Species Study - Crataegus aestivalis

Cajunrider

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Crataegus aestivalis (Mayhaw) is a member of the hawthorn family. It is a native tree in SouthEastern US, most particularly in Louisiana. The fruit is tart and makes good jelly.
The trees is hardy and will grow in most soil condition. In addition to propagation via seeds, the tree also spread by roots as well. Collection of the tree is easy. The tree can be taken all the way through spring at any time. The trees can withstand severe roots and top prune. Keep the trees in the shade for 3-4 weeks after collection. Budding should appear in 2 weeks in warm weather. Two weeks after the leaves show, the trees can be taken out in full sun with watering twice a day for the first 2 months.

The best known progression for Mayhaw on line is by Zach Smith of Bonsai South. https://bonsai-south.com/product/mayhaw1pre/
I have several threads on Bonsai Nut for Mayhaw as well. Mine are just in the beginning stage. I will post link to those threads when the trees progress further.
 

HorseloverFat

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Crataegus aestivalis (Mayhaw) is a member of the hawthorn family. It is a native tree in SouthEastern US, most particularly in Louisiana. The fruit is tart and makes good jelly.
The trees is hardy and will grow in most soil condition. In addition to propagation via seeds, the tree also spread by roots as well. Collection of the tree is easy. The tree can be taken all the way through spring at any time. The trees can withstand severe roots and top prune. Keep the trees in the shade for 3-4 weeks after collection. Budding should appear in 2 weeks in warm weather. Two weeks after the leaves show, the trees can be taken out in full sun with watering twice a day for the first 2 months.

The best known progression for Mayhaw on line is by Zach Smith of Bonsai South. https://bonsai-south.com/product/mayhaw1pre/
I have several threads on Bonsai Nut for Mayhaw as well. Mine are just in the beginning stage. I will post link to those threads when the trees progress further.
Looking forward to this thread..

I like the structure of these trees! They are out of my ability, however.
 
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There are several native Hawthorn in Canada and genetics are muddied as they will cross bread with ornamental versions I have seen several very nice collected ones . But I think I’m about one zone to far north. Ore just not the right conditions around me the only ones I have seen in the wild are multi stemmed barely small bush . Lots in southern Ontario Nicest bonsai I have seen was imported from the USA without import papers so to speak 😂😂 it was a much trimmed landscape plant acquired from the official residence of the American ambassador to Canada in Ottawa . Victim of increased security protocol after 911 the tree owner now’s brother was the contracted landscaper Dug it out with a back hoe
 
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There you go boys American soil
Arguably . House has the nicest view of the Ottawa river in the city . Pic is taken from road side observation stop along a cliff near downtown . Behind the house is the traditional most expensive residential community in the capital house is on the very peak of the hill
 

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HorseloverFat

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There are several native Hawthorn in Canada and genetics are muddied as they will cross bread with ornamental versions I have seen several very nice collected ones . But I think I’m about one zone to far north. Ore just not the right conditions around me the only ones I have seen in the wild are multi stemmed barely small bush . Lots in southern Ontario Nicest bonsai I have seen was imported from the USA without import papers so to speak 😂😂 it was a much trimmed landscape plant acquired from the official residence of the American ambassador to Canada in Ottawa . Victim of increased security protocol after 911 the tree owner now’s brother was the contracted landscaper Dug it out with a back hoe
Around here Cockspur and Common GROW... but in containers.. they need more protection than you'd think.

I'm discovering this of Elaeagnus, also... Every one I've tried to overwinter.. has perished BEFORE.. or shortly AFTER waking...

So I looked into it a little more...

Their Root-Damaging Temperatures are almost comparable to USDA 6!!!! (this is why they die back heavily around here in winter). Whereas their above ground "section" is damn near IMPERVIOUS to cold.

I need better wintering quarters..

So I can pull some Cratageus.. and NOT kill them.

🤓
 
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Around here Cockspur and Common GROW... but in containers.. they need more protection than you'd think.

I'm discovering this of Elaeagnus, also... Every one I've tried to overwinter.. has perished BEFORE.. or shortly AFTER waking...

So I looked into it a little more...

Their Root-Damaging Temperatures are almost comparable to USDA 6!!!! (this is why they die back heavily around here in winter). Whereas their above ground "section" is damn near IMPERVIOUS to cold.

I need better wintering quarters..

So I can pull some Cratageus.. and NOT kill them.

🤓
I’ve always considered general rule of thumb is bonsai pot changes the hardiness zone by one . Ex I live zone 4 so zone 4 trees need some protection same will live outside but it’s risky . As I have said before frozen roots need wind protection . I can keep some of the stronger zone 5 plants with frozen roots and wind protection . Some just die like JM . Us in the north think of hardiness as ability to withstand winter cold . This is not the complete story . As bonsai growers in a pot we gave portability . But a little research into how hardiness zones are determined is very interesting reading . Length of growing season date KC first and last frost and max high temp in summer are all considered . This I feel is overlooked by to many people
 

HorseloverFat

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I’ve always considered general rule of thumb is bonsai pot changes the hardiness zone by one . Ex I live zone 4 so zone 4 trees need some protection same will live outside but it’s risky . As I have said before frozen roots need wind protection . I can keep some of the stronger zone 5 plants with frozen roots and wind protection . Some just die like JM . Us in the north think of hardiness as ability to withstand winter cold . This is not the complete story . As bonsai growers in a pot we gave portability . But a little research into how hardiness zones are determined is very interesting reading . Length of growing season date KC first and last frost and max high temp in summer are all considered . This I feel is overlooked by to many people
I strongly recommend the book "Bonsai Heresy", If you have not already read it.

Much discussion goes into how cold roots actually GET in containers and how it relates to "zones". Zones in containers.. root damaging temperatures.. ect. ect..

I classify it as a "must read" 🤓

But yes.. typically.. "You lose a zone in containers"- holds true.. but there ARE interesting exceptions.. ALL based around those "Root-Damaging Temperatures."
 
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In the long run what I’m trying to say is . To be successful at bonsai considering what we do to trees bending repotting pruning they spent a lot of there time recovering from something . . We need to supple the growing conditions to make the plant thrive not just live . Or at the very least your expectations will not be meet .
 

HorseloverFat

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In the long run what I’m trying to say is . To be successful at bonsai considering what we do to trees bending repotting pruning they spent a lot of there time recovering from something . . We need to supple the growing conditions to make the plant thrive not just live . Or at the very least your expectations will not be meet .
I'm discovering the processes of native trees kind of ring true to this..

Basically Spring, and then late spring work to lock in my best (and most aptly placed) "solar panels" for the "High Season"...

Up here... we don't really experience that summer "Lull" the same way as USDA 6 and up does.

You're really onto something preaching the contrasts of the short growing season in da'North. Our conversations on this subject have been modifying some of my methods and ways of "approaching" my season.

I find your input and observation highly beneficial to the group.

🤓
 
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The pic is from a Government issue book native trees to Canada mines old from the 70s but I don’t think trees have changed much 😂😂 the nap is deceiving as most of the northern range is the golden fruited hawthorn according to this resource . That said just want to clarify what I said earlier . They are collected even farther north than I am I just don’t know if any locations as I said the best I have seen were garden plants . And or reclaimed hedges outside of southern Ontario .
 

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Cajunrider

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I made a move that was risky to a tree just for the sake of this study. 5 weeks after collection, a Mayhaw was growing well. I wanted to verify the root growth for this study so I lifted it out of the pot. The tree was collected late in collection season with day time high already around 90 deg F. The tree was bare rooted with most roots removed and chopped up top. After 5 weeks root growth was really good with feeder roots about 5" long.
Just for the heck of it, I screwed it on to a plywood board for a flat nebari later.
Go here https://www.bonsainut.com/threads/cjr-crataegus-aestivalis-2.55777/ if you want to see what the roots look like in 5 weeks.
 
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I made a move that was risky to a tree just for the sake of this study. 5 weeks after collection, a Mayhaw was growing well. I wanted to verify the root growth for this study so I lifted it out of the pot. The tree was collected late in collection season with day time high already around 90 deg F. The tree was bare rooted with most roots removed and chopped up top. After 5 weeks root growth was really good with feeder roots about 5" long.
Just for the heck of it, I screwed it on to a plywood board for a flat nebari later.
Go here https://www.bonsainut.com/threads/cjr-crataegus-aestivalis-2.55777/ if you want to see what the roots look like in 5 weeks.
Congrats that’s crazy response nothing in the north responds that fast a lot of potential with that growth habit
 

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Collected 3 more today. I now have 13 single trees and 14 more in 2 forests. There will be more in the coming months. So far I have pushed them very hard in collection with drastic pruning both roots and trunk. Potted in shallow pots with high organic potting soil, they bud and root profusely. I think they are even more hardy than bald cypress. I definitely will be wiring branches on them late summer.
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Collected 3 more today. I now have 13 single trees and 14 more in 2 forests. There will be more in the coming months. So far I have pushed them very hard in collection with drastic pruning both roots and trunk. Potted in shallow pots with high organic potting soil, they bud and root profusely. I think they are even more hardy than bald cypress. I definitely will be wiring branches on them late summer.
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Crazy what you can do with them 6 months ago if you asked me I would say they will just die collected in the south heat this late in spring but what do I know great job you got them down
 

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Growth slowed down on a few collected trees by ant cultivated aphids. Treated with neem oil last night.
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Cajunrider

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What are you using for soil you mentioned lots of organic most use lots of inorganic fast draining particle size
Cheapest potting soil $2/ft3 because that’s what they want. I cannot keep enough water in the soil in the near constant 90+ F day time temperature.
Next spring they will likely be moved to inorganic mix.
 
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What is the natural conditions you dig these from as in soil
And light . Considering your success with organic soil and hard pruning . After collecting I think I would experiment . With soil mixes next year . DE for moisture retention. In your climate and higher than normal bonsai soil for organic component . With some trees . After all one of the main reasons for inorganic free draining is so it lasts for long repots . The Japanese for example grow apricot in more organic mix and repot every year considering what you have learned so far they may respond very well
 

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What is the natural conditions you dig these from as in soil
And light . Considering your success with organic soil and hard pruning . After collecting I think I would experiment . With soil mixes next year . DE for moisture retention. In your climate and higher than normal bonsai soil for organic component . With some trees . After all one of the main reasons for inorganic free draining is so it lasts for long repots . The Japanese for example grow apricot in more organic mix and repot every year considering what you have learned so far they may respond very well
I dug them out of a grove stretching over some fairly well drained land in the middle and wetter at both ends. I found the trees on the wetter, darker soil to be healthier hence the decision to use potting soil instead of NAPA 8822 or more expensive inorganic. I'm on a budget and soil to pot dozens of collected trees can be expensive. So far this species loves to be in that cheap mix. I suppose when the roots are developed I would want to move to inorganic for finer feeder roots and slower growth for better ramification of branches. Right now I want fast root development and fast trunk development so I can get taper from shoots growing out of those big big chops.
 
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