, sorta one-at-a-time. I expect it to pop leaves and grow vigorously next spring, just like previous years. Look closely - as long as there are buds, it is alive.
 

ConorDash

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Thanks for the reply.

Looking online, I believe it’s Fabraea leaf spot. I’ve gone through and removed all the leaves affected. May be a few leaves remaining that are barely affected. I’ve removed a lot, sprayed thoroughly with something that lists leaf spot.

I don’t believe the tree is unhealthy, buds all over ready for spring. I’m not concerned yet, hopefully this measure will do well.

The annoying thing is that I have been very on top of the systemic sprays this season.. rotating pest and fungicide, spraying every 2-3 weeks. So this shouldn’t have happened... but, I guess nothing is 100% safe.
 

parhamr

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Minor shot-hole fungus, possibly. (Though you’re probably right in your assessment!)

We have quite similar climates and, around here, the Rosaceae have quite a latent disease load. I give regular prophylactic sprays and then respray specific problem trees.

Now that you’ve replied… wow, that’s frequent spraying. Maybe you’ll have more success with heavier sprays done less frequently? Or, it’s time to find a new systemic fungicide. I’ve had luck with Thiophanate-methyl (Cleary’s 3336) and chlorothalonil (Daconil) with treatments of copper spray in between.

This particular plant may be a bit too wet, too. Maybe it’ll benefit from gently aerating the soil and a slightly different position in the yard?
 

ConorDash

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Hmm you May be right. I’ve always thought fortnightly was the typical frequency but I believe at least 1 of my fungicide’s is quite strong (Says a maximum of 2 applications per year). So perhaps I’ll adjust frequency.

Yeah I’m fully on the prevention train.. I’ll continue to spray on a rotation and schedule. My worst night is watching a tree slowly die from a fungus whilst I’m confused and not knowing what to do.. I’ve 3 bottles of a rose clear 2-1 spray and basically the whole range of Bug Clear solutions to dilute.. ensuring I’ve got 3 different pesticides and 2 different fungicides..

This tree was a new buy, 20/05 this year. It’s soil is very sandy, it’s very well draining.. so I’m happy with that (although took getting used to with its watering), but good point well made.
 
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I know a pear orchard owner. She recognizes the issue but she and her biocide expert have never found a way to combat it. It's not a priority either, because it happens when the fruit is almost fully grown already and doesn't seem to affect the quality.
"Pears just do this at the end of the year."
That doesn't mean it can't be fixed though, we just don't know how.
 

ConorDash

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I know a pear orchard owner. She recognizes the issue but she and her biocide expert have never found a way to combat it. It's not a priority either, because it happens when the fruit is almost fully grown already and doesn't seem to affect the quality.
"Pears just do this at the end of the year."
That doesn't mean it can't be fixed though, we just don't know how.
You mean my specific issue, from my pics?

Also I’ve no fruit, just leaves + from online reading it mostly happens at the end of the year. So the leaves are mostly spent anyway, not much loss to remove them. Although I hear the fall leaf colour is very lovely. . But in Bonsai we learn to sacrifice aesthetics for a few years..

Are you saying your friend and the expert positively identified my specific issue as the leaf spot I mentioned? If so that’s great as it means I know what it is for sure, at least. Most don’t get that bonus
 
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You mean my specific issue, from my pics?

Also I’ve no fruit, just leaves + from online reading it mostly happens at the end of the year. So the leaves are mostly spent anyway, not much loss to remove them. Although I hear the fall leaf colour is very lovely. . But in Bonsai we learn to sacrifice aesthetics for a few years..

Are you saying your friend and the expert positively identified my specific issue as the leaf spot I mentioned? If so that’s great as it means I know what it is for sure, at least. Most don’t get that bonus
I've shown them the pictures and they said this has been a common thing for as long as the the orchard is there. Sometimes it's just hail damage, sometimes insect damage that turns blackish over the months due to abscission, it might very well be anything else. All they care about is the fruit and since the fruit isn't affected, and since it seems to be a common thing, they did not go further into identifying or combating the issue. They can't spray too much of anything when there's fruit either, so they just live with it. And they have been doing so for 40+ years.

If you'd like, I can ask another orchard owner that does his own diagnostics and has his own spraying license, the one I have asked previously hires a professional who deems the issue a non-issue ("it just happens"). But I think there's a fat chance the latter orchard owner is going to say the same. I honestly haven't seen pear trees without black spots or heavily damaged foliage in autumn in 25 years.

The fall colors on them are still great! But I believe the trees in shows have the bad stuff removed prior to exhibitions.
 

ConorDash

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I've shown them the pictures and they said this has been a common thing for as long as the the orchard is there. Sometimes it's just hail damage, sometimes insect damage that turns blackish over the months due to abscission, it might very well be anything else. All they care about is the fruit and since the fruit isn't affected, and since it seems to be a common thing, they did not go further into identifying or combating the issue. They can't spray too much of anything when there's fruit either, so they just live with it. And they have been doing so for 40+ years.

If you'd like, I can ask another orchard owner that does his own diagnostics and has his own spraying license, the one I have asked previously hires a professional who deems the issue a non-issue ("it just happens"). But I think there's a fat chance the latter orchard owner is going to say the same. I honestly haven't seen pear trees without black spots or heavily damaged foliage in autumn in 25 years.

The fall colors on them are still great! But I believe the trees in shows have the bad stuff removed prior to exhibitions.
No that’s more than enough, thank you buddy. I appreciate you going to the time for me. I feel much more at ease in knowing that :). I would like to see some fall colours but it’s all about building the branch structure so that in future it’ll look even better in fall. Might see at least a few this year, will see :).

I’ll know not to worry when it happens again too. That’s great, thank you.
One day my tree will produce some fruit.

If your friends ever pass on any other pearls of wisdom about the pear tree, do let me know :).
It was bought in its current soil which seems to just be a very sandy “dirt”. Well draining, gets dry fast. I don’t think it’ll require repotting in spring but I’ll investigate.
 

ConorDash

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So I removed all those leaves and treated, to see how it reacted.

it reacted by spreading very quickly! I would guess whatever I did was too late and it was already in the rest of the foliage. But it’s good to know, I learnt from that.. I’m just learning how this leaf spot reacts and spreads, as it seems I’ll be living with it a good bit.

Less than a week from no leaves showing signs, it now looks like this:

0E02CA77-8F23-410D-9EE8-4A55B12FD455.jpeg
6695772E-4766-48E8-99CA-B93EA30F5D3E.jpeg
2A019C98-40AB-4D51-A5B9-15D02BE4FC4A.jpeg
5FD90328-A384-485C-82EA-45CF6CF403CF.jpeg
it spread and took hold very fast! I’ve now removed all leaves.
 

ConorDash

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I left 2 younger shoots that were very green.
Another experiment to see if the fungus infects them too.

701C06EC-1403-4EFF-BBE2-B56D6BFC38DF.jpeg
 

KiwiPlantGuy

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Hi Conner,
My opinion FWIW, is that this isn’t a problem that needs fixing. Looks very much like Autumn colour, and @0soyoung says, I would be way more concerned if these symptoms appear pre and post longest day. If then you probably will get leaf drop and protectant spray as you have done this season will keep it away. Also consider that with cooler nights and more humidity via rain or dew, the fungi will take over, a bit like black spot on my roses in my garden.
Let us know late Spring etc if the problem appears, or I wouldn’t worry about it and give your other bonsai projects more time.
Charles
 

ConorDash

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No I’m not worried, for once :).
@Wires_Guy_wires put my mind at rest, thankfully. All leaves gone now, so no problem. If it continues to happen each autumn then it’s a shame but I can experiment with trying to prevent it. The yellow golden leaves would be great to see but it’s got some years of develop ahead of it first. I don’t think the fungus can affect branches in the same way..
 

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