Start of the Camellia Dragon

[AZbonsai]

I think I see a dragon in there somewhere. Bought this one on sale last summer. Odd trunk for sure.




My Muse.

 

[coh]

Is it "yuletide"?

 

[AZbonsai]

Yes I believe it is.

 

[amatbrewer]

In that first pic, I see a gecko looking back over its shoulder...Maybe you could develop that more and sell it to Geico? ;-)

 

[Leo in N E Illinois]

Penjing, style, more so than Japanese style. Love flowers, love using camellia.

 

[AZbonsai]

Penjing, style, more so than Japanese style. Love flowers, love using camellia.

Do you have pics and advice?

 

[0soyoung]

If you really like this dragon theme @AZbonsai , why not flip it 90 degrees so the lines are just like your dragon? I see the similar lines, but as its planted it is just a loop around and an artistic turn back - not very dragon-like.

 

[AZbonsai]

Thanks. Looking for all suggestions. I have not even repotted it yet. Going to do it after freeze threat over. It was my first summer experience and I almost lost it before finding out they need pretty deep shade to survive AZ heat. Will do better this summer!

 

[Potawatomi13]

Dragon indeed! As having somewhat similar Cork Bark Oak suggestion is go for it. Unless roots prevent possibly could lean rarther to Left as oriented in 1st picture? Only suggestion. Would be good to begin adding bends to branches. Love flowers.

 

[Leo in N E Illinois]

That is one of the shortcomings of this site. It needs a Penjing Sub-Forum. A couple members, like @bonhe and @0soyoung do a style of bonsai that is more Penjing like than traditional Japanese style. I myself ''kind of know it when I see it'', but I could not possibly explain the difference. Perhaps some of our other members could explain it or post better examples. Browse the photos from the Penjing Pavilion of the National Bonsai Collection in DC.

Many Penjing are landscapes, but there is also a Penjing style for individual trees. I post below some examples I've collected over the years. I can't read Chinese, so did not get proper attribution for all the images. I will give credit where I have it.



next couple images I labeled as ''from Cold Mountain'', I forget whether this is a person, a website or the name of an exhibition.
sageretia and JBP

Photo from Randy Clark, 2012


The rest I have no attribution at all for
I think this is a bougie

chinese elm

this looks similar to a work by Jun from the Philippines

this is an absolutely massive azalea

lovely crepe myrtle

 

[AZbonsai]

Thanks @Leo in N E Illinois Much appreciated! Those are some massive trees and very unique. It seems Penjing allows a bit more flexibility to traditional Japanese bonsai. Excellent examples. Thank you for your time!

 

[Leo in N E Illinois]

From my examples above, you can see there is a different sensibility than traditional Japanese style, or from European style too. Some of the ''flaws'' that are routinely avoided in traditional Japanese style, are ignored. For example sudden segments of trunk that are dead arrow straight, followed or preceded by wildly twisting branches. The look appears less planned or ordered to my eye. Though I do believe sometimes the arrow straight segments are an attempt to mimic certain characters in Chinese words, representing a straight brush stroke. But I do not read Chinese, so I could not say with certainty. But without a doubt, there is a random wildness that is in Chinese penjing that you don't usually see in Japanese styles. There is overlap too. Clearly you can see the origin of Japanese bonsai in the Chinese styles and if I understand what I've read from authors like Robert Stevens of Indonesia, the later influence of Japanese bonsai on modern Chinese penjing. It is a two way street.

So contemplate the matter. Use the Penjing as an excuse if someone complains about how flawed the nebari is for this camellia.

 

[AZbonsai]

So contemplate the matter. Use the Penjing as an excuse if someone complains about how flawed the nebari is for this camellia.

Lol will do!

 

[Leo in N E Illinois]

In penjing it is very appropriate to shape a tree to ''resemble'' something, for example, a dragon, wild horse, cranes taking flight, or Chinese calligraphy.

There is a whole school of penjing where the trees are shaped to resemble clouds.






this last is the most extreme form of the ''cloud shapes''

Robert Stevens wrote a nice article or two, maybe even a whole book on the different schools of Penjing, I believe published around 2012 or 2013, check Stone Lantern Books to see what they have of his still in print, or their selection of Penjing books.

 

[Cajunrider]

That is one of the shortcomings of this site. It needs a Penjing Sub-Forum. A couple members, like @bonhe and @0soyoung do a style of bonsai that is more Penjing like than traditional Japanese style. I myself ''kind of know it when I see it'', but I could not possibly explain the difference. Perhaps some of our other members could explain it or post better examples. Browse the photos from the Penjing Pavilion of the National Bonsai Collection in DC.

Many Penjing are landscapes, but there is also a Penjing style for individual trees. I post below some examples I've collected over the years. I can't read Chinese, so did not get proper attribution for all the images. I will give credit where I have it.

View attachment 222284

next couple images I labeled as ''from Cold Mountain'', I forget whether this is a person, a website or the name of an exhibition.
View attachment 222285 View attachment 222287 sageretia and JBP

Photo from Randy Clark, 2012
View attachment 222290

The rest I have no attribution at all for
View attachment 222286 I think this is a bougie

View attachment 222288 chinese elm

View attachment 222289 this looks similar to a work by Jun from the Philippines

View attachment 222291 this is an absolutely massive azalea

View attachment 222292 lovely crepe myrtle

Here's a video of Penjing style trees:

 

[bonhe]

That is one of the shortcomings of this site. It needs a Penjing Sub-Forum. A couple members, like @bonhe and @0soyoung do a style of bonsai that is more Penjing like than traditional Japanese style.

Si Nguyen is one of the masters in Penjing style here!! He did not post in this forum anymore!!!

Here's a video of Penjing style trees:

This is Vietnamese style. Thanks for posting, In Vietnam, we have been using this kind of style for centuries. Every tree has special name according to its shape such as: dragon, lion, mother and daughter, husband and wife, Revered Teacher (one of my pomegranates), ect.... Walter Pall is talking about Fairy Tale style, but we have already been doing that for ages!

Robert Stevens wrote a nice article or two, maybe even a whole book on the different schools of Penjing, I believe published around 2012 or 2013, check Stone Lantern Books to see what they have of his still in print, or their selection of Penjing books.

I love Robert Stevens, Dan Robinson and Walter Pall styles. Robert Stevens wrote the book " Mission of Transformation", It is excellent book for whoever love naturalistic bonsai. This is my copy,

Thụ Thoại

 

[Leo in N E Illinois]

I had forgotten Si Nguyen's name, he was one of the one's I was thinking of. Thanks
Hope he is still enjoying his Penjing.

 

[AZbonsai]

Robert Stevens wrote the book " Mission of Transformation",

A bit out of my price range. ??

 

[coh]

Thanks. Looking for all suggestions. I have not even repotted it yet. Going to do it after freeze threat over. It was my first summer experience and I almost lost it before finding out they need pretty deep shade to survive AZ heat. Will do better this summer!

So I have one camellia and it is a yuletide. Obviously I'm in a slightly different climate than you (slightly ) but here is what I have found, some of it may be useful.

1) I repot in the spring, just as buds are starting to swell. I've been using primarily kanuma as the soil. This was recommended to me by a friend
who has had amazing success with a camellia (it's been in the National show and I believe the Artisans Cup as well).
2) Overall at least in this climate, it is a relatively slow grower. However, branches can thicken quickly and I've got some ugly wire scars as a result. So if/when
you wire, watch it carefully. The smooth bark on these shows damage for a long time.
3) They seem to be very sensitive to drying out and mine has dropped a scary amount of foliage a couple of times when that happened. Could be a concern
in your climate.
4) New shoots are fragile and easily broken off at the base. I think it's best to wire once they've extended and thickened a bit. But, once shoots thicken significantly
they are very tough to bend (snap...don't ask how I know).

If I think of anything else, I'll let you know.

Here's a pic of mine from 2017 (most recent I could find). Got a ways to go and still haven't made some big decisions regarding branches (which to
keep) and final size but just enjoying the process.

 

[AZbonsai]

Thanks @coh I appreciate your advice. I was operating in the dark on this one as far as bonsai care in this climate. I like what you have done with yours with wiring. That is on my short list.