Question about pruning Japanese Maple and Elm tree

bonsaichile

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Hi! I have an Acer palmatum and a Ulmus x hollandica "Jacqueline Hillier" that I am developing. My question is: I have heard that I could do some structural pruning to increase ramification in the Fall, up to two weeks after leaf drop. Is that correct? Also, if I prune now for ramification and then let the branches grow freely during the next growth season, to prune them back in the following Fall, will that help me develop the trunk? I basically want the trees to gain in height (both are about 7 inches tall now).

Thank you!
 

sorce

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Is that correct?

Yes.

But the rest is incomplete.

Of course...

You can let your tree grow an inch taller, but will that give you the height you want?
How about in relation to the girth?

Any growth and time will develop the trunk, But if you prune it you are slowing it down.

Pics. Pics. Pics.

You can let the elm run rampant till you have the trunk you want...cut it to nothing, and continue.

Maple isn't much more difficult, but you will ONLY get new branches where there are previous nodes.
So a little more thought/care must be put into it.

Pics and more clear goals are required.

Sorce
 

AlainK

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Ulmus x hollandica 'Jacqueline Hillier'

... often drop twigs or even branches in winter.

In my opinion, it's better to prune when you see if there are live buds on a branch, that is, just after buds begin to open.

Maples? Any time, with proper care.
 

M. Frary

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develop the trunk
For that you don't cut any branches until it's as fat as you want. One thing at a time. Always grow the trunk first then think aboutbranches. The ramifications part is the last step.
 

bonsaichile

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Thank you for your advice, everybody. I will sit down and wait before doing anything on this one. As for the maple tree, I am trying to develop a new root system above the ugly graft. I put a wire ring around the place where I want the new roots, and planted it just above that. Hopefully, I will be able to have a graft-less tree in a couple of years!
 

bonsaichile

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A couple more questions: Should I start working this Spring on developing the nebari? If so, would the ebihara method for maples work on this elm?

Thank you!
 

aml1014

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A couple more questions: Should I start working this Spring on developing the nebari? If so, would the ebihara method for maples work on this elm?

Thank you!
Ebihara method works for basically any deciduous tree. I'll be screwing about 100 maples and I don't even know how many elms to plywood this spring. I stoked!

Aaron
 

bonsaichile

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The developed tree you have shown is a broom style. Are you planning on making yours a broom?

Yes, TwistedTrees, I always thought of this elm as a future broom style. But probably once it doubles its current height.
 

Smoke

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Some of these replies make this sound so easy.... If it were, this place would be a treasure trove of beautiful bonsai. It isn't.

My advice from someone who grows trees from even seed being able to control my every move is, It ain't that easy. Many of these replies are telling you to grow it until it reaches the size you want then chop it or cut it back. Well everything also grows inordinately large also. Branches too big, internodes too long, leaves too large, roots too large.

Building a tree is exactly that, BUILDING a tree. It starts with good nebari and good trunks and great branches. All of that in scale and proportion. How you wire from the beginning and how you wire at the end may be different. Your skills will get better and what you thought was good 5 years ago may be raffle material today.

Here are two pictures of small pines by two different growers. You tell be which pine you would like to start with. Each are about 6 years old. It is easy to see that these two different growers are at different levels of technique and expertise than the other. On is developing movement and branches low early while the other does not understand the importance of this with growing a plant early. Like I said if this was easy, they would both have the same material. It's not easy.

DSC_00190007.JPG

DSC_00390039.JPG
 
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Yes, TwistedTrees, I always thought of this elm as a future broom style. But probably once it doubles its current height.
The structure of the tree does not seem correct for a larger style broom. A typical broom style has a straight trunk until the broom begins. Your tree has this straight trunk already. Trying to make the trunk taller will cause movement in the trunk. It looks like you already have a good broom start, just in a smaller tree than you might be envisioning.
 

bonsaichile

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The structure of the tree does not seem correct for a larger style broom. A typical broom style has a straight trunk until the broom begins. Your tree has this straight trunk already. Trying to make the trunk taller will cause movement in the trunk. It looks like you already have a good broom start, just in a smaller tree than you might be envisioning.

So you suggest I keep it as a small shohin (it is now about 7 inches tall) and start working on nebari and ramification? Will the trunk get some movement even if I don't chop it, just let it grow? Sorry, I know this are a lot of questions, but I like this tree and I would like it to be as good as it can be!
 
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Broom style are not typically known for trunk movement. The existing part of the tree that you would let grow is not straight. I would start the ramification process just above where the straight part of the trunk stops. Perhaps that first left heavy branch should be removed and prune back heavily the remaining branches.
 
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So you suggest I keep it as a small shohin (it is now about 7 inches tall) and start working on nebari and ramification? Will the trunk get some movement even if I don't chop it, just let it grow? Sorry, I know this are a lot of questions, but I like this tree and I would like it to be as good as it can be!
Here is a good image of a broom style structure.
hokidachi.jpg
 

sorce

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