Questions About Developing Nebari

[Zathura]

I'm super new to the hobby, and after watching tons of videos and reading articles, I only have a couple questions that nobody seems to address or give the information I'm looking for....

Do exposed roots continue to grow and get larger or do they stop growing as they dry out? Do you have to leave them covered until they get to the size you want before exposing them? It's confusing. I don't know whether I should be trying to expose roots early or trying to goad more uniform growth under the soil before uncovering them.

Also, if there's an obvious gap in the roots, is it possible to scar the bark at the soil line, maybe dab it with some rooting hormone, and cover it in sphagnum? I don't really want to go the tourniquet route if I don't have to.

TIA

 

[leatherback]

I prefer to leave the roots below soil as long as possible. thicker roots do not die when they are exposed. But once exposed, no side-roots ill develop. And for nebari development is it nice to have them.

If you do proper rootwork, over years you will get more roots in the nebari, but allways a gamble hoping for them in the right spot.. I think too many people jump too quickly to layering. I prefer roots to be unevenly sized!

 

[Adair M]

I'm super new to the hobby, and after watching tons of videos and reading articles, I only have a couple questions that nobody seems to address or give the information I'm looking for....

Do exposed roots continue to grow and get larger or do they stop growing as they dry out? Do you have to leave them covered until they get to the size you want before exposing them? It's confusing. I don't know whether I should be trying to expose roots early or trying to goad more uniform growth under the soil before uncovering them.

Also, if there's an obvious gap in the roots, is it possible to scar the bark at the soil line, maybe dab it with some rooting hormone, and cover it in sphagnum? I don't really want to go the tourniquet route if I don't have to.

TIA

All these questions, and more!, are answered in the most excellent thread by MarkyScott titled “Ebihara Maples”.

 

[PA_Penjing]

Also, bonsai today issue number 17 goes really into depth with all of this.

 

[Tieball]

I prefer to leave the roots below soil as long as possible. I think too many people jump too quickly to layering. I prefer roots to be unevenly sized!

I agree. That uneven rooting is quite attractive...like the tree is doing it’s job. To many air layers tend to look totally forced and unnatural....not all of them....but many of them that I see.

 

[Zathura]

All these questions, and more!, are answered in the most excellent thread by MarkyScott titled “Ebihara Maples”.

I just checked out the thread. I'd already been planning on trying this technique of growing on top of a flat surface (though the visuals and detail in the thread were much appreciated). Still questioning when and how much to expose at a time, though. I've yet to check out the issue of bonsai today that PA_Penjing recommended. Is that something available to read for free? (Sorry, I'm currently juggling errands and gardening work while checking this thread intermittently.)

 

[leatherback]

Still questioning when and how much to expose at a time

 

[TomB]

Keep the roots (well) buried until you feel they are 'done' and ready to be on show.

 

[Zathura]

Okay, good to know, guys. Thank you!

 

[sorce]

Welcome to Crazy!

It depends on the species, the thickness, the watering habits....
You have to observe for these.

It's better to err to safer, more covered, since some exposed skinnies won't die, but they won't thicken either. Which can lead to too lopsidedness.

Imagine the soil line as a water line, as it "drains", the height is exposed level.

So while here...
Though that long forward root can be exposed itself, you can't expose it without exposing every other bit that shouldn't be exposed. So the green or just below is ok, since you may also have a layer of moss.

Moss changes things significantly.

The only downside to covering too much, is new roots growing too high. Which may have to be removed, which may leave ugly scars. Other than that, it's always better to keep em covered.

Sorce

 

[Zathura]

Welcome to Crazy!

It depends on the species, the thickness, the watering habits....
You have to observe for these.

It's better to err to safer, more covered, since some exposed skinnies won't die, but they won't thicken either. Which can lead to too lopsidedness.

Imagine the soil line as a water line, as it "drains", the height is exposed level.

So while here...View attachment 333505
Though that long forward root can be exposed itself, you can't expose it without exposing every other bit that shouldn't be exposed. So the green or just below is ok, since you may also have a layer of moss.

Moss changes things significantly.

The only downside to covering too much, is new roots growing too high. Which may have to be removed, which may leave ugly scars. Other than that, it's always better to keep em covered.

Sorce

That is exactly the kind of explanation I was looking for! I've been lurking the forums for a couple months and seen your name pop up quite a few times, always with a wealth of information. Thanks so much for taking the time to help.

 

[ConorDash]

Lol someone said that SORCE's explanation was the one they were looking for and made the MOST sense!

I don't swear often, but what the almighty fuck is going on with that?!

 

[Zathura]

Lol someone said that SORCE's explanation was the one they were looking for and made the MOST sense!

I don't swear often, but what the almighty fuck is going on with that?!

Oh...is there some internal politics going on or something? It made sense to me, but again, I don't know much. What's wrong with what he said?

 

[ConorDash]

Oh...is there some internal politics going on or something? It made sense to me, but again, I don't know much. What's wrong with what he said?

Not at all, Sorce is very good with advice. As you said earlier.

He is just infamous for his posts sometimes not making full sense.. in an earthbound language.

 

[Zathura]

Not at all, Sorce is very good with advice. As you said earlier.

He is just infamous for his posts sometimes not making full sense.. in an earthbound language.

Got it, haha. I guess it parsed well in my head, because I understood what he was talking about.

I'm....gonna go back to lurking. If I keep my current plants alive over the winter and throughout next year, maybe I'll be active here a little (honestly it's a bit over my head, most of it. I don't feel like learning half a foreign-language or be judged on how I'm growing things, but thank you guys for all the help!)

 

[Shibui]

Roots can, and do thicken when exposed above ground. They are just another part of the tree. If the trunk and branches above ground can thicken exposed to air then so can the roots. The key is how much sap and energy is passing along. Stronger roots with lots of tips tend to thicken faster than small skinny ones that supply less sap to the tree above. Keeping them covered when small makes lots of sense as it gives the root a chance to develop more feeders and therefore supply more to the trunk. The more it supplies the quicker it will grow and thicken.
Nebari also looks better when the roots are tapered and ramified so keeping them covered also makes sense in order to promote more side roots to get better ramified roots which will also promote taper in the roots and give you opportunities for pruning them later to improve the look even more.
Pruning vertical roots as hard as possible makes the tree rely more on the remaining lateral roots and increases flow through them and that has a very big impact on how fast and well those lateral roots develop.

Cutting the bark in places you want roots will often produce new roots provided the area is then well covered and kept damp. This is just a modified partial layer. There are some provisos:
Some species do not root well and are unlikely to produce new roots no matter what techniques are used.
Just like branches above, if there are lots of strong roots nearby the tree may be reluctant to start more and the cuts simply heal over. Drilling holes and inserting matchsticks or tooth picks or similar keeps the cut open longer and may help produce roots. Pruning branches hard can stimulate back budding and pruning roots hard can also stimulate new roots both from the pruned ones and from the trunk nearby.
Rooting hormone applied to the cambium when removing bark should help roots start.
I've found that new roots produced this way tend to be quite slow to develop as the tree is using the existing roots for most of its needs. After the new roots are reasonably well established pruning the stronger roots fairly hard can help the new ones develop but always bear in mind how well the species responds to root reduction.