Njyamadori
Chumono
Thanks so much everyone! My plan now is that I will get 9 seedlings of Japanese maple twist them together with tubing with wire . Then put that is a container with lava akadama and pumice . And around early spring . Thanks again
Trident Maple Clump
- Thread starter AndyJ
- Start date
BuckeyeOne
Chumono
Has anyone removed the cambium at the contact points of the seedlings to promote fusing?
I have a bunch of tridents on their way and I'm going to give it a try.
Also, what is a good number to fuse? 5,7,9? I'm trying to account for the loss of one or two.
Can I do it now as the seedling are bareroot and I'm gonna have to plant anyhow? They'll be protected 'til spring.
I have a bunch of tridents on their way and I'm going to give it a try.
Also, what is a good number to fuse? 5,7,9? I'm trying to account for the loss of one or two.
Can I do it now as the seedling are bareroot and I'm gonna have to plant anyhow? They'll be protected 'til spring.
Njyamadori
Chumono
Watch the Esei en maple clump part 1 video on YouTube. Bjorn didn’t remove the cambium because it fuses but it’s self . Also it’s recommended to do 9 in a clump expecting 1 or 2 to die
BuckeyeOne
Chumono
I watched Bjorn's video. Was just curious if anyone tried differently.
leatherback
The Treedeemer
For the one I did, I did not cut the bark. I am assuming over time this will fuse.
Shibui
Imperial Masterpiece
Much will depend on the thickness of these seedlings. Taking even a very small amount of bark off very thin trunks can cause dieback. By all means try if you want but I only cut bark on pencil thick and thicker trunks when I want specific areas to graft. For clump style I thread the seedlings through holes drilled in sheet metal. As the trunks expand they are constricted by the metal sheet and form callus which swells then produces new roots above the metal and the enlarging callus readily grafts to others nearby. Some really good multi trunk trees grown this way.
More details of this technique on Shibuibonsai.com.au. This link should go straight to the search for plate technique - Shibui Bonsai seedlings through metal plates
More details of this technique on Shibuibonsai.com.au. This link should go straight to the search for plate technique - Shibui Bonsai seedlings through metal plates
SeanS
Omono
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@Njyamadori this is a fantastic resource, please go read all of @Shibui articles on that page. You’ll see the benefits of the plate method. Although Bjorn’s wire binding method is also excellent, the plate method does result in a better nebari as well as possible faster fusing
SeanS
Omono
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@Njyamadori heres a celtis seedling I planted through a washer last September (my spring time, Southern Hemisphere). It’s swollen around the washer hole and started to throw out lateral roots above. You can see the silver washer in the photo and the roots above it.
AndyJ
Shohin
When I did it, I followed @Smoke guide and it worked really well for my trident clump. Because I’m in the UK, I didn’t want to plant this in the ground in case it froze so I planted it in a big round pond basket so I could put it indoors over winter and it grew really well. I severed the top from the bottom after two seasons and when I repotted this year, could see loads of fusing of the roots. It works really well.
Another technique I tried, was to buy a vigorous straight green maple, and cut it down to about 6” from the base. The tree then threw out loads of buds all over with about 8 or 9 buds from the top ring. I rubbed off everything below this top ring and let the shoots grow. Some grew much much faster than others so I trimmed them back a few times to try and balance the vigour. I left this to grow for two seasons and then airlayered it off last summer. It looks really cool so I’m going to try it again this year with a cultivar and see what happens
Another technique I tried, was to buy a vigorous straight green maple, and cut it down to about 6” from the base. The tree then threw out loads of buds all over with about 8 or 9 buds from the top ring. I rubbed off everything below this top ring and let the shoots grow. Some grew much much faster than others so I trimmed them back a few times to try and balance the vigour. I left this to grow for two seasons and then airlayered it off last summer. It looks really cool so I’m going to try it again this year with a cultivar and see what happens
SeanS
Omono
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The JM clump from the shoots is a great idea. I did something similar where I layered off the top of a branch that had 5 shoots growing from one spot. I only layered it earlier this season but it’s growing really well so far. The branches (now the trunks) are all different sizes so should be a nice clump once I start working it.
How thick was the trunk that you chopped? Asking to get an idea of how far apart the trunks are and the size of the wound in the middle. I may try that too at some stage.
AndyJ
Shohin
Was that a maple you did it on Sean? Any pics?
Trunk was just pencil thickness so not that big but when the shoots were thin, I did wire them out a bit quite low down to give them a bit of movement. When I set the air layer, I cut the trunk right up tight against the bottom of the ring of shoots and then scraped off the bark of the bottom of those wired out shoots. Roots came from everywhere and created quite a big pad. I’ll try and get out and get a picture today / tomorrow
Njyamadori
Chumono
Yours is very good and I love them but I don’t have any metal to cut and I already bought stuff for the Bjorn way . Is there a way I can help nebari when using the tubing method ? Also how long ago did you start these ?
SeanS
Omono
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It’s the cluster of branches circled in the naked pic. All the bright green foliage is the new growth since I separated last November. The roots of the layer are filling the pot and every now and then one pops up at the edge and has to be covered up.
I did the same thing, but the layer right up against the bottom of where the branches e
The 5th trunk is hidden in the back
Shibui
Imperial Masterpiece
Those ones pictured 2-3 years since the seedlings were threaded through the plates.
Good root pruning will definitely help build good nebari. You will have to wait until all the trunks have fused so they can share roots but after that prune all vertical roots really hard - as close to the base of the clump as possible. Also cut lateral roots quite short to promote better root ramification. Nebari is not just about a few strong lateral roots. Roots should divide and taper like branches and trunks above so pruning down below is just as important as up top.
If you start root pruning too much before the trunks are well fused the inner ones may stop growing or even die as they will have fewer roots.
I have noticed a tendency for outer trunks to grow faster than the center ones. I assume this is because the outside trees have better access to the soil for water and food. Clumps and groups usually look better when the inner trunks are larger and taller so watch relative trunk development. You may need to retard some outer ones so they don't overtake the middle trunks.
Also check Ebihara method. He popularized tying trees to a flat board to promote horizontal root growth. I believe he also uses regular root pruning to develop better root ramification. In my experience the board is not really needed. Good root pruning will do much the same thing. After a few years the trees seem to stop making vertical roots and concentrate energy on the laterals.
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AndyJ
Shohin
Update on my Trident Maple Clump.
The clump had been moved from its pond basket last spring and placed in a wooden box where it was given another full year of unrestricted growth. It got up to a height of about 6ft and I cut the tops in order to get it into my shed for the winter. It started shooting about 10 days ago so I’ve removed it from the box cut back the roots and got it into a plastic training pot. In hindsight, I’m not sure if I worked the roots back enough - something for next year.
This is probably the front
The clump had been moved from its pond basket last spring and placed in a wooden box where it was given another full year of unrestricted growth. It got up to a height of about 6ft and I cut the tops in order to get it into my shed for the winter. It started shooting about 10 days ago so I’ve removed it from the box cut back the roots and got it into a plastic training pot. In hindsight, I’m not sure if I worked the roots back enough - something for next year.
This is probably the front
AndyJ
Shohin
I’m going to try and arrange the trunks now, probably with some guy wires and cut others back to appropriate side shoots so I can get some changes in trunk direction. However, I‘m not sure if my front looks a little unbalanced so if I can’t manipulate an existing trunk, I might need to added an extra trunk in there. I air-layered three tops off of these last year so could squeeze one or two in.
There are a lot of new buds breaking - many of which are in pairs. Should I be reducing these pairs down to just one shoot now? I’m thinking that I don’t want bar branches or swelling. Or do I not need to worry about it for this year.
Here’s a close up of some of the new shoots.
There are a lot of new buds breaking - many of which are in pairs. Should I be reducing these pairs down to just one shoot now? I’m thinking that I don’t want bar branches or swelling. Or do I not need to worry about it for this year.
Here’s a close up of some of the new shoots.
AndyJ
Shohin
Hi folks!
I haven’t been on for a while as I’ve been in hospital for surgery on my my back - now I’m the long road to recovery and, unfortunately as a result, my trees have been neglected some over the summer. I managed to walk down the garden this morning and noticed that my trident clump has put on loads of growth - all those shoots have taken off and I’ve got a bush in a pot!! Is it too late in the summer for me to thin this out now and select some keeper branches? Or do I have to wait until next year? And can I wire my keeper branches still or, again, do I have to wait until next year now?
Please can you experienced Trident Maple guys offer any advice on this initial pruning phase?
Thanks all,
Andy
I haven’t been on for a while as I’ve been in hospital for surgery on my my back - now I’m the long road to recovery and, unfortunately as a result, my trees have been neglected some over the summer. I managed to walk down the garden this morning and noticed that my trident clump has put on loads of growth - all those shoots have taken off and I’ve got a bush in a pot!! Is it too late in the summer for me to thin this out now and select some keeper branches? Or do I have to wait until next year? And can I wire my keeper branches still or, again, do I have to wait until next year now?
Please can you experienced Trident Maple guys offer any advice on this initial pruning phase?
Thanks all,
Andy
leatherback
The Treedeemer
it is late in the season. That being said, I pruned a trident last week, hoping for a bunch of young branches to sprout for me to wire..
AndyJ
Shohin
Thanks @leatherback - not particularly worried about new shoots at this stage. Am thinking more about removing the branches that i definitely don’t want and wiring those that are keepers. I’ve watched what gents like yourself, @markyscott @Dav4 @Brian Van Fleet and @MACH5 but I have trouble translating their work to my own trees! 
MACH5
Imperial Masterpiece
@AndyJ I think you have an excellent piece of material to work with. As Jelle (@leatherback ) said do not cut back now. It is too late. Wait until fall right around after leaf fall to cut back. You can however wire now anything you think you will keep. I personally avoid heavy wiring in the fall. I wait until late winter/early spring to do most of that work on deciduous trees.
