Species for wiring practice?

[James W.]

I was recently made aware of my lack of wiring skills, due to a lack of training and practice. Up until now the only wiring I have done has been structural for developing potential pre-bonsai, which is pretty much what I have. My 'wiring' was good enough for me, but not to be seen in public. I have the possible chance to attend a wiring demonstration and workshop and wonder if anyone has a recommendation for something I could grab to take with me to practice on. None of my current trees are anything I think are ready for wire or that I want to be seen with in public. Also in the back of my mind is the thought of getting someone to come to my local club to do a similar workshop.
I thought about a throw-away tree like maybe a dwarf Alberta spruce? I would prefer something that has a better chance at becoming an actual bonsai, if possible, and appropriate to give to newbies. Any nursery junipers need so much cut off that they don't really have anything left to wire (in my experience). Everything I can think of from nurseries needs a couple of years of work before it needs real wiring.
With planning ahead (for the club) perhaps we might be able to get a hand full junipers that have been grown for bonsai but I am afraid our club members are not ready to drop $100 each for something with some potential. Almost no one in the club has enough experience to recognize the value and/or can get it into his or her budget.
Any ideas?

 

[penumbra]

If you are just wanting to practice wiring, you can do that with a branch off a tree or shrub.
It is kind of like learning to whittle a stick before you carve exotic wood.

 

[amcoffeegirl]

They had us practice on cut branches at a demo I went to.
I don’t feel like it is realistic though.
It is better than nothing.

 

[Cable]

Junipers are great to practice on because their branches are so pliable. Don't worry about wiring before a tree "needs" wiring. I wired a 3" seedling this year!

And if you have to be careful cutting too much off junipers anyway. Most recommend not more than 1/3 of the foliage unless you've got some good aftercare planned.

 

[Forsoothe!]

Dwarf Alberta Spruce is not for the uninitiated. They have a million branches, but all of them are skinny with foliage only at the tips. Yews are tough as nails and can be a test of wills. Everybody who can, should have one early in the game because they take a long time to mature into a show-able tree. Junipers are available in a variety of forms and respond quickly, too.

 

[sorce]

It depends what stages of wiring you are trying to learn.

1. Routing and Application.
Best learned by thinking and doing on anything.

2. Bending and Moving to Design.
Junipers, that Dwarf Alberta.


3. Species Specific.
The specific Species!

The part about junipers disturbs me.

My first thought is you may not be looking hard enough for appropriate material.
1 out of 100 junipers is good here.
It's never easy to find, and you MUST look at everything....thousands of plants

Fuck Fuck Fuck Fuck FUCK...
A juniper "grown for Bonsai".

If you really think about it...it's an assbackward concept.

Price is higher for removed branches according to someone else's vision.

Nursery, or collected junipers can be found chock full of branches for your design, and are always cheaper to free.

Trust me.

I have access to one of the premier bonsai outlets in the nation and looking for material there is no different. Junipers "grown for bonsai" that are actually more useful are just as rare, and always as expensive.

Mountain stuff. Different ballgame.

Junipers "grown for bonsai" are a scam.
A god damn scam.

Sorce

 

[James W.]

I picked up a dwarf inkberry holly "Gem Box", Illex glabra to wire at the workshop.
Was cheap enough and branches are thin enough to move. We'll see what happens.

I would still like to come up with some stuff to use for a workshop at our club. Maybe I'll just start buying whatever I can find to have a selection available.

 

[Dav4]

You should be wiring whatever you have in your collection, currently. There isn't a species of tree or shrub used for bonsai that can't be improved with wiring at some point in its development. Timing can be important, but now is a good a time as any to be thinking about wiring both your conifers and deciduous trees (as long as the branches haven't lignified too much).

 

[James W.]

You should be wiring whatever you have in your collection, currently. There isn't a species of tree or shrub used for bonsai that can't be improved with wiring at some point in its development. Timing can be important, but now is a good a time as any to be thinking about wiring both your conifers and deciduous trees (as long as the branches haven't lignified too much).

I do "wire" my "trees". Up to now I am have been at the point of developing trunks, so wiring has been minimal and rough to induce movement in a thin trunk or head a branch in the right direction to be a trunk later. So I want to get some training. But I am reluctant taking anything I have to a workshop because either it needs just one or two wires or I am not ready to wire it or I'm embarrassed to let anyone see it. So I am looking for a workshop tree.
I will probably take several of my trees to the workshop and leave them in the car unless I can get really comfortable.

If I can figure out something that fits the bill I will buy several and organize a wiring workshop for our Wichita club so everyone can learn a little more about wiring and maybe take home a tree that has the potential to become a nice bonsai in a couple of years.
I may have to start a farm. But I'm kind of lousy at growing pre-bonsai, too.

 

[parhamr]

+1 for juniper

 

[Adair M]

Juniper or pine.

 

[Wires_Guy_wires]

Around here we can get junipers of around two feet in height/length for 10 euros or less. Those can come in handy when you want to practice wiring. Procumbens and pfizer/media junipers are available year round and usually pretty cheap. Mugo pines too by the way, the bigger ones will cost 25 bucks and up, but the ones with a trunk and secondary branches will go for 2,50-5 euros. Mind you, this is at garden centers and not at bonsai stores where people pay 10x the amount.
For basic wiring practice, I think a few mugos and junipers would do fine.

 

[River's Edge]

I do "wire" my "trees". Up to now I am have been at the point of developing trunks, so wiring has been minimal and rough to induce movement in a thin trunk or head a branch in the right direction to be a trunk later. So I want to get some training. But I am reluctant taking anything I have to a workshop because either it needs just one or two wires or I am not ready to wire it or I'm embarrassed to let anyone see it. So I am looking for a workshop tree.
I will probably take several of my trees to the workshop and leave them in the car unless I can get really comfortable.

If I can figure out something that fits the bill I will buy several and organize a wiring workshop for our Wichita club so everyone can learn a little more about wiring and maybe take home a tree that has the potential to become a nice bonsai in a couple of years.
I may have to start a farm. But I'm kind of lousy at growing pre-bonsai, too.

For beginners you are looking for relatively cheap material that can be manipulated into a reasonable shape without too much effort! It would also help if the branching is relatively flexible and not too dense in foliage to facilitate wiring by beginners!
I would reccomend Mugo Pine. They are cheap, readily available, and usually can be found in various sizes to accommodate a particular budget or purpose! They also tend to be tough and forgiving of insult compared to a lot of species.
Next up would be juniper chinesis.

 

[James W.]

So, on lunch break I ran over to a the nursery to see if they had anything. Looking for juniper because that is getting the most recommendations. I found this J. procumens.

The price was right and they had 8 . . . JACKPOT!
They also have a couple dozen Grey Owl in 2 gallon pots for 1/2 price. I picked out one, how many more should I get?

 

[James W.]

For beginners you are looking for relatively cheap material that can be manipulated into a reasonable shape without too much effort! It would also help if the branching is relatively flexible and not too dense in foliage to facilitate wiring by beginners!
I would reccomend Mugo Pine. They are cheap, readily available, and usually can be found in various sizes to accommodate a particular budget or purpose! They also tend to be tough and forgiving of insult compared to a lot of species.
Next up would be juniper chinesis.

I've been working on getting them interested in mugos. Not very many in nurseries around here except Lowes always has a bunch of small ones every fall. I have a dozen of those growing out. I did a demonstration cutting up a 3 gallon Iseli "Mops" last summer but didn't see anybody run out to grab one for themselves ($50). Maybe when they see how it looks next year they will be more interested.

 

[Carol 83]

how many more should I get?

That's a dangerous question to ask in a forum full of tree addicts. Maybe you should ask your wife/S.O.

 

[leatherback]

Around here we can get junipers of around two feet in height/length for 10 euros or less. Those can come in handy when you want to practice wiring. Procumbens and pfizer/media junipers are available year round and usually pretty cheap. Mugo pines too by the way, the bigger ones will cost 25 bucks and up

oh wow.. where is that? I never run into those deals!

 

[James W.]

That's a dangerous question to ask in a forum full of tree addicts. Maybe you should ask your wife/S.O.

Yep, will buy a bottle of wine on the way home. And check with The Wife when it's empty!

 

[Carol 83]

Yep, will buy a bottle of wine on the way home. And check with The Wife when it's empty!

Sounds like a plan. We have a "don't ask, don't tell" policy concerning my trees and pots.

 

[Warpig]

It depends what stages of wiring you are trying to learn.

1. Routing and Application.
Best learned by thinking and doing on anything.

2. Bending and Moving to Design.
Junipers, that Dwarf Alberta.


3. Species Specific.
The specific Species!

The part about junipers disturbs me.

My first thought is you may not be looking hard enough for appropriate material.
1 out of 100 junipers is good here.
It's never easy to find, and you MUST look at everything....thousands of plants

Fuck Fuck Fuck Fuck FUCK...
A juniper "grown for Bonsai".

If you really think about it...it's an assbackward concept.

Price is higher for removed branches according to someone else's vision.

Nursery, or collected junipers can be found chock full of branches for your design, and are always cheaper to free.

Trust me.

I have access to one of the premier bonsai outlets in the nation and looking for material there is no different. Junipers "grown for bonsai" that are actually more useful are just as rare, and always as expensive.

Mountain stuff. Different ballgame.

Junipers "grown for bonsai" are a scam.
A god damn scam.

Sorce

I dont know how well you know computers but it's vary much the same thing. If you are buying anything 'gaming' related, as in a 'gaming' PC you are way over paying just for the tagline and maybe a couple LEDs.