The Pitch Pine Experiment

jeanluc83

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I figured I would try the most foolhardy thing I could and start pine trees from seed (I'm still a beginner so I don't know any better). To make things even more interesting I decided not to do Japanese black pine (like everyone else), but Pitch pine (Pinus rigida). I have seen very high quality collected pitch pine bonsai but, to my knowledge no one is starting them from seed. I think in many ways they are equal to or better than JBP they just need to be given the chance.

Before I get people telling me "don't bother with seeds it will take too long". I understand. I figure if I do everything correct and luck smiles down on me I might have something presentable in 10 to 80 years. I also think back to how many times I've read "I wish I had planted some seeds when I first started out".

The main references I used are the "Growing pine from seed" article in the "Pines" book, this post over at the Bonsai study group and various posts at bonsai tonight.

Seeds

I figured the best place to start with growing seedlings would be with to get some seeds. I could have collected seeds but purchasing them saved me some time and effort. The seeds I used came from DA Tree store. It was about $6 including shipping for 100 seeds. I figured that wasn't too bad.

Stratification

The card that came with the seeds recommended approximately 30 days of cold stratification. In mid February I soaking the seeds at room temperature for about 3 days. Any floaters were discarded. I then wrapped the seeds in a damp (not wet) paper towel, put them in a sandwich bag and placed them in the fridge.

Most books recommend damp sphagnum moss or sand for stratification but using paper towel is easer and cleaner.

In the beginning of April the seeds were removed from the fridge. It ended up being a little more than the 30 days recommended. If anything I think it is better to go longer than shorter. There were a few spots with mold when I opened the bag but nothing major.

Sowing

I used a standard 72 cell seed starting tray. For a substrate I used a 50-50 mix of stall dry and oil dry with about 20% pine bark. This was then topped with approx. 1/4" of play sand. I'm still working out my mix so this is what I had on hand a the time. I think next time I'll go with pool filter sand rather than play sand. The sand I have is too fine I think something a little more coarse would work better.

At this point I'm not sure if I'll try seedling cuttings or work with the original roots. For seedling cuttings I don't believe the substrate really matters at this point. I wanted something a little better if I ended up using the original roots. I will probably end up doing a some of each.

I planted 1 or 2 seeds per cell just deep enough to cover the seeds and placed the tray with the dome in the upstairs of my garage. I was still getting big temperature swings so I was reluctant about putting them outside. The garage is unheated but insulated so the temperature is much more consistent.

Germination

At about two weeks I started to see some of the seeds start to sprout. After three weeks I had about 50 seedlings with some more just starting to poke up.

At one month I moved the tray outside. I also sprayed the seedlings with Daconil to prevent damping off. I removed the dome when I moved them outside to improve air flow and it would have blown away anyway.

If I'm successful I'll update this post periodically. If not I'll quietly delete it and never speak of it again.

This is as they stand today. I will update this post when it comes time to do seedling cuttings.
 

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jeanluc83

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Timing for Cuttings

I finely got around to taking some seedling cuttings. The stems have just started to lignify. Is it the best time? I’m not sure. Most sources say that when the stems turn violet it is time to take cuttings. This is for JBT anyway. I believe there needs to be a balance between enough foliage to support the tree but not too much to tax the plant when the roots are severed. Most pictures of seedling cuttings show that the second set of needles just starting to grow. It has been about 6-7 weeks since germination.

Substrate

Any free draining substrate will work. I used a 50-50 mix of stall dry and oil dry with about 20% pine bark. For the cuttings themselves I used regular play sand. Something coarser like filter sand may work better but I don't have enough experience to know for sure.

I used a growing box to house the cuttings over individual pots. My theory is that the larger soil mass will keep the moisture content and soil temperature constant. After 1 to 2 years I will remove the cuttings from the box and plant them into individual containers for further development. It also gives me a chance to monitor the root development.

The grow box was filled with about 2" of the substrate. Every 2" I made a hole for the sand about 1" by 1". After a good soaking I used a nail to make a hole about 3/4" deep in the center of each sand pocket.

Seedling cuttings

Taking the cuttings was fairly easy. I picked the strongest of the seedlings and cut the roots leaving about 1" of stem then dropped them in water to keep them moist. The cuttings were then dipped in rooting hormone. Each was placed in its own hole prepared earlier. The sand was gently pressed around the cutting.

The cuttings were placed in a shady spot sheltered from the wind. Over the next few weeks I'll slowly move them into more sun. Once I see definite signs of growth I'll start to fertilize.

With any luck I'll have a good batch of rooted cuttings at the end of the summer.
 

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johng

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I think you are on the right road...I believe that Pitch Pine is an excellent bonsai candidate! Good luck and please update!
John
 

Paradox

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I am also trying them out but I collected some 1 year old seedlings along a dirt road instead of trying seeds.
 

Neli

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It is the journey that matters...and hope you have lots of fun.
 

pitchpine

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My own pitch pine seedlings

Longtime Bnut lurker here, and as you can tell from my user ID, I'm a big fan of this species--- in nature, anyway, as my cultivation history is chequered. :) I've tried growing them twice before in the past and learned some ridiculously basic lessons the hard way.

The first batch of a half dozen seeds I started (about 7 years ago) was grown in potting soil, and the one seedling that managed to make it through its first 3 years was killed by repotting out of season. The second batch of a dozen or so seeds I started in early spring of 2012. I planted them in coarse sand, but had no money for real pots, and my hummus container with many holes punched in the bottom didn't drain nearly as well as it needed to. So none of those made it through the summer.

The seedlings below were started in August 2013, from cones from up on Mt.Desert Island in Maine, a place that is very special to me. In fact, the naturally-dwarfed pitch pine on the mountains there are what first ignited my interest in bonsai. :) The cones they came from were on the tree but at least a year or two open, so I figured I'd start them right away while they were still somewhat fresh. Four germinated, and started out life together in a small shallow bonsai pot filled with old, broken down bonsai soil with little to no organics left. I grew them in my bedroom under lights over the winter, and tried the seedling cutting technique on one of them. The rest I separated into tiny hydroponic baskets in January in hopes of developing more symmetrical root systems.

Of the four, the least vigorous one died in February or so (from overwatering, I believe). The one I tried the seedling cutting technique on failed to put out a second round of roots for several months, then succumbed to stem rot.

The last two are doing great, and have been a real joy to observe closely as they develop. They've been living the last few months in small plastic cheesemaking molds, as all the hydro pots I found had holes way too big for my substrate (a mix of screened Growstone soil aerator, bonsai soil from NE Bonsai, and a bit of akadama to help the top layer from drying out too quickly). I think they'll stay in these at least another couple years, as I'm aiming to develop a nice dense root system from the start.

I look forward to following your experiment, Jean-Luc, and will post updates on my own if there's interest!

Best,
Laura
 

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Vance Wood

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A basic truth remains. If there were not those of us who are willing to venture into the world of cultivation there would be far fewer quality trees for those who will not go there to work on. In a sense it is the bonsai food chain. Sure; all of us would love to work on five-hundred-year-old Yamadori trees but not all of us have the availability to them or the income to afford to purchase them.
 
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pitchpine

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I'm also trying round 2 of an even more foolhardy experiment--- Pin Cherry (Prunus pensylvanica) from seed! I have thus far been able to find zero examples of them as bonsai, though the seeds and seedlings are sometimes marketed as "bonsai suitable."

As a pioneer species, they're relatively short-lived trees, and they're also fairly disease-prone. But with such naturally small foliage and the most gorgeous, tiny, bright red fruit, I think it's worth a shot! I'm planning on starting a post on that experiment soon.

Laura



A basic truth remains. If there were not those of us who are willing to venture into the world of cultivation there would be far fewer quality trees for those who will not go there to work on. In a sense it is the bonsai food chain. Sure; all of us would love to work on five-hundred-year-old Yamadori trees but not all of us have the availability to them or the income to afford to purchase them.
 

jeanluc83

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Thanks for the encouragement. I’m glad to see that there are more people out there growing pitch pine seedlings.

At this point I’m banking on the numbers being in my favor. Of the 100 seeds I started with about 70 or so have sprouted. Half of those will probably be suitable for seedling cuttings. From that I hope to get maybe 5 or 6 that are suitable for development as bonsai. Any more than that will be bonus.

Based on the technique for JBP my seedlings are almost ready for cuttings. If I have time I’ll probably get to it this weekend. Updates will follow.
 

pitchpine

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I think you'll have a lot of fun. I also have a collected sapling, maybe 4-8 years old that I'm learning a lot from. I collected it last August (not the same place I got my seeds from) and did some major pruning. The number of adventitious buds it's putting out is incredible! Gives so many possibilities for shaping the future tree!

The picture below is from last fall, I need to take another showing all the new growth.
 

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jeanluc83

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That looks like it has definite potential. I would try to get some movement into that trunk. What is the caliber of the trunk?
 

pitchpine

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The trunk is maybe 5/8" - 3/4" at the base right now. I am thinking of eventually using two of the low adventitious buds from this year as the first branch and new trunk section, but for this summer I'm just going to let it grow and see what happens. Don't want to do any more hard pruning just yet, but I've been rubbing off lots of extraneous buds as they continue to pop on the current trunk. I'll try & post an updated pic tonight to show the new growth.

That looks like it has definite potential. I would try to get some movement into that trunk. What is the caliber of the trunk?
 

pitchpine

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Here's the "older" tree today
 

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Jason_mazzy

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the corkscrew needles and candles look like my Virginia pines. interesting.
 

pitchpine

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Yeah, I've seen those down in Shenandoah, and they do look remarkably like Pitch! Three needles, spiny cones, similar bark. I don't think they put out adventitious buds the same way Pitch does, though.

the corkscrew needles and candles look like my Virginia pines. interesting.
 

jeanluc83

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I made some seedling cuttings yesterday so I figured I’d update my post.

I ended up with 36 cuttings. I’m hoping for a 50% success rate but we will see. I also have at least as many seedlings that I am going to let grow. It will be interesting to see the differences in the years to come.

Over all I’ve been very happy with my success and at how easy the process is. I recommend anyone interested in pines to at least try growing from seed once.
 

thumblessprimate1

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This is great. I started growing not pitch but Japanese black pine and Japanese red pine this year. It is neat seeing the variations. I plan to grow some out, but use most of them for grafts. I'm suprised how quickly the seeds can sprout. Some of my Japanese red pine took less than 7 days. My Japanese black pine at least a week to two weeks.
 
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