Tropical forest

Drjd

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Hey everyone, Im starting to plan a forest on a stone slab. I live in Florida in a hardiness 9b. Not to have zone envy but I can’t really do as much with pines here, but I would really like to make a pine or cypress forest. Even getting my hands on decent JBP is hard. Does anyone recommend a certain species that may work well for a forest? At this point I’m defaulting to junipers (it’s hard to get anything more than the procumbens nana in my part of Florida), but I’d love to have some options. I’ll probably be picking up the trees from wigerts, but there is also a smaller bonsai place in Tampa too.
 

Eckhoffw

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Loblolly pine, short leaf pine, and stone pine may work for you?
 

Eckhoffw

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There is also norfolk pine but..., meh.
 

penumbra

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There are a lot on non coniferous plants you can use, literally dozens of them.
 

shimbrypaku

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Bucida spinosa in an oak grove setting
I had a few single trees when I lived in south Florida.

Nice plant small leaves like a boxwood.
 

Drjd

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Bald cypress! They are native to your region and make great bonsai.
Great idea, I know they sell those locally too. Thanks!
There are a lot on non coniferous plants you can use, literally dozens of them.
I know there are, I was asking if any lend themselves particularly well for a forest. I mention coniferous trees because to me they fit well in a forest and there are many great examples online to base my design on.
Bucida spinosa in an oak grove setting
I had a few single trees when I lived in south Florida.

Nice plant small leaves like a boxwood.
buddhist pine aka Podocarpus macrophyllus
Awesome Ill check both these out! Thanks!
 

Katie0317

Chumono
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Hey everyone, Im starting to plan a forest on a stone slab. I live in Florida in a hardiness 9b. Not to have zone envy but I can’t really do as much with pines here, but I would really like to make a pine or cypress forest. Even getting my hands on decent JBP is hard. Does anyone recommend a certain species that may work well for a forest? At this point I’m defaulting to junipers (it’s hard to get anything more than the procumbens nana in my part of Florida), but I’d love to have some options. I’ll probably be picking up the trees from wigerts, but there is also a smaller bonsai place in Tampa too.
Hey there, Just wanted to share that we stopped by Artisans Bonsai in Tampa about 10 days ago and they didn't have a lot of interesting trees for sale. I wouldn't make the drive but we were driving right past them heading west so stopped. They've changed their direction in the last year as the owner took in a partner and the trees for sale were not as interesting.

They used to buy wholesale from Wigerts so they had nice trees but pricey. Worth it though. You have Wigerts right near you so I'd take advantage of that. They can help you with your questions too. As far as bald cypress go, a lot of people in central Florida use them for forests. Good luck.
 

Drjd

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Hey there, Just wanted to share that we stopped by Artisans Bonsai in Tampa about 10 days ago and they didn't have a lot of interesting trees for sale. I wouldn't make the drive but we were driving right past them heading west so stopped. They've changed their direction in the last year as the owner took in a partner and the trees for sale were not as interesting.

They used to buy wholesale from Wigerts so they had nice trees but pricey. Worth it though. You have Wigerts right near you so I'd take advantage of that. They can help you with your questions too. As far as bald cypress go, a lot of people in central Florida use them for forests. Good luck.
Thats great to know about Artisans Bonsai, I have been there maybe 6 years ago but the changes don't sound appealing. Even then the options were very limited. It is also very interesting to know that they buy from Wigerts which I can just do myself.

I have purchased 80% of my trees from Wigerts and their selection is great. I will certainly look at the bald cypress more seriously as a great option for the forest. Thank you for the advice!
 

namnhi

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I don't understand why you have difficulty with JBP? I don't know if @Eric Schrader still have some bundle available. They should do well in Florida since they do quite well in Houston. Alternatively you can do Bald Cypress which should be abundant in your area. Am I missing something?
 

Drjd

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I don't understand why you have difficulty with JBP? I don't know if @Eric Schrader still have some bundle available. They should do well in Florida since they do quite well in Houston. Alternatively you can do Bald Cypress which should be abundant in your area. Am I missing something?

I wouldn't say I have difficulty maintaining or growing them. The difficulty is finding them for sale in my area. I have a medium/large JBP that I acquired by calling every bonsai place in Florida for months. As of now it is growing vigorously. I also purchased a smaller JBP from California that I am currently growing to the size I would like. It will probably take another 5-8 years. I purchased a shimpaku and JBP pre-bonsai from Georgia but keeping them happy in a 9b zone was out of my skill level. From my reading it seems best to try and acquire trees that have grown and developed in a similar climate to maximize their survival in our warmer area. There is no real winter here and the trees have to adapt to resource utilization without the winter to give them a break. Thankfully JBPs evolved as coastal trees and seem to do fine in my area. The issue is that even though they seem to do well they are not sold by many nurseries.

So really it comes down to finding quality JBPs in Florida or Southern California, especially at reasonable prices. Wigert's has an incredible selection of trees, but they carry very little coniferous trees, and only rarely have quality JBPs. Building a forest out of JBPs in my area would be a very difficult process, and very expensive project versus other species.
 

namnhi

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I don't know how old you are and what is your goal but you have to start somewhere.
If JBP is hard to come by in your area the I suggest start with seedlings. I did that many years ago so I do have plenty to play with. I also just start a new batch from seedlings I got from Eric S.
I don't think trees remember if they coming from different zones as where they will be growned. My original batch came from Matt Owinga which locate in Maryland. They did just fine.

20220331_165548.jpg20220331_165757.jpg20220331_165820.jpg
Above are from @cmeg1 . 7 cuttings grown together.

20220328_181112.jpg
 

Drjd

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I don't know how old you are and what is your goal but you have to start somewhere.
If JBP is hard to come by in your area the I suggest start with seedlings. I did that many years ago so I do have plenty to play with. I also just start a new batch from seedlings I got from Eric S.
I don't think trees remember if they coming from different zones as where they will be growned. My original batch came from Matt Owinga which locate in Maryland. They did just fine.

View attachment 428668View attachment 428669View attachment 428670
Above are from @cmeg1 . 7 cuttings grown together.

View attachment 428671
Great trees! I have plenty of time to grow some, just a space issue. It's why I usual stick to buying trees, because growing can be difficult due to not enough room. As for the trees "remembering" the climate, I am not sure I would say it that way. This was a topic I discussed with multiple Bonsai nurseries (including plant city Georgia and a JBP nursery from a northern state, I think ohio?). They both recommended given a year or two of allowing the trees to acclimate to our weather.

The climate acclimation is certainly something that can be seen in trees and animals. I am referring to processes that are more on the basis of epigenetic. Genes that are turned on and off due to environmental exposures. Sunlight exposure and temperature are major factors that control tree behavior. This leads to a marked change in energy and resource storage and use. If a tree continually decreases its metabolism for 6 months of the year for 10 years of its life, to then grow in an area with 2 months of colder weather is a drastically adjustment. Ryan Neil discusses this period of rest for pines frequently, even in JBPs. This contributes to our alternate candle pruning timetable in South Florida.

Ultimately, my skill level plays a huge role and my experience with pines is drastically less than tropical species just due to availability in my area as I discussed before. My ability to bring them to the warmer climate was probably not sufficient. Hearing you obtained yours from Maryland is great, and I will look into it. The nursery from up north said that he sells to florida not infrequently so clearly it is possible. I just need to learn how. Either way for a project like a forest which requires multiple trees I want to maximize my chance of success.
 

Bonsai Turtle

Sapling
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... As for the trees "remembering" the climate, I am not sure I would say it that way. This was a topic I discussed with multiple Bonsai nurseries (including plant city Georgia and a JBP nursery from a northern state, I think ohio?). They both recommended given a year or two of allowing the trees to acclimate to our weather.

The climate acclimation is certainly something that can be seen in trees and animals. I am referring to processes that are more on the basis of epigenetic. Genes that are turned on and off due to environmental exposures. Sunlight exposure and temperature are major factors that control tree behavior. This leads to a marked change in energy and resource storage and use. If a tree continually decreases its metabolism for 6 months of the year for 10 years of its life, to then grow in an area with 2 months of colder weather is a drastically adjustment. Ryan Neil discusses this period of rest for pines frequently, even in JBPs. This contributes to our alternate candle pruning timetable in South Florida.

...

I am in Central Florida (9b). In addition to some that I sourced locally, I purchased a group of bald cypress seedlings from Missouri back in April 2021, bare rooted and dormant. The Missouri ones were behind the locals all year. They all woke up later, and some seemed to go into dormancy earlier than the locals. By spring 2022 though, they all were synced up and now don't appear to behave any different.
 
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