As we move closer to feeding our trees again, I wasn't able to find a thread dedicated to a discussion on feeding and thought I'd start one. I understand that many people use a fish emulsion for basically any tree. I want to confirm that and also get some suggestions on what specific products are best for which species and which stage of development. In addition to NPK values, I am confused as to what kind of micro-nutrients the trees may need and how/when to add these. Finally, what other things do folks add to their soil (or stay away from) to improve growth? For example, do folks water with rooting hormone, add mycorrhizae etc.?
The Fertilizer Survey
- Thread starter dbonsaiw
- Start date
PA_Penjing
Chumono
Answers will be as varied as soil mixes, which actually influence how we fertilize. I'm still experimenting myself but I won't use fish emulsion but I love fish hydrolysate. Anaerobic versus aerobic
Bnana
Chumono
Plants produce their own routing hormones, no need to add those (that's different for cuttings).
Mycorrhizal inocula are a scam, you couldn't keep them out if you wanted to. And it's your substrate is unsuitable they won't establish anyway, with our without inoculum.
For nutrients, trees need all micronutrients besides NPK, but the origin is irrelevant.
Mycorrhizal inocula are a scam, you couldn't keep them out if you wanted to. And it's your substrate is unsuitable they won't establish anyway, with our without inoculum.
For nutrients, trees need all micronutrients besides NPK, but the origin is irrelevant.
Mr GeaRbOx
Yamadori
It depends is my answer. Each individual will have a different method or preference. Personally, I use both organic and water soluble ferts. I change the product, frequency and strength depending on what I am applying it to. Ground vs nursery can vs bonsai pot, all different.
For products, I use the powerpak 20-20-20 for water soluble, pretty cheap and It's easy to dilute to other strengths like 10-10-10 or 5-5-5 if I want. For organic I use Espoma plant tone and follow this guide by BVF to make cakes.
For products, I use the powerpak 20-20-20 for water soluble, pretty cheap and It's easy to dilute to other strengths like 10-10-10 or 5-5-5 if I want. For organic I use Espoma plant tone and follow this guide by BVF to make cakes.
atlarsenal
Omono
It is easy to get consumed with fertilizer issues on what to apply to certain species, when, how much, organic or chemical. When I started out I was using a half a dozen different fertilizers. The truth is your trees do not care. It is best to keep it simple. Find a fertilizer that your trees like and is easy for you to apply from when buds start to swell until September/ first of October. Personally I use Dr. Earth in tea bags applied monthly.
drearth.com
Organic Fertilizers - Dr Earth
Hand crafted organic dry fertilizers for every plant or project in your garden.
drearth.com
BrianBay9
Masterpiece
My big thing was finding ferts that have nitrogen in some form other than urea. Urea needs time and microbes to break down into something plants can use (ammonium ions or nitrates). With the way we water and the substrates we use, urea gets washed out of the pot pretty quickly. Most commercial chemical ferts have most or all of their nitrogen as urea. Orchid ferts often are better.
But, it turns out I work for a company doing indoor, controlled cannabis grows. We have an automated fertilizer/watering continuous flow system for the plants and we collect the run-off. All the fertilizers are ammonia and ammonium nitrate based, supplemented with potassium and micronutrients, and are analyzed before use. I'm just tapping into the run-off storage tank now to fertilize my trees. The cannabis will remove some, but it's applied in excess to start with.
But, it turns out I work for a company doing indoor, controlled cannabis grows. We have an automated fertilizer/watering continuous flow system for the plants and we collect the run-off. All the fertilizers are ammonia and ammonium nitrate based, supplemented with potassium and micronutrients, and are analyzed before use. I'm just tapping into the run-off storage tank now to fertilize my trees. The cannabis will remove some, but it's applied in excess to start with.
penumbra
Imperial Masterpiece
Try again searching the archives. There has been a lot of discussion regarding fertilizing.
There has already been some good info posted here, but it has all been here before on this site and I guess it will always be a hot topic.
-Don't trust the One who says they have the answer for You.
-Don't think in terms of absolutes, everything that is true lies between.
-Never say or imply never ............ or always.
There has already been some good info posted here, but it has all been here before on this site and I guess it will always be a hot topic.
-Don't trust the One who says they have the answer for You.
-Don't think in terms of absolutes, everything that is true lies between.
-Never say or imply never ............ or always.
atlarsenal
Omono
Do you get to sample the product?
BrianBay9
Masterpiece
No, we're DEA licensed. Cannabis is still federally controlled.
Gustavo Martins
Omono
My approach is kiss. I buy orgânics, whatever is available when I buy, and add this every month. No problems so far. Remember that plants are autotrophs. They produce their own food.
Does
help them??
penumbra
Imperial Masterpiece
You bet it does!Does
Results may differ depending on where it is applied and the application rate.
penumbra
Imperial Masterpiece
Laughed so hard it hurts.Results may differ depending on where it is applied and the application rate.
Mellow Mullet
Masterpiece
Don't anguish too much over fertilizers. Trees make their own food through photosynthesis, ferts are kinda like people taking vitamins, they (trees) don't need as much as we think they do.
NPK is NPK whether it comes from organic or inorganic substances. It doesn't matter which you use.
Use any of the "Miracle Grow" types and add a time release with micros like Osmocote. It does not matter what the concentration (follow the instructions) for the Miracle Grow types, the tree does not know or care, it will take what it needs, whether it is 20-20-20, 10-5-8, or whatever.
Regardless of what you use, keep in mind, most of it ends up on the ground under the bench.
For deciduous trees, hold off on fertilizing in the Spring until after the first flush is done, if not, the extra nitrogen will give you super long internodes- unless that is your goal.
I use Miracle Grow with micros (the blue stuff you mix with water) once or twice a month. I add Florikan with micros time release once in the Spring, usually working it in to the soil so it is not as visible on top.
John
NPK is NPK whether it comes from organic or inorganic substances. It doesn't matter which you use.
Use any of the "Miracle Grow" types and add a time release with micros like Osmocote. It does not matter what the concentration (follow the instructions) for the Miracle Grow types, the tree does not know or care, it will take what it needs, whether it is 20-20-20, 10-5-8, or whatever.
Regardless of what you use, keep in mind, most of it ends up on the ground under the bench.
For deciduous trees, hold off on fertilizing in the Spring until after the first flush is done, if not, the extra nitrogen will give you super long internodes- unless that is your goal.
I use Miracle Grow with micros (the blue stuff you mix with water) once or twice a month. I add Florikan with micros time release once in the Spring, usually working it in to the soil so it is not as visible on top.
John
Ugo
Shohin
Hi!
Im far from being a professional as I just started 2 years ago.
One of my observation is fertilizer choice and application rate depends on the stage of your tree, the substrate you are using, the watering "schedule" you will observe (if you water heavily a draining substrate you can also apply more fertilizer while if you apply that quantity of fertilizer without adjusting watering you can create more arms than good!)
The type of tree will guide you for choosing the NPK ratio.
There is no perfect answer but for my vegetative trees I try to stay with a 3-1-2 ratio both liquid and slow release.
So a 24-8-16 will be perfect but if in doubt you can simply dilute it.
I try to stay with amonia and amonium source of nitrogen.
One fertilizer that I completely replaced is the Biogold, a "costly" slow release fertilizer.
I replaced it with chicken manure and it seems to work perfectly.
Usually this is my first application of the year.
After the tree is established I will follow with the cheapest 3-1-2 liquid fertilizer I can find and water heavily.
Like @penumbra said earlier there is more than one correct answer!
Im far from being a professional as I just started 2 years ago.
One of my observation is fertilizer choice and application rate depends on the stage of your tree, the substrate you are using, the watering "schedule" you will observe (if you water heavily a draining substrate you can also apply more fertilizer while if you apply that quantity of fertilizer without adjusting watering you can create more arms than good!)
The type of tree will guide you for choosing the NPK ratio.
There is no perfect answer but for my vegetative trees I try to stay with a 3-1-2 ratio both liquid and slow release.
So a 24-8-16 will be perfect but if in doubt you can simply dilute it.
I try to stay with amonia and amonium source of nitrogen.
One fertilizer that I completely replaced is the Biogold, a "costly" slow release fertilizer.
I replaced it with chicken manure and it seems to work perfectly.
Usually this is my first application of the year.
After the tree is established I will follow with the cheapest 3-1-2 liquid fertilizer I can find and water heavily.
Like @penumbra said earlier there is more than one correct answer!
atlarsenal
Omono
That’s what she said!Results may differ depending on where it is applied and the application rate.
Gustavo Martins
Omono
It sure. I’m a goodDoes
we
Scrogdor
Chumono
Yeah but what about steroids? We all know multi-vitamins don't do anything for people, or very little. But steroids are a different story, just ask Barry Bonds..... How do we get the roid cycle for bonsai?
Mellow Mullet
Masterpiece
There is none.
I did not say fertilizer is a bad thing, I said that trees don't need as much as we think they do. Look at all the trees in the forest, no one fertilizes them, and yet they grow.
As with "roids" on the human body, too much fertilizer causes unwanted problems; like, long internodes, large leaves, deposits on pots, etc.
There is no substitute for proper draining soil, watering techniques, and sunlight exposure. Get those right, add a little fertilizer, and you are on your way.
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