The BEST fall fertilizer!!!!

[Brian Underwood]

I'm sure this will end all the arguments...

I love Michael Hagedorn's work, and often his words; http://crataegus.com/2014/10/28/the-hype-over-0-10-10/

 

[Dav4]

I'm sure this will end all the arguments...

QUOTE]

I'm not sure it will end all arguments, but I do agree with Michael. Withholding nitrogen in the fall, in my opinion, is right up there with some of the greatest bonsai myths ever.

 

[Dan W.]

Lol... so far this hasn't been nearly as controversial post as the pumice post..

Sit back. Wait and watch...

 

[dick benbow]

His article and logic was well presented. I know from being a national spokesman for Koi and doing lots of seminars, a speaker could focus on not over doing something acknowledged as
incorrect. ( fall fertilizing) but as in most presentations the devil is in the details ( a proper
spring summer program as a set up for proper bonsai response in the fall). In koi, many cut off feeding their fish when temps start dipping below 55F. Truth is if fed correctly year round they come out of winter with their digestive systems still working and have less troubles starting it up in a weakened state which results in other health issues in spring
I find many similarities with koi and bonsai. Stones not so much. I'm starting to like stones alot LOL I do water them with the bonsai but nary a problem feeding.....

 

[Paradox]

To be honest, Ive always been a bit dubious on the whole "no nitrogen" thing in the fall.
He is right, nitrogen doesnt go away in the environment every fall. It still comes down in the rain, animals still urinate and defocate in the fall and those materials contain alot of nitrogen.
So it all seemed kinda BS to me. Reducing the amount of fertilizer you use on your plants because of reduced growth and need, sure. Stopping all fertilizer, probabaly just before dormnacy until spring, sure.

 

[coh]

I've never bought into the "no nitrogen in the fall" myth. But what do people think about the idea of using something that is higher in phosphorous? Julian Adams (and others) uses and recommends something like 12-55-5 in the fall, especially for pines. Supposedly to increase back budding. Is this another myth or has anyone seen any evidence that this is more helpful than just continuing with a balanced fertilizer?

Chris

 

[Dav4]

Chris, I've always assumed there would be enough phosphorous present in the 20-20-20 feed I provide to meet a plant's needs season to season.


...and fwiw, I believe soil temperature is the limiting factor on a plant's ability to use nitrogen...if the soil temps are above 40 F, you should be providing it in some form.

 

[jk_lewis]

I think Brent argued the same thing when Michael was still in Junior High. Not new.

 

[qwade]

Most plant life requires more N than the other 2 macro nutrients. Scientific analysis of plant tissue will almost always show a ratio of 3-1-2 of N-P-K. Now, if, as the article stated, most of use a fertilizer with a ratio of 1-1-1 such as 10-10-10 or 20-20-20 we probably have an overabundance of P and K . So I would summarize that adding P or K in the fall is a waste of fertilizer.

Myself, having been a big advocate of a 10-10-10 balanced type fertilizer for all my plants, have just recently switched to a 9-3-6 after reading/researching the use of fertilizer. The results are still out. I didn't note any significant change in my vegetable crop this year. Of course there is a lot of other factors effecting plant growth besides fertilizer. It just seems to make more sense to me to feed the same ratio as the plants makeup.

 

[KennedyMarx]

It's nice to have someone respected validate this. It's just so logical. There are so many old wives tails and voodoo BS in the bonsai world. Sometimes it seems like any challenges to accepted practice is heresy.

 

[Smoke]

I didn't even know Michael read my blog. I talked about the importance of fall fertilizer on my blog on Oct. 14.

I guess if you didn't study in Japan your nothing......

 

[Dan W.]

Al,
Somehow I missed your post! I just read it though, and it was great.

I think your problem was that you weren't controversial enough... meaning, you didn't directly attack 0-10-10 fertilizers. lol

 

[Smoke]

Al,
Somehow I missed your post! I just read it though, and it was great.

I think your problem was that you weren't controversial enough... meaning, you didn't directly attack 0-10-10 fertilizers. lol

I don't buy into the whole no nitrogen in the fall or do I....

I think there is a need for nitrogen in the fall for conifers since my junipers and pines continue to grow all winter. Deciduous trees though, with no leaves, I'm not so sure nitrogen is that important. Those kinds of trees are REALLY a sleep.

 

[bwaynef]

I think Brent argued the same thing when Michael was still in Junior High. Not new.

The earliest I can tell Brent mentioning it (on his site) was February 2003.
https://web.archive.org/web/20030224185225/http://evergreengardenworks.com/pruning2.htm

In 2006, he went into more detail:
http://bonsainurseryman.typepad.com/bonsainurseryman/2006/08/the_myth_of_010.html

I started a discussion of this topic a few years back:
http://bonsaistudygroup.com/general-discussion/fall-fertilization-of-bonsai/

 

[Giga]

I like to read a lot of these post of "the best" this and that, and sometime it's true. For fertz I just kinda do what I've been doing. I been using fish emulsion, Dynagrow 7-9-5, and a couple other organic ferts. Seems to work just fine for the last few years. I think as long as your properly fertilizing your good-I think the important thing is time of year and where the tree is in development.

 

[rollwithak]

This was an informative article, and although I do think there is some relevance to the "nitrogen being present year round" I do acknowledge the fact that bonsai is not an "in the wild" method. These are controlled environments and situations in most cases and I think the "no nitrogen" in the fall and winter is just teetering off the notion that dormant trees aren't actively taking up nitrogen in these months. Either way, interesting topic. Hope you enjoyed my "quotes" ha ha.