Thread grafting problem

[karen82]

I'm pretty new to bonsai still and attempted my first thread graft on a trident maple earlier this year.
The graft seems very weak and I was wondering what I should do.
I think the weakness is because the grafted branch is at the bottom and heavily shaded by the rest of the tree which is a little bushy.
Would it be a good idea to partially defoliate or cut back the rest of the tree to force it to put a little more energy into the thread grafted branch?

Also the 2nd pic is about a week after the first, I think the crispy bits are from letting it dry out; it's in full sun and demands watering twice a day, it wilts dramatically if I'm a little late. I was hoping keeping it in full sun would help it grow more vigorously and heal the graft but not I'm not so sure.. would moving it to a partial shade location be better?

 

[0soyoung]

I think the weakness is because the grafted branch is at the bottom and heavily shaded by the rest of the tree which is a little bushy.
Would it be a good idea to partially defoliate or cut back the rest of the tree

Yes, at least the stuff that is shading the thread.
Generally, it will get more sun if it is on the south side of the tree, but other stuff can negate that, like the south side of my house is a forest or my apartment has only a balcony that faces east. Western exposure is the most challenging for it because it is heated by the sun and the air is the hottest and driest in the afternoon. The same intensity of light happens in the east in the morning, but the humidity is the highest of the day.

 

[Cristian D.]

I'm pretty new to bonsai still and attempted my first thread graft on a trident maple earlier this year.
The graft seems very weak and I was wondering what I should do.
I think the weakness is because the grafted branch is at the bottom and heavily shaded by the rest of the tree which is a little bushy.
Would it be a good idea to partially defoliate or cut back the rest of the tree to force it to put a little more energy into the thread grafted branch?

Also the 2nd pic is about a week after the first, I think the crispy bits are from letting it dry out; it's in full sun and demands watering twice a day, it wilts dramatically if I'm a little late. I was hoping keeping it in full sun would help it grow more vigorously and heal the graft but not I'm not so sure.. would moving it to a partial shade location be better?
View attachment 201317View attachment 201318

Is the entry of the graft in the trunk higher than the exit? I think that could have an influence because of the apical dominance.

 

[markyscott]

Anthracnose. Since it’s shaded, was performed late in the season, and was defoliated, it’s weak and susceptible. Soft growth is more easily affected than the foliage that is hardened off. Keep it dry, thin the overlying leaves to allow more light to the grafted shoot. Spray with a fungicide like daconil. Dust with rose sulphur powder.

 

[karen82]

Thank you. The entry is higher than the exit, it wasn't really what I wanted but the shoot I had chosen just barely reached (another reason to do it somewhat later in the season, I wanted to let that shoot get as long as I could).
I'll try treating it with fungicide and defoliating a little for sun. The thread grafted branch was actually pointed east, I turned it south, but that really doesn't change the sun it gets very much as the tree is out in the open.

 

[TN_Jim]

Is the entry of the graft in the trunk higher than the exit? I think that could have an influence because of the apical dominance.

Hmmm....is this true? I’m picking up what you’re putting down, but I’m feeling fuzzy on this one.

Can this be elaborated on?

 

[Cristian D.]

I got the info from Harry Harington's book, Bonsai Inspirations vol. 1, chapter 9. I am not sure a screenshot will help because I bought the book in spanish, so my little daughter could read it. But the same info is here: http://bonsai4me.com/AdvTech/ATthreadgrafting.htm
I'm sure I encountered this idea in other books too, but I don't remember where, sorry.

 

[leatherback]

Hmmm....is this true? I’m picking up what you’re putting down, but I’m feeling fuzzy on this one.

Not wanting to say Harry is wrogn of course.. I think what is importnat that the tip of the branch is pointed upward, and higher than the grafting side to keep apical dominance that the tip. Certaintly if you keep side-branches on the entry-side of the grafty down, the plant should just grow. I have maples which have found their way weaving through several trees to get to a bit of light, going up and down where needed.

 

[petegreg]

Not wanting to say Harry is wrogn of course.. I think what is importnat that the tip of the branch is pointed upward, and higher than the grafting side to keep apical dominance that the tip. Certaintly if you keep side-branches on the entry-side of the grafty down, the plant should just grow. I have maples which have found their way weaving through several trees to get to a bit of light, going up and down where needed.

I'm convinced you're right, right my first feelings. It sounds reasonably. The portion of graft leaving a trunk matters. To make it perfect, just keep a correct angle and let it seesome light (for OP). The rest is just a donor.

 

[KillerButts]

Anthracnose. Since it’s shaded, was performed late in the season, and was defoliated, it’s weak and susceptible. Soft growth is more easily affected than the foliage that is hardened off. Keep it dry, thin the overlying leaves to allow more light to the grafted shoot. Spray with a fungicide like daconil. Dust with rose sulphur powder.

Sideline question sir, has it been determined in any university studies if a sapsucker receives more growth hormones than a watersprout, vice versa or even steven? Trying some things out in my ignorant head before I get ambition on a separate matter related to grafting. Any information would be very much appreciated.