Shimpaku Foliage Yellowing URGENT

[mcpesq817]

Still too moist of a mix for junipers in my opinion, unless you are incredibly careful about watering.

 

[JoeR]

Ahhhh...didn't see that you'd already repotted it once, and into potting soil+perlite. I'm confident your shimpaku could have made it another season in Brent's soil. I bought this one from him in 2010. At that time, he sawed it out of a wooden box, shipped it, and I slip-potted it into a big mica pot. 4.5 years later, and I still haven't repotted it; probably won't until next year.

If you want to repot yours a second time this season, in its weakened condition, I'd suggest you throw it away instead and save yourself the trouble. 11 times out of 10, tree death is linked to roots.

Find with someone in your area who has experience and nice trees, offer to help him/her help repot their trees this weekend for some good hands-on practice. You'll learn, and people always appreciate a second set of hands.

Good idea, maybe if I come out of my shell and join a club I will find someone.

Lol 11 times out of 10. Note taken.

Won't repot it. The soil isn't quite as bad as you May think.

 

[JoeR]

Don't worry JoeR, our book will do ok!

Brian, I read that about the roots in the SD 2013 thread. Great Aha moment! thanks! It does ring hella true.

Sorce

I don't exactly understand the bold, inside joke?

 

[Eric Group]

If you were repotting into a mix you stay is just like Brent's... Then what was the point of repotting exactly?

Just wondering...

The foliage does not look good, but I doubt it was just overwatering that put you there... Probably some stress from the repotting was your culprit. Did you know how long it had been since it was repotted?

 

[JoeR]

If you were repotting into a mix you stay is just like Brent's... Then what was the point of repotting exactly?

Just wondering...

The foliage does not look good, but I doubt it was just overwatering that put you there... Probably some stress from the repotting was your culprit. Did you know how long it had been since it was repotted?

It was to reduce the height and start trying to make the roots more horizontal.

I have been in the same boat this entire thread-- there's no way 1 to 2 weeks of overly wet soil can do this to a juniper. I just went with the pros advise though.

No idea how long it's been since it was Repotted but based on how chalk full of roots it was and how how slow they grow I'd say awhile.

When I repotted it I was very careful and removed no roots just combed The bottom roots so it'd be flat in the new pot. Some were slightly damaged due to the root rake/hook but it was such a small fraction of the mass of roots. I would be fungisurprised If that caused it as well.

The last possibility would be fungi. I either removed all the necessary fungi in the roots or there is harmful fungi in the soil. I don't know how it would catch a disease so quick though, unless it got it at brents but who knows.

 

[sorce]

Or we can write a book, 300 ways to a "baconized" juniper!
Vance gets title credits!

Sorce

It is an inside joke, but YOU are the other insider!

Sorce

 

[JoeR]

Oh huh I guess I've read so many threads here I can't keep track of anything.

Now it makes sense, but I've killed the joke....


Ha sorry

 

[quietobserver]

Oh huh I guess I've read so many threads here I can't keep track of anything.

Now it makes sense, but I've killed the joke....


Ha sorry

BONIDE® Liquid Copper Fungicide Concentrate - 16 oz. Concentrate

Use for the control and prevention of many fungal diseases.


BONIDE® Liquid Copper Fungicide Concentrate - 16 oz. Concentrate

Use for the control and prevention of many fungal diseases.

 

[Eric Group]

It was to reduce the height and start trying to make the roots more horizontal.

I have been in the same boat this entire thread-- there's no way 1 to 2 weeks of overly wet soil can do this to a juniper. I just went with the pros advise though.

No idea how long it's been since it was Repotted but based on how chalk full of roots it was and how how slow they grow I'd say awhile.

When I repotted it I was very careful and removed no roots just combed The bottom roots so it'd be flat in the new pot. Some were slightly damaged due to the root rake/hook but it was such a small fraction of the mass of roots. I would be fungisurprised If that caused it as well.

The last possibility would be fungi. I either removed all the necessary fungi in the roots or there is harmful fungi in the soil. I don't know how it would catch a disease so quick though, unless it got it at brents but who knows.

Yeah just a week or two is a quick turn around for a Juni to go from happy to BROWN... I have cut branches off and tossed them on my compost heap and seen them stay green for months... Pop hard core freeze damage might do it? Perhaps it is Just in shock from moving to a new environment? Hard to tell... If that is all you did to the roots, I don't see how you could have harmed the tree so much. Honestly, I have found Juniper and Azalea to be the most fickle of species to work on... Other than tropicals which I just don't really mess with at all.

Juniper seem to not take well to root work sometimes, but regardless the issue if you see Signs of stress in the tree it is normally too late! You have lost that branch or, sometimes the whole tree! Where as a Maple or most any broad leafed deciduous tree will tell me something is wrong at the first sign of trouble- oddly shaped or colored leaves, spots, holes in leaves... All give you indicators, usually before major damage is done! The only non- root issue that might take out a Juni this fast I know of would be Spider Mites, and you don't usually see it go straight to brown even then.

 

[bonsaiBlake]

So in the last month I have learned something regarding this. Trees can grow in pots in exactly what he has. Perlite and potting soil. The requirements to make it work, much much less water more often, and good pot drainage. Being a bonsai person working at a nursery I thought oh these trees cant be healthy living in these pots of dirt. The roots cant breath, they'll get root rot, its way to moist . . . . There are fruit trees in soil that will bear fruit this year in their pots. It can be done. I have row after row of junipers, cypress, and all kinds of drought resistant trees and shrubs, absolutely thriving in big ol pots of potting soil and pearlite. the boss absolutely swears by pearlite, its all we use to propagate anything. Now, granted the desired end result is different, a tree or treelike shrub can be kept very happy in a pot of potting soil for years even is possible.

Stick a chop stick in it.

happy growing,
Blake

 

[quietobserver]

"I have mounds of discarded potting soil and peat and perlite from cutting flats, hundreds of yards of it at one time. I didn't do much with it for a while and just sort of watched things grow in it. Now this stuff was not really soil, it contained almost no native soil and was so fluffy you could hardly walk in it. I have locust trees that have naturalized and the seed comes up everywhere. One seedling came up in the middle of the pile one year. That locust seedling grew over ten feet tall in a single season, yet the mix was so loose that I could still pull it out roots and all with a good yank, which I did. The root mass was incredible, it never did reach any substantial earth which was at least three feet below."

http://www.evergreengardenworks.com/growfast.htm

 

[milehigh_7]

In addition to what Brian says, I might add that everything I have ever bought from Brent includes his suggestion to wait for a season before repotting to allow acclimation. Maybe there is a reason he suggests that.

 

[JoeR]

In addition to what Brian says, I might add that everything I have ever bought from Brent includes his suggestion to wait for a season before repotting to allow acclimation. Maybe there is a reason he suggests that.

Oh I could have sworn it was his site that told me to repot soon.

Turns out it was Bill V.'s website that said to repot the trees when they came in, becaus they weren't in pots.

Terrible memory. I need to write more stuff down..

 

[JoeR]

BONIDE® Liquid Copper Fungicide Concentrate - 16 oz. Concentrate

Use for the control and prevention of many fungal diseases.


BONIDE® Liquid Copper Fungicide Concentrate - 16 oz. Concentrate

Use for the control and prevention of many fungal diseases.

Very helpful, thanks.

 

[JoeR]

So in the last month I have learned something regarding this. Trees can grow in pots in exactly what he has. Perlite and potting soil. The requirements to make it work, much much less water more often, and good pot drainage. Being a bonsai person working at a nursery I thought oh these trees cant be healthy living in these pots of dirt. The roots cant breath, they'll get root rot, its way to moist . . . . There are fruit trees in soil that will bear fruit this year in their pots. It can be done. I have row after row of junipers, cypress, and all kinds of drought resistant trees and shrubs, absolutely thriving in big ol pots of potting soil and pearlite. the boss absolutely swears by pearlite, its all we use to propagate anything. Now, granted the desired end result is different, a tree or treelike shrub can be kept very happy in a pot of potting soil for years even is possible.

Stick a chop stick in it.

happy growing,
Blake

Yeah I have some new fruit trees from a nursery in Tennessee that are in pure potting soil and they are flowering and very happy, hopefully they will fruit this year. The tag didn't say anything about fruiting.

 

[JoeR]

Yeah just a week or two is a quick turn around for a Juni to go from happy to BROWN... I have cut branches off and tossed them on my compost heap and seen them stay green for months... Pop hard core freeze damage might do it? Perhaps it is Just in shock from moving to a new environment? Hard to tell... If that is all you did to the roots, I don't see how you could have harmed the tree so much. Honestly, I have found Juniper and Azalea to be the most fickle of species to work on... Other than tropicals which I just don't really mess with at all.

Juniper seem to not take well to root work sometimes, but regardless the issue if you see Signs of stress in the tree it is normally too late! You have lost that branch or, sometimes the whole tree! Where as a Maple or most any broad leafed deciduous tree will tell me something is wrong at the first sign of trouble- oddly shaped or colored leaves, spots, holes in leaves... All give you indicators, usually before major damage is done! The only non- root issue that might take out a Juni this fast I know of would be Spider Mites, and you don't usually see it go straight to brown even then.

Well I made sure there would be no freeze damage, I buried them and then covered them with straw. It never got below like 10 degrees this winter.

Must be transitioning from California I guess.

No spider mites either. At this point I wish it was spider mites!

Yeah I have had a lot of trouble with junipers but no other species yet. Which kind of sucks because shimpaku are one of my favorite conconifer species used in bonsai.

 

[Vance Wood]

Oh huh I guess I've read so many threads here I can't keep track of anything.

Now it makes sense, but I've killed the joke....


Ha sorry

You have to remember what they say about a joke; Explaining a joke is like dissecting a frog. Once you are done, you have all the parts but nothing works anymore.

 

[Dav4]

Fwiw, I have 1 to 4 yr old shimpaku cuttings growing and thriving in straight soil conditioner...basically composted pine bark. Just be cautious with the water and give the tree full sun if you can. Junipers are tough and can handle a lot of abuse, but too much attention can be slowly but surely fatal.

 

[bonsaiBlake]

You have to remember what they say about a joke; Explaining a joke is like dissecting a frog. Once you are done, you have all the parts but nothing works anymore.

Add that to the quotes page. . .