Randy Knight

[Brian Underwood]

I just read through the last post of someone simply asking for his contact info, and getting a hundred responses from people who THINK his material is too expensive, or other assumptions with absolutely no real knowledge of the subject. Has anyone here ever been to Randy's? Have you ever spoken with him in person? I have. He is not only an incredibly nice guy, but he knows his stuff, and truly is the most prolific collector in the US.

I visited his place last November fully intent on buying A spruce to go along with one of my favorite trees ever; an Engelmann from Michael Hagedorn. I ended up buying 3. And for less than $500. No, they were not the height of collected trees, they were not the best of the best, those will cost you a pretty penny and rightfully so, but they were what I wanted. I wanted another Literati to play with and style from scratch, so I bought two. And hiding among them was a sweet little cascade, so I bought that too.

The sheer volume of trees he has is staggering. There were hundreds and hundreds littering his property. It was seriously overwhelming, but I knew exactly what I wanted and Randy showed me the few places they were. They're mostly organized by collection time and species, with an area for the cream of the crop. The 3 I bought were collected less than 2 months before I loaded them into my truck. Randy assured me they would make it, and if one happened to perish (not due to my own negligence), he would replace it. He had said Walter Pall was coming up in the next week or so and would likely purchase around half his new stock, so I knew I had to act fast


The $10,000 trees are there of course, and worth it if you think about where they came from and how many centuries they have been alive, but I don't have the skill to do them justice (nor the money), so those are off the table for me. But Randy has all kinds of material and I will be back this November to purchase something a little better, and I'll probably be back again after that.

 

[Djtommy]

I love to see them, pictures?

 

[fore]

when are you going to be there Brian? I'll be there 11/19-22 for Ryan's class.

 

[rockm]

I just read through the last post of someone simply asking for his contact info, and getting a hundred responses from people who THINK his material is too expensive, or other assumptions with absolutely no real knowledge of the subject. Has anyone here ever been to Randy's? Have you ever spoken with him in person? I have. He is not only an incredibly nice guy, but he knows his stuff, and truly is the most prolific collector in the US.

I visited his place last November fully intent on buying A spruce to go along with one of my favorite trees ever; an Engelmann from Michael Hagedorn. I ended up buying 3. And for less than $500. No, they were not the height of collected trees, they were not the best of the best, those will cost you a pretty penny and rightfully so, but they were what I wanted. I wanted another Literati to play with and style from scratch, so I bought two. And hiding among them was a sweet little cascade, so I bought that too.

The sheer volume of trees he has is staggering. There were hundreds and hundreds littering his property. It was seriously overwhelming, but I knew exactly what I wanted and Randy showed me the few places they were. They're mostly organized by collection time and species, with an area for the cream of the crop. The 3 I bought were collected less than 2 months before I loaded them into my truck. Randy assured me they would make it, and if one happened to perish (not due to my own negligence), he would replace it. He had said Walter Pall was coming up in the next week or so and would likely purchase around half his new stock, so I knew I had to act fast


The $10,000 trees are there of course, and worth it if you think about where they came from and how many centuries they have been alive, but I don't have the skill to do them justice (nor the money), so those are off the table for me. But Randy has all kinds of material and I will be back this November to purchase something a little better, and I'll probably be back again after that.

FWIW, I bought a tree sourced from Randy Knight from a nursery here on the east coast. I've also purchased trees from Andy Smith. I've had very uneven results with the western collected trees not bought from Andy.

In my experience, Golden Arrow's trees were hardier and ALOT cheaper, with some under $100 if you were fast enough to get one of his "burlap specials." Do know that if you want high-end conifers, Knight is the place to go. If you want a sturdy tree that will be able to cope with conditions east of the Mississippi and especially South, I'd go to Andy. That's my experience.

Doesn't mean Randy doesn't have great trees, just means as an East Coast bonsai-ist, I recommend Andy Smith, as that's what I've had the most success with stuff from him.

 

[0soyoung]

FWIW, I bought a tree sourced from Randy Knight from a nursery here on the east coast. I've also purchased trees from Andy Smith. I've had very uneven results with the western collected trees not bought from Andy.

... just curious ...
Am I to understand that you bought ponderosa pines, say, from both and that Andy's were healthier?
And, is Andy the only collector you bought from directly (i.e., all others were via a third party)?

 

[fore]

Well I have RM Junipers and P.Pines from Randy and they are thriving here in Chicago.

 

[rockm]

I knew posting my experience would be taken as some kind of insult or something.

FWIW, growing western collected conifers in the South and Southeast is nothing like growing them in colder northern or western areas, especially for someone with no experience. The long hot humid summers and relatively mild winters in the Southern U.S. don't present ideal conditions for them. This is truer the further South you go. Arid zone conifers, California Junipers in particular, have all manner of issues in this area. The National Arboretum has had to be very careful with the several Cal. junipers in it collection, and almost lost a great one because it was too wet.

My experience might be a fluke, who knows?

 

[0soyoung]

I knew posting my experience would be taken as some kind of insult or something.

FWIW, growing western collected conifers in the South and Southeast is nothing like growing them in colder northern or western areas, especially for someone with no experience. The long hot humid summers and relatively mild winters in the Southern U.S. don't present ideal conditions for them. This is truer the further South you go. Arid zone conifers, California Junipers in particular, have all manner of issues in this area. The National Arboretum has had to be very careful with the several Cal. junipers in it collection, and almost lost a great one because it was too wet.

My experience might be a fluke, who knows?

Do you have any idea about the environmental conditions of St. Helens, OR where Randy lives?

 

[rockm]

I know it's not Virginia or much less Texas. And yeah, I used to live in Wash. state.

 

[0soyoung]

I know it's not Virginia or much less Texas. And yeah, I used to live in Wash. state.

It is humid.
It often hits 100+F in the summer, though it is generally cooler than DC.
It rarely snows.

 

[Dav4]

It is humid.
It often hits 100+F in the summer, though it is generally cooler than DC.
It rarely snows.

Absolutely not the same...

 

[rockm]

It is humid.
It often hits 100+F in the summer, though it is generally cooler than DC.
It rarely snows.

"Often"? ;-) How many days in a row and for how many months?

St. Helens is near Portland? July average temp in Portland is 82, Days exceeding 93°F or dropping below 66°F only one day in ten.
https://weatherspark.com/averages/31237/7/Portland-Oregon-United-States

Average July temp in St. Helens -82

Average July temps in D.C. 89 ,average relative humidity is 65 percent, exceeding 96°F or dropping below 79°F only one day in ten. August is worse, with 89-86 the average. We average well into the mid-80s well into Sept.,while Portland is into the mid-low 70s
https://weatherspark.com/averages/30032/7/Arlington-County-District-of-Columbia-United-States
https://weather-and-climate.com/average-monthly-Rainfall-Temperature-Sunshine,Washington-DC,United-States-of-America

The original poster is in Texas. He was asking how western collected species would do down there. I answered that it might be a little iffy. The climate there, and most of the Southern U.S. and Gulf Coast--as many of the bonsaiists who have tried these species there can attest--is considerably more challenging --

Average july temp in Dallas - 96
http://www.bestplaces.net/climate/city/oregon/st._helens
http://www.accuweather.com/en/us/dallas-tx/75202/july-weather/351194

Dallas August temps this year averaged close to 100--it doesn't "often" hit 100 there. It's mostly 100 there all day, everyday through September--and that's true for a lot of Texas.
http://www.accuweather.com/en/us/dallas-tx/75202/august-weather/351194?monyr=8/1/2015

There are significant differences in climate here. The east coast and the South are very different than the Pacific Northwest. There is a reason western conifers-from Ponderosa to western junipers--aren't native east of the Mississippi--climate is a big reason.

 

[fore]

I knew posting my experience would be taken as some kind of insult or something.

FWIW, growing western collected conifers in the South and Southeast is nothing like growing them in colder northern or western areas, especially for someone with no experience. The long hot humid summers and relatively mild winters in the Southern U.S. don't present ideal conditions for them. This is truer the further South you go. Arid zone conifers, California Junipers in particular, have all manner of issues in this area. The National Arboretum has had to be very careful with the several Cal. junipers in it collection, and almost lost a great one because it was too wet.

My experience might be a fluke, who knows?

Not insulted at all rockm. Just sharing my experience here in IL. But, I do agree with you, the South isn't the envir. that'll make most conifers thrive. Although, I think this is mostly non-juniper. I recall once when Ryan mentioned RMJs doing well in San Diego...heat and wind.

 

[0soyoung]

Heat, yes. High humidity, no.

 

[rockm]

Not insulted at all rockm. Just sharing my experience here in IL. But, I do agree with you, the South isn't the envir. that'll make most conifers thrive. Although, I think this is mostly non-juniper. I recall once when Ryan mentioned RMJs doing well in San Diego...heat and wind.

The South and Mid Atlantic states harbor ten to thirteen species of pine. Western states, not including Mexico, only have a few more, like 15-17.

Old growth Southern pine, especially Loblolly and longleaf, can be spectacular in height and bulk. It's not the climate. Pines do well in these areas, just not western Ponderosa et. al.
http://forestandrange.org/southernpine/pine species/index.htm

 

[rockm]

Heat, yes. High humidity, no.

So a 96-98 degree day in D.C. with 65-70 percent humidity is equal to a typical summer day in Portland?

 

[Brian Underwood]

Sorry guys, been MIA for a while. I don't have any pictures of Randy's place, it was far too cold to think about taking pictures at the time (about 20 degrees and most of the pots were frozen to the ground). I will be taking pictures of the spruces soon because I'll be starting all the major work on them this month. I'll post as soon as I get around to working on them.

 

[KennedyMarx]

Patiently awaiting pics.

 

[sdavis]

Patiently awaiting pics.

Here are some pics from 2015

 

[Paradox]

Does he sell online or is there a way to see some of the trees he is selling or what he sells?