Should I collect it?

[twarawa]

I am brand new to bonsai and am exited to try collecting a couple of local trees to try my hand at.

I've been out looking a bit since the snow started clearing and trying to read what I can about the various aspects of bonsai for a while now.

I was out yesterday looking around a new area and found a whole bunch of what I believe are juniperus communis (Common juniper). Most of the ones growing in the area seem to creep along the ground. There were not to many tree like ones around.

Here are some pics of one I would like to try to collect. It's by no means a small tree at the moment (about 4 feet from the base to the top) but I should be able to find some help. I really liked the trunk line when I first saw it. I did clean up some of the insignificant dead twigs and such on it to get a better look at it.

Is there anything specific to junipers that I should know? Also, is there good potential with this tree or is it a waste of time?

Thanks in advance for any advice.

 

[rockm]

Have you ever collected a tree before? I ask because this one is going to take some experience in digging and aftercare. Juinpers aren't as easily collected as deciduous trees. Reading about collecting is nothing like actual collecting, well about 15 percent of what you read might be helpful.

If not, I'd leave this one be until you have a bit more experience. It's got some potential in age and movement in the trunk...

You're talking about a lot of work just to get it and enough roots to sustain it out of the ground. You're going to have to deal with a substantial rootmass and will need a substantial container to put it in, as well as the soil to fill it.

Aftercare for conifers can be tricky and sometimes involves timed misting in a controlled environment.

 

[Poink88]

What rockm said. Plus juniper has totally different requirements with their foliage.

I collected my share of broad leaf to the point of being dangerous (others may call it/me cocky)...but still "afraid" of junipers (I have yet to attempt one). Just FYI.

 

[mcpesq817]

My understanding is that common juniper are very hard to successfully collect and keep in containers. Nick Lenz might have a chapter in his book on common junipers.

 

[twarawa]

Have you ever collected a tree before? I ask because this one is going to take some experience in digging and aftercare. Juinpers aren't as easily collected as deciduous trees. Reading about collecting is nothing like actual collecting, well about 15 percent of what you read might be helpful.

If not, I'd leave this one be until you have a bit more experience. It's got some potential in age and movement in the trunk...

You're talking about a lot of work just to get it and enough roots to sustain it out of the ground. You're going to have to deal with a substantial rootmass and will need a substantial container to put it in, as well as the soil to fill it.

Aftercare for conifers can be tricky and sometimes involves timed misting in a controlled environment.

Thanks for the advice rockm. I haven't collected for bonsai before but I have taken trees from the wild to the landscape.

The soil this tree lives in is almost completely sand so I am not scared of a little work to dig it up. It shouldn't be hard to take a big rootball out with it.

All that being said I don't have a misting system for the aftercare or a greenhouse for it so that may present some problems.

I did find another of the same kind in the area but it is much smaller (about 12") in height with a nice thick trunk(Pics are no good so I won't even post them). That may be a better candidate for my first bonsai collected.

 

[rockm]

"The soil this tree lives in is almost completely sand so I am not scared of a little work to dig it up. It shouldn't be hard to take a big rootball out with it. "

Which is a big problem. The soil, if sandy, will fall off the root mass, which will in effect bareroot the tree. Conifers dislike being barerooted in the extreme. All the jarring movement involved in getting it out of the ground and lifting it, etc. will probably make the problem worse. Soil that's easy to dig through often means this will happen.

 

[Dav4]

Another issue with collecting in sandy soil is that the feeder roots usually aren't anywhere near the base of the trunk...you can usually find them at the end of several heavy roots 2 to 10 (or more) feet long. It can be quite difficult to collect an adequate amount of roots in a situation like this.

 

[Poink88]

Now if you can prep the tree this year (by partial trenching) then collect next or 2 years later...your chances or success will be several folds more.

 

[twarawa]

Ahh...It seems there is much to learn about collecting. I like the idea of prepping it for a year or two before it is collected.

I think I will try to collect a smaller one this year and learn to take care of it. I am under no illusions that this will be easy but I am a believer that you learn by doing. As rockm said, reading about it only covers a small part of the process. Mistakes are the cost of learning to be good at something.

That being said, is there anything that I should do to prep the tree in the meantime besides partial trenching? Maybe fertilizer?

 

[TheSteve]

so practice on collecting a few worthless trees first. why dig a good one just to see what happens? You've picked a tough tree to collect already, don't compound it by being over eager

 

[october]

Hello twarawa.. You said you were new to bonsai. I would highly recommend you study bonsai for at least a year or 2 before collecting old and potentially very valuable trees. If you are new to it, you do not know about wiring, the 5 styles of bonsai, watering, seasonal care, overwintering, species specific pruning and a long list of other things. Get a couple of trees from local nurseries or garden centers. Study the 5 styles of bonsai and learn the care of the trees you get from the nurseries. Bonsai is a very misunderstood art. Best to start at the beginning. Also, finding a local bonsai club is a great start.

Good luck.

Rob

 

[Brian Van Fleet]

It doesn't have foliage close to the trunk. If you collect it, it needs to be collected with plenty of foliage to stand a chance...I like it, but I wouldn't...

 

[twarawa]

Thanks for all the input everyone. I've been "studying" bonsai for about a year now. Mostly this consists of reading forums (mostly this one) and a few books on basic bonsai care. I haven't got into any of the real expert books yet.

Taking into account all of the advice I'm probably better off to leave it alone for the time being.

I will try my hand at collecting an easier tree this year and see how it goes. There is a deciduous at my shop that will be getting paved over anyways if it doesn't get moved this year. I don't know what it is but I did transplant one a few years back with great success. I will try some nursery stock for the juniper to maybe get a handle on things first.

I'll keep an eye on this tree in the years to come I'm sure but for now my ambitions will have to wait. At least it has pointed me in a direction to pursue more education in.

In response to Rob, I wish a club was an option at this time but my schedule doesn't allow the 2hr drive to the closest club I've found. For now I will have to learn from the wealth of info available here and in the myriad of books available.

Thanks for the advice and I'm sure I will have more questions to come now that I don't have to lurk in the shadows of Bonsai Nut anymore!

 

[Paulpash]

As Poink said trenching is a good option if you decide to lift it. I'd trench one half of the rootball then the other next season. Grafting may be your only option of drawing foliage closer in... this again puts back the image several more seasons ..... grafting in itself usually isn't learnt by beginners at the start of doing bonsai but it's a valuable skill later on

Common Juniper are touchy about collecting too with potential fungal infection problems post collection(please read):

http://ibonsaiclub.forumotion.com/t2466-juniperus-communis-yamadori-2007

Pavel & Bonsai Eejit are both very active and experienced bonsaists.