Sharps pygmy wilting

[Seraphim01]

I've had this guy for about 2 yrs now and it's been about a yr since I fixed it to a rock for root over rock I have it in a shaded area where it gets some sun but not full sun it's been doing very well but yesturday I noticed that a little grouping of leaves was wilted so I watered it it didnt seem like it needed to be watered because the soil and the moss covering the roots was perfectly fine but I watered it anyway I did have to prune it back this winter because it had slight damage from the cold. It only just started to sprout and looked good. Then this morning i took a look at it and every single leaf is wilted now. It hasnt been too hot it gets around low 80s and at night it gets maybe low 50s high 40s. So not bad at all. Has anyone had this happen before and any suggestions would be much appreciated....i havent messed with it yet only to do scratch tests and i removed the moss over the roots to see if they are too wet and they look fine everything looks fine....except these da** leaves, or I should say ALL new growth looks badly wilted.

 

[Seraphim01]

Not sure if the picture posted with the post but here it is again....any help or suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

 

[Dav4]

Your roots are compromised, most likely, but beyond that, I can't say. Can we see a pic of the whole tree/pot. Soil mix components, too

 

[Shibui]

Check the base of the trunk - close to soil level for any signs of black bark.
I've had JM wilt like this at, or soon after, leaf out in spring and it's usually a root problem as mentioned. Down here it seems to be associated with roots being too wet through winter. Occasionally I have had some recover if they are kept on the dry side for a while but if the infection (black bark) has spread too far there is no recovery.

 

[Seraphim01]

I did take a look deeper into the soil and it was indeed root rot...not bad tho the roots that were on the rock were fine but the roots further into the soil were very bad. I moved the rock a little and the roots just broke away there weren't many but deffinatley enough to cause damage. The base is still very green. Since it broke away from the rotted roots I ended up basically doing a repot into fresh soil and now I just have to hope I didnt kill it. My root over rock was a bust with this one...lol...I've replanted a jaboticoba a mimosa and a weeping maple this way because of root rot and I still have them they survived but this guy not sure it's going to survive. I did soak the roots in a peroxide bath like I've done to other trees and plants and still have all of them... but this one just feels different. I forgot to take a picture of the whole tree, pot and all but the color of the trunk in the photo I posted is the color the tree is all the way down to the roots once it gets closer to the end the roots start turning brown. The soil it was in is a mix of red lava rock, pumice, akadama and bark with a little bit of fox farms happy frog soil. During the winter the soil would dry up and I would water it. It would get cold at night but during the day it was still pretty warm I live in desert climate so I think I was watering it way too much during the winter...and pot was way too big for how little the tree is. I wasnt taking into consideration how wet the soil was getting further down into the pot.

 

[Deep Sea Diver]

To me this represents an ER job.

Best ER root treatment I‘ve used to date that actually worked was 3% H2O2. I soaked the whole mess for a couple minutes, removed the rotten roots, tossed the media, then soaked what was left again. Probably could skip the first flush, but that’s what I did. Quick flush. Replant in new media, or in the ground. Warning Maples are pernicious once they are infected.

Your tree, your call.

Good Luck!
DSD sends

 

[Mikecheck123]

Looks like a classic case of overpotting. How huge is that pot?

Young Japanese maples are extremely susceptible to overpotting. Especially when it's damp and cold outside.

 

[19Mateo83]

Looks like a classic case of overpotting. How huge is that pot?

Young Japanese maples are extremely susceptible to overpotting. Especially when it's damp and cold outside.

What is the difference between over potting and planting them in the ground?

 

[Tums]

What is the difference between over potting and planting them in the ground?

Why the Earth Is Not Like a Pot

 

[SeanS]

To me this represents an ER job.

Best ER root treatment I‘ve used to date that actually worked was 3% H2O2. I soaked the whole mess for a couple minutes, removed the rotten roots, tossed the media, then soaked what was left again. Probably could skip the first flush, but that’s what I did. Quick flush. Replant in new media, or in the ground. Warning Maples are pernicious once they are infected.

Your tree, your call.

Good Luck!
DSD sends

@Deep Sea Diver do you make a water/H202 solution or just straight 3% peroxide? Other posts I’ve seen mentioned 2 tablespoons of 3% peroxide to a quart of water.

 

[Mikecheck123]

What is the difference between over potting and planting them in the ground

What is the difference between over potting and planting them in the ground?

A pot has plastic walls that prevents gas exchange on the sides.

And it has a perched water table that keeps soil too wet.

 

[John P.]

Had this happen to an Acer Jordan this year. Will try the H2O2 as suggested.

it was in its original nursery can and dirt. I now regret not repotting it.

 

[discusmike]

From my experience you either have root damage or a fungal issue, always spray buds with daconil before they open as a preventative

 

[Deep Sea Diver]

@Deep Sea Diver do you make a water/H202 solution or just straight 3% peroxide? Other posts I’ve seen mentioned 2 tablespoons of 3% peroxide to a quart of water.

Good question…. The answer in bonsai is, of course, it depends. .

Here’s a rundown of how we use H2O2.

For indoors and outdoors used as a spray on cuttings and trees 1-2 TBSP of 3% H2O2 per Quart of water. The variance has to do with the age of the plants, overall health, and the amount of visible issues, fungus, fungus gnats, powdery mildew etc. Also to water certain specific unhealthy plants.

For root rot or other major ER issues it’s the nuclear option - straight up 3% H2O2.

I’ve actually heard of folks using higher rates, but haven’t explored this option. 3% is the usual concentration in US stores. I buy wherever it’s cheapest. Store in cool dark place as it degrades rapidly in high temperatures.

This treatment is used extensively as a first line of defense along with Safer soap. The application rates are used for all trees and plants, indoors or out and I haven’t found any adversely affected. My better half uses in on orchids too.

btw it was @Osoyoung who first gave me this idea, I think he uses 1 TBSP/QT …and also from Roberta Walters a Gondo teacher, for using it on azaleas, topically and for monthly watering maintenance. Also search for Hydrogen Peroxide for gardening on the net.

Hope that helps!

cheers
DSD sends

 

[Deep Sea Diver]

From my experience you either have root damage or a fungal issue, always spray buds with daconil before they open as a preventative

Just a note about using Daconil. It can be effective, but hazardous.

If one chooses to use it, please use proper safety equipment and practices (respirator mask/googles/gloves etc). It can be very nasty to breathe and in one’s eyes…. store properly.

Here’s the Syngenta SDS on Daconil.

Cheers
SD sends

 

[SeanS]

Good question…. The answer in bonsai is, of course, it depends. .

Here’s a rundown of how we use H2O2.

For indoors and outdoors used as a spray on cuttings and trees 1-2 TBSP of 3% H2O2 per Quart of water. The variance has to do with the age of the plants, overall health, and the amount of visible issues, fungus, fungus gnats, powdery mildew etc. Also to water certain specific unhealthy plants.

For root rot or other major ER issues it’s the nuclear option - straight up 3% H2O2.

I’ve actually heard of folks using higher rates, but haven’t explored this option. 3% is the usual concentration in US stores. I buy wherever it’s cheapest. Store in cool dark place as it degrades rapidly in high temperatures.

This treatment is used extensively as a first line of defense along with Safer soap. The application rates are used for all trees and plants, indoors or out and I haven’t found any adversely affected. My better half uses in on orchids too.

btw it was @Osoyoung who first gave me this idea, I think he uses 1 TBSP/QT …and also from Roberta Walters a Gondo teacher, for using it on azaleas, topically and for monthly watering maintenance. Also search for Hydrogen Peroxide for gardening on the net.

Hope that helps!

cheers
DSD sends

Thanks! Exactly what I needed!

I’ve got some bad root rot on one of my JMs and need to use the nuclear option in spring when I repot

 

[penumbra]

The most diluted H2O2 I have used is about 20% to 80% water. Normally though I use about a 50/50 mix and have used 100% of the 3% solution on root rot.
I sincerely doubt that a tablespoon or two to a quart of water has much benefit. I have just not seen it. Results may vary.

 

[Deep Sea Diver]

Thanks! Exactly what I needed!

I’ve got some bad root rot on one of my JMs and need to use the nuclear option in spring when I repot

Ouch! You can actually treat the media now.

Cheers
DSD sends

 

[Deep Sea Diver]

I sincerely doubt that a tablespoon or two to a quart of water has much benefit. I have just not seen it. Results may vary.

…Yep. I didn’t believe it either until I tried it. Last year I was plagued by fungus gnats all winter for the 70 plus cuttings on mats in the garage.

Seedlings and Cuttings are notoriously sensitive, so I was very skeptical. But what the heck… I just love a good experiment above all!

So this year we used H2O2 on the 400 plus azalea cuttings/seedlings struck in summer… there’s nary a gnat to behold. It was a thing of Beauty as far as I was concerned.

btw I started using H2O2 right from the gitgo this year. I’ve heard from others they need more extreme measures/concentrations once a big infection sets in.

Best
DSD sends

 

[0soyoung]

I’ve got some bad root rot on one of my JMs and need to use the nuclear option in spring when I repot

If so, it should stink.

But, IMHO, it is a good idea to spray roots with a peroxide solution (2 tablespoons 3% per quart of water) as a routine part of repotting. I mean, just do it, regardless.



literally an ounce of prevention.