Sequoiadendron giganteum advice

Icarus

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Hi guys I am new to Bonsai. I planted 50 seeds for my Daughter's college project and a year on I have 24 8" seedlings. I fancy trying out the art of bonsai.

I have been told this type of tree is difficult but I really would like to try. Am I right in leaving them to grow for three years before attempting to repot in a flat pot?

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks20220404_221303.jpg20220320_130516.jpg20220806_001122-1.jpg
 

Rivian

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I had a larger one but it died over Winter. Not sure why
I hope youre growing it outside
 

Arnold

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They have a strong apical dominance, so pinching the apex could be useful to promote lower growth, in UK they should be able to grow all yeat outside right?
 

Icarus

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They have a strong apical dominance, so pinching the apex could be useful to promote lower growth, in UK they should be able to grow all yeat outside right?
I kept all seedlings indoors for the first 8 months. In the Summer all but one went outside. I water daily. They like full sun. I live in Devon and we experienced very sunny weather. Outside the trees have thicker trunks (due to the wind I think). Indoors the tree is nearly twice the size of the others but has a thinner trunk. So far the needles are a beauitiful green. So should I start pruning now? I nipped the mainstem on one as an experiment and within a week a secondary branch replaced it. At present they are growing about 2 inches a month. They are dormant for about 6 months during the winter.
 
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Icarus

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OK I practiced pruning (shaping) on a couple of my trees first one was a disaster. Here is my fourth attempt. 😀 May be a little early but the upper branches were cutting out the light to the lower ones.
Before:
20220823_124959.jpg20220821_170947.jpg

After:
20220823_124450.jpg20220823_134727.jpg

Doesn't look a lot different but a took quite a lot off and pinched all the small buds on the trunk.
 
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rockm

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You're going about this in a way that is slowing you down, and putting the trees at a significant disadvantage.

You are in southern England, correct? If so, your climate is not a problem to grow all of these completely outdoors. Inside they will die--the long thinner trunk are not due to lack of wind, but to lack of sunlight. You may get a season or two more out of them inside, as sequoias are strong growers, but after that you will likely see them start to weaken and then die.

The inside trees are stretching to get at light, that's what happens in darker understory of the forest when they are over topped by much larger trees. The trees outside are more robust because of the better light, humidity and overall growing conditions.

Sequoia were introduced in the U.K. back in the mid 1800s. THere is a large grove of them over in Wales.

and other sites


Best thing to do is allow the trees to grow unabated--pruning them now only slows them down with no real benefit. You're after a trunk to work with, not a seedling. To get a decent trunk the tree needs to add eight and top growth, the more top growth, the fatter the trunk. Could take a few years. I'd grow what you have in a container left outside protected from the worst of the winter--if you have temps below 0 C.
 

Icarus

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Thanks. Great information. In Exeter I can't get permission to plant my seedlings outside as they are classed as a non native tree.I will anyway.

I never pruned the roots and they are in large pots so I will take your advice and leave them outside from now on.

I will post the results in a few years...
 

rockm

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Thanks. Great information. In Exeter I can't get permission to plant my seedlings outside as they are classed as a non native tree.I will anyway.

I never pruned the roots and they are in large pots so I will take your advice and leave them outside from now on.

I will post the results in a few years...
I wouldn't necessarily plant these in the ground. They will likely do fine in a largish container for a while--increasing container size as the trees grow. Obviously the ground is better for bulking up, but I wouldn't break any laws to get them there. Containerized trees are a bit easier to handle as they can be moved if weather demands (deep freezes for instance) also containerized roots are easier to handle and more conducive to bonsai culture. Planting them in the ground would entail having to collect them--digging up big root balls mostly at the expense of the tree's health--it takes longer for a collected tree to recover than a repotted tree...You also will not gain much benefit from ground growing until the trees have been in the ground for at least five years. If you plan on digging them up before five years, you might as well keep them in a pot.
 

Drcuisine

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As has already been mentioned these trees are very apically dominant. It’s not uncommon for lower branches to die off without reason. until the trunk gets about an inch in diameter I would simply grow the tree outside in a big pot or often dig a hole and put the pot in the ground if I don’t want to be bothered watering it all the time.

they can tolerate fairly dry or wet conditions but the native habitat is hot and dry.
 

Icarus

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Thanks for that. I did a daily time lapse photo and can clearly see the new top branches are formed in a spiral cutting out all light to the lower branches which get spindly. 20 years ago I grew some other redwoods to about 4 foot tall. All the branches below a foot died off. That was my reasoning cutting back early. Anyway time will tell. I have so many and I have only messed with four. This forum is a great help - thanks to all. I'll post photos from next Spring. Good luck with your projects.
 

Drcuisine

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It has previously been mentioned these trees are strongly epically dominant. It’s not uncommon for lower branches to just die off. They also produce profuse branching and need to be trimmed higher up to avoid reverse taper depending on what you are trying to achieve. Standard for this is formal upright. They will grow very tall A bit like a young coastal but more upright. The ones in the pictures are three years old. I wanted to see what happened if you turned it upside down because of apical dominance so I bent one of them into a full cascade. The second one I made a semi cascade and the third one is just upright. these are three years old. I thought putting the tree upside down would encourage proximal (now apically dominant) lower branches to grow. The trunks are very flexible when young and the last one was just me seeing how much I could bend the thing. trying to make it look like some kind of giraffe. Time will tell
 

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Leo in N E Illinois

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@Drcuisine - good luck with the cascade and semi-cascade styles. My experience is any trunk bent below horizontal pretty much died within a few months, but your mileage may be different.

If I were starting new Sequoiadendron, I would not go below 45 degrees off vertical with the trunk. I've had poor results with recumbent Sequoia trunks. Pretty much goes for the whole family, Sequoia, Sequoiadendron, Metasequoia and Taxodium, they all want to be vertical. It's their natural habit to be upright.

Bonsai is about appearance, several cultivars of juniper can look very much like sequoia, and the junipers are much more tolerant of "bonsai techniques". Juniperus chinensis even have reddish bark. One could simulate a Sequoia Grove with upright junipers or maybe with "sugi" the Japanese cedars.
 

Icarus

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Hi guys, after reviewing previous photos I see my Redwood will start regrowth from the 2nd week of March. I decided to start shaping/pruning it. Before I try my hand at wiring I have a couple of questions please. Should I keep main branches in steps and on each side of the trunk? Also when wiring should I ensure branches are inline e.g. same angle and same direction. Any advice/photos would be greatly appreciated. 🤔
 

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dbonsaiw

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I decided to start shaping/pruning it.
Has your tree reached the point of development where this is needed? When I get a tree, I try to imagine what I want the tree to ultimately look like and then try to figure out how to get it there. Is my nebari set up to grow properly? Has my trunk reached the thickness I want? Do I want more movement/taper? The first step is to build your trunk. In this step, the branches provide fuel for trunk growth. They are not yet part of the aesthetics of the tree. At this stage, you want growth on steroids - and this may lead to branch features that are not ideal for the bonsai (too large, long internodes, wrong direction etc.). The bad features will ultimately be chopped off and replaced with better features at a point when our trunks are closer to what we want and we can concentrate on slowing growth to get the features we want.

Bonsai is art and in art we don't start with details. First we address shape, size and perspective. Then we add the finer details.

BTW, is the pic you shared of a redwood or a juniper?
 

Cajunrider

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Has your tree reached the point of development where this is needed? When I get a tree, I try to imagine what I want the tree to ultimately look like and then try to figure out how to get it there. Is my nebari set up to grow properly? Has my trunk reached the thickness I want? Do I want more movement/taper? The first step is to build your trunk. In this step, the branches provide fuel for trunk growth. They are not yet part of the aesthetics of the tree. At this stage, you want growth on steroids - and this may lead to branch features that are not ideal for the bonsai (too large, long internodes, wrong direction etc.). The bad features will ultimately be chopped off and replaced with better features at a point when our trunks are closer to what we want and we can concentrate on slowing growth to get the features we want.

Bonsai is art and in art we don't start with details. First we address shape, size and perspective. Then we add the finer details.

BTW, is the pic you shared of a redwood or a juniper?
I agree. Now is the time to focus on building the trunk.
 

Icarus

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Has your tree reached the point of development where this is needed? When I get a tree, I try to imagine what I want the tree to ultimately look like and then try to figure out how to get it there. Is my nebari set up to grow properly? Has my trunk reached the thickness I want? Do I want more movement/taper? The first step is to build your trunk. In this step, the branches provide fuel for trunk growth. They are not yet part of the aesthetics of the tree. At this stage, you want growth on steroids - and this may lead to branch features that are not ideal for the bonsai (too large, long internodes, wrong direction etc.). The bad features will ultimately be chopped off and replaced with better features at a point when our trunks are closer to what we want and we can concentrate on slowing growth to get the features we want.

Bonsai is art and in art we don't start with details. First we address shape, size and perspective. Then we add the finer details.

BTW, is the pic you shared of a redwood or a juniper?
Thanks for the reply, my tree is a Redwood. It's 17 months old.
 
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