Shepherdia argentea

[Tycoss]

I have seen occasional inquiries on this and other bonsai boards about the suitability of this species for collecting and bonsai, but have never heard if anyone has followed through on these attempts, and have never seen a developed shepherdia bonsai.

I live on the Canadian prairies, where this species is both aboundant and iconic. I see some very clear assets and deficiencies of this species as bonsai. On the plus side: they have small and attractively colored leaves, ramify densely, bright red edible berries, often nice deadwood, and usually have branches low on the trunk. On the minus side, they usually have skinny, straight trunks with no taper, lousy nebari, smooth boring bark, and lots of suckers.

I have found some potential yomadori that seem to overcome some of the species problems, and have a good idea of how to style them, but I want to be ready for any problems (besides huge vicious thorns) that I may encounter with their collection, cultivation and training. I know this is long, but any ideas?

 

[Tycoss]

 

[wireme]

I collected one this spring. Really good rootball, plenty of nice fine roots there. I thought it was going to be pretty much a sure thing but it's not looking good. Still some signs of life now in fall but I doubt it's going to pull through.
So, can't help I guess but don't let that stop you, the experience of one shrub doesn't mean much. They seem like tough plants, I would expect them to be able to handle transplanting.
I agree they are worth trying, nice leaves and berries as you say. I like the berries sort of, incredibly bitter but good in a way. Whipped into a foam with a bunch of sugar they're ok.

 

[Tycoss]

i understand they are related to olives, and live in a similar habitat,but way colder. too bad they seem to resent their roots screwed with. It's remarkable how much abuse my two little olives have put up with. Did you find the one you collected had a big taproot, or just the little lateral roots seen in the pic?

 

[wireme]

i understand they are related to olives, and live in a similar habitat,but way colder. too bad they seem to resent their roots screwed with. It's remarkable how much abuse my two little olives have put up with. Did you find the one you collected had a big taproot, or just the little lateral roots seen in the pic?

No taproot to speak of. It was on top of a cutback and real easy to cut under and around with the recip saw.
From wiggling trunks of other bushes I feel like a taproot is the norm though.

 

[Tycoss]

Any other "obscure" native species you have experimented with?

 

[wireme]

Any other "obscure" native species you have experimented with?

Hmmm.

There's potentilla (shrubby cinquefoil)
Not so obscure but nice, you probably saw some around the Creeping junipers you were looking at? They'll show up in the same kind of place anyways. I've collected about 15 of those with 100 percent survival even if they have pretty much no roots. That's early spring, earlier the better, I've chipped them out of frozen ground, potted them and buried them in the snow for a month waiting for spring. After bud break is probably a different story.
Antelope bitterbrush. I forget the Latin now. They are cool, hard to find them with fine roots, seems like taproot to China is the norm. Tried one, it died. I found one a few years ago that's killer and even seemed to have a collectible rootpad, keeps me up winter nights dreaming but haven't made it back to collect yet.
The native chokecherries could be nice eh?
I've got a Saskatoon. Really small but some character, seems happy enough with life in a pot.
I've seen lots of cool kinnickinik, again small but tons of character, like yamadori accents plants almost. Never collected one.
I've also seen some really amazing aspen up on some of those windy rock bluff features you got in southern Alberta. Haven't ever threatened one with a shovel though, not yet.

 

[wireme]

Oh yeah, I do know a guy in Calgary who's keen and capable with bonsai and collecting. We haven't been in contact for about a year. We had planned to meet up collecting together this spring but I was kinda trying to catch up to life, hardly got out this year and didn't contact him. Hopefully he's still kicking around and was just busy too, I'll try to find out.

 

[Tycoss]

Oh yeah, I do know a guy in Calgary who's keen and capable with bonsai and collecting. We haven't been in contact for about a year. We had planned to meet up collecting together this spring but I was kinda trying to catch up to life, hardly got out this year and didn't contact him. Hopefully he's still kicking around and was just busy too, I'll try to find out.

Sounds good. Love to make a trip of it next spring. It's hard to find anyone around here who has any interest or understanding of bonsai. Our conifers are certainly outstanding, but I'm sure some of our broadleafs ans shrubs have potential. Cheers

 

[Tycoss]

Just a thought. I found this cool piece of lace rock near where I found those junipers. If I could collect a nice little kinnickinik it would look cool coming out of that "bowl" in the front. Maybe some other tiny native plants coming out of the little holes in the back like rock gardeners do with tufa?

 

[Tycoss]

Hey, wireme, did the shepherdia from earlier in the post survive the winter? I collected a wild one on the 21st of April this year. It seems to have recovered well so far. Thought we could compare notes on the collecting and care of the species.

 

[Tycoss]

Here is the tree. I liked the trunkline, but nothing special otherwise. The leaves stayed tiny and haven't grown since collecting so I started to get worried.

 

[Tycoss]

When stirring the substrate up, I found lots of little white feeder roots. Buds are also forming on the trunk.

 

[Tycoss]

Update, the tree seems to be growing well, both from the trunk and ends of the branches. I'm wondering whether I can safely cut the branches back, or whether it is better to use the shoots from the trunk to build the canopy over time.
Two thoughts on collecting, though I'll have to do more to see if they are valid, I remembered seeing a video where Ryan Neil was talking about collecting sagebrush. He said that even though they are from a dry area, one the taproot is severed they need as much water as any other bonsai. Since these are big taprooted shrubs from dry areas as well, I planted mine in fast draining soil and watered it like a larch.
I also grow olive bonsai, which are related to shepherdia. Then you cut all the foliage off a branch, it usually dies back all the way to the trunk. With this in mind, I tried to leave some branches with dormant leaf buds all over them, instead of just collecting the stump, like I would with an elm or honeysuckle. I'm not sure if either of these ideas factored in to it's survival, but it seems good so far.

 

[Tycoss]

There was also another buffalo berry that came in the same soil as a Saskatoon I collected in April. It was removed from the Saskatoon and given the same treatment as the other shepherdia. It is also growing well, and might make a decent shohin broom in a few years.

 

[sorce]

I'm wondering whether I can safely cut the branches back, or whether it is better to use the shoots from the trunk to build the canopy over time.

Just an observation.

You see how those new shoots are going straight up?

Compared to the field branches...
On the yamadori......
That you COLLECTED!

You with me?

Particularly that one coming forward...
That's a dope ass branch!

This one may be walking the line between "a young shrub" to grow out, and a "yamamawowzerdori"...

Ok ok it's a damn Shrub to grow out!

Regardless....
You want to keep and utilize as much of MA Nature's interest as you can!

With every effort in mind to keep the most interesting continuation of the trunk alive....
(Not that straight wonker at the top!)

Experiment on other branches...
(That straight wonker on top!)

Since that straight wonker on the top is never going to be a part of you final tree.

To see if you can move those young shoots ....
Pick the one in the worst situation...the straight wonker on the top version of one of them new shoots.
Which would NOT be the left one on the outside of the curve.

One of the two collar ones that are useless would be good to experiment on, though small.

And...that long one on the outside of the curve...
Is in a great spot.
So you do have to get it into position before you can't move it, but not until you know you can move it safely...

Daily observation!



In reference to this pic....

Want a Madden?

Sorce

 

[sorce]

Some years training and a future chop could get you in here I reckon.

All those green branches are there already if they're alive!

Sorce

 

[Tycoss]

Sorce, you've got a great eye, all the time you've spent analyzing and discussing trees on this site have served you well. I read these posts and had another look at my tree. The branche are flexible enough for wire, the foliage just needs to be chased back a lot since it's way out on the branch ends. I've got time for that though. I'm liking the trunkline and branch placement more the more I look at this thing. I've got about 4 or5 branches that were there in the field, plus the new shoots. On a tree this size that's probably more than enough. I've found some more nice shepherdia to collect out here for next spring. I'm just pleased to see this one doing well since everyone here has trouble keeping collected ones alive in a pot.

 

[Tycoss]

Here's from a bit further back, so you get a sense of the distance between the trunk and foliage. Also the potential "back" and a big hole to be carved into uro at some point.

 

[Tycoss]

By the way, you should write a bonsai book or blog in order to get terms like "wonker" into wider use. I like it better than "undesirable/straight branch".