Shimpaku Juniper - Yellowing

BradM

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Hello all – First post and it’s a doozy! I’ve been reading through a lot of this forum and it appears to be a very knowledgeable/active community so I’m happy to be a part of it.

So we purchased a ‘Shimpaku Juniper Bonsai’ tree just over a month ago from a local nursery. They’re pretty well respected in the area but definitely do not specialize in bonsais. I saw it there on the lot and absolutely had to have it. They didn’t give us much background about it, just that it had been there a few months and was about 20 years old.

Now for the ‘fun’ part. The tree seemed just fine and was growing like crazy. Shoots coming off of just about every branch. I came home from work one night last week and the wife (God bless her) had trimmed it up pretty good. Yes I know – facepalm emoji. We had been talking about doing it and how we’d like to structure it, but not anything about actually doing it. She went to town on it, but in the end did it to make me happy so I’m definitely not mad and she doesn’t think I am mad about it. Disclaimer: I also didn’t know the rules for pruning until recently. Anyway – pinch pinch pinch and here we are.

As you can see, the tips that were cut off (with scissors) are all brown. Which prompted me to take a much closer look inside. As I opened back the tree branches I noticed a bit of yellowing and a lot of older brown needles inside.

I’ll be honest – I hadn’t really even looked inside of it too closely, but once I did I noticed a lot of older loose needles just laying in there (a LOT of them actually) and of course the yellow needles. I cleaned out the loose brown needles (I’m talking handfuls) to let it breathe a little better but that’s about it for now.

We originally re-potted it in what we think is well drained soil as recommended by the nursery. Some sort of regular potting soil combo with peat moss (as they directed at the nursery). I don’t think it’s over or underwatered. If anything, it’s been maybe a little underwatered as we recently had a pretty hot stretch of a week of dry 80’s-90 here in south-central PA, but again felt like we were keeping it watered well enough.

So here are my thoughts. Interested in what you all might think:

  • Did we harm this tree beyond repair with the trimming?
  • From all I’ve read I’m assuming the needles with brown tips will all die.
  • I did notice a few red spider mites beneath the pot, but didn’t see any on the tree itself. I sprayed all the branches pretty good. Those things are always running around on this particular patio for some reason.
  • Should we be concerned about the yellowing beneath the outer layer? I have been reading threads about this and it appears it could be the natural shedding that apparently these junipers do this time of year, but honestly I don’t know if they were that way when we got it. The thing looked healthy.
  • I understand that yellowing sometimes means it’s either under or over-watered. Trust me I will be paying way more attention to the watering moving forward.
  • Which brings me to my last concern: After a bit more research it appears we didn’t use the recommended “bonsai” soil. While repotting, the roots looked fine and it appeared they actually did use some sort of potting soil in the old pot, which it had been in for 3-4 years they said. For that reason, it didn’t sound off any alarms about using another type of soil. Would it be a bad idea to add bonsai soil now or would that stress the tree even more? Would it be worth digging it out to check the roots again? Or again – stress…
  • Finally – one thing we haven’t done yet is add fertilizer to the tree. Any recommendations on what to use?
We are in Franklin County, Pennsylvania which appears to be Zone 6B. The tree has been outside in full sun from about 10am-sunset every day since we brought it back. Pictures are from earlier today, as well as one from when it was in the nursery (sigh). Thank you all for your time and I hope all is well in your part of the world.

PS. Please don’t hold back.. This was probably not the best tree to start with into the bonsai world as it is rather large and was a little pricey, but that’s one way to learn a lesson I suppose.
 

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BradM

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Forgot to add! I'm aware this is more of a "topiary" than a legit "bonsai" but looking at some of the previous threads I figured the same rules would apply since it's a Shimpaku Juniper. :)
 

Hartinez

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Hi BradM! Welcome to the site. Your going to get a good amount of very informed responses from amazing horticulturalists and Bonsai artists.

a couple things I will say based on quick observation.
Its good you recognize this as topiary. Topiary is all about maintaining profile through repeated pruning of the outside shape to maintain said profile. What this does though is create a dense mat of foliage blocking the sun and air from getting to interior growth. The bulk of the yellowing I see on your tree is from just that, Foliage that has been shaded out and dying off. The other bits of yellow and brown foliage on the outside of the Pom poms is from scissor trimming. Otherwise you have a healthy plant.

be wary of your watering with this. Do not water like a bonsai, it has far too moisture retentive soil to take that much water.

if you want this tree to be a bonsai you def could make that happen, you’ll just have to lop off the top 2/3 of the tree!

with that, I’ll let some others chime in with more eloquent responses.

again, welcome and get ready for info overload!!!
 

Hartinez

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Also! In your profile, it will help to add your location and hardiness zone for proper advice.
 

BradM

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Hi BradM! Welcome to the site. Your going to get a good amount of very informed responses from amazing horticulturalists and Bonsai artists.

a couple things I will say based on quick observation.
Its good you recognize this as topiary. Topiary is all about maintaining profile through repeated pruning of the outside shape to maintain said profile. What this does though is create a dense mat of foliage blocking the sun and air from getting to interior growth. The bulk of the yellowing I see on your tree is from just that, Foliage that has been shaded out and dying off. The other bits of yellow and brown foliage on the outside of the Pom poms is from scissor trimming. Otherwise you have a healthy plant.

be wary of your watering with this. Do not water like a bonsai, it has far too moisture retentive soil to take that much water.

if you want this tree to be a bonsai you def could make that happen, you’ll just have to lop off the top 2/3 of the tree!

with that, I’ll let some others chime in with more eloquent responses.

again, welcome and get ready for info overload!!!
Thanks for the reply! We're relatively new homeowners and are just getting into "landscaping" and plants AKA "getting old" (haha kidding). Our yard was pretty much a clean slate so we do have the opportunity to do it up how we'd like and have come into some pretty cool looking plants - a nice 40-year old Hinoki topiary, some Japanese maples, a Skylands Spruce and others, but now I suppose the challenge is keeping them alive. Challenge accepted! We've had many of them in since early April and they all seem to be doing great.

I definitely know one thing - I will be researching them all a LOT more than we did with these first few. Once we're comfortable, I would absolutely love to start a bonsai from scratch and make it my own. And from what I've seen the Shimpakus are great for it.

My initial concern was regarding the soil we used for this one. I definitely want to get some fertilizer added and have been looking into it all day. Just wanted to see if there were any that were highly recommended for this type of tree.

The more I read the more I see about the natural yellowing & browning, which makes sense with how dense this thing is. The inside lower foliage definitely isn't getting sun and I'm sure the handfuls of brown needles that were in there restricted air flow significantly. I was really surprised at how much I pulled out. But yeah I kind of freaked out after I started noticing the brown tips after it was trimmed improperly. I'm wondering if I should give a lot of the obviously dead brown stems a pruning.

Again we're beginners so any suggestions are awesome. Thanks again!
 

sorce

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I agree the yellowing is probably just because of the tight growth.

Welcome to Crazy!

I noticed a same little unexplainable bit on mine yesterday. So timing may there too.

Sorce
 

Hartinez

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I don’t think I would worry about fertilizing just yet. Our trees don’t actually need the fertilizer. I would just work on the process of watering. Unfortunately the mix suggested to you is definitely not what I would call free draining. You will also find that junipers prefer things on the dry side. In terms of trimming back growth, you may want to consider opening up those pom-poms a bit if you do want this thing to be more like a bonsai. With all that said though, too much attention and too much babying will kill your tree. Don’t forget to give this plant the opportunity to grow, and be free to grow and get out of shape
 

Potawatomi13

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You will also find that junipers prefer things on the dry side.
An exact contradiction of what Ryan Neil teaches. With well draining substrate Junipers want/need much H2O without being wet.
 

Brian Van Fleet

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Shimpaku junipers shed old interior growth around this time of year.
 
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On your repotting question - did you slip pot this juniper? (i.e. knock off loose soil, put into new container)

You could replace the top 1-2 inches or so of potting soil with bonsai mix (so as not to disturb surface roots), but a more fulsome swap to bonsai soil now could put your tree at risk.

I like your tree. I brought one home a year or so ago with similarly dense, but not technically sound, pads. First few sessions I focused primarily on cleaning joints and crotches - which might help you get some sunlight into the inner portion of your tree.

Also when trimming, avoid cutting thru the foliage with scissors - in img_5507 you can see some brown tips. Lot of great resources on here about how to properly prune and shape foliage. This might have been from nursery pruning.

Grew up near your location - great bonsai climate. Good luck to you!
 
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