What types of bugs are these?

[pinosilvestre]

Hello.

Can anybody tell me what bugs are on this Fukien Tea Tree?
I have tried with the Neem oil, twice, but with zero results. Any advice would be appreciated.

Thank you in advance.

 

[HorseloverFat]

Those are mealy bugs, friend.

That LOOKS like a Bougainvillea, but I am VERY unfamiliar with Carmona.

If NEEM isn't working, your "schedule" is probably 'off'

You could spot treat with Isopropyl, Also...

Or dunk your tree for 12-24 hours...

Or... If the infestation gets out of control, use systemic.

 

[pinosilvestre]

I soaked the tree with Neem oil twice 7 days apart.

Sorry for asking but what does “dunk your tree for 12-24 hours” mean?
I’m really new to plants in general.

 

[HorseloverFat]

The NEEM schedule I run... Is basically every 2-3 days for 2 weeks ... This covers all the incubation/growth stages for fungus AND bugs.

Dunking your tree, is basically like it sounds... Submerging trees underwater... Bugs can't breathe that water (I couldn't shoot the water, so a prisoner I was taken, DANGIT, JENNY! )

NOW I do not know if CARMONAs will handle dunking... If you do THAT one, wait until someone knowledgeable about Fukien Tea chimes in.

 

[pinosilvestre]

Thanks a lot.

I have Permethrin at home that I use when I go hunting. It looks like it works with mealy bugs.
Have you ever used it on plants?

 

[Dogestoevsky]

Mealybugs are the worst. My succulents have struggled with then two winters in a row after moving indoors. Insecticidal soap will kill many of them in contact, but you’ll have to keep at it since they bury themselves deep in leaf axils. 70% isopropyl alcohol works as a spot treatment (or spray drench if your plant can tolerate it).

 

[gjones_42]

Hello.

Can anybody tell me what bugs are on this Fukien Tea Tree?
I have tried with the Neem oil, twice, but with zero results. Any advice would be appreciated.

Thank you in advance.

View attachment 462489

Definitely mealybugs. Those F**kers are resilient, unsightly, and a pain.

With your neem oil, are you getting the undersides of the leaves? They usually live there, and if you miss 1 or 2 within a few days, boom they're back.

I'd suggest the following based on plenty of experience with mealybugs on other houseplants (but please see how hardy this species is, don't want to do more harm than good; maybe someone with knowledge of this species can chime in)
-place your tree somewhat elevated and use a garden hose to spray the heck out of it, angled so you are spraying up into the bottom of the leaves. Adjust the force (start w/ mist and get stronger) so you don't harm the plant. Keep it as gentle as possible without being a mist so you don't harm the bonsai. Mealybugs can be washed away with water unlike other infestations.
-Then let the plant dry and repeat your neem oil application, taking care to get the underside of the leaves.
-Repeat again at the shortest interval recommended
-Check the leaves daily for signs of the bugs. When they die, they lose the white fuzz, so they're easy to find when alive

I try to avoid insecticides as much as possible since they can have unwanted impacts on other bugs that are not harmful. Especially relevant with outdoor plants. With this in mind, I would not recommend the permethrin (also considering it is toxic to humans, which is why the instructions and warnings read like a short novel).

You could also try dusting with diatomaceous earth but this is slower and it's tricky to get it on the underside of the leaves.

good luck, do report back!

 

[Wires_Guy_wires]

Oh no. These buggers don't give a hoot about neem oil and they're resistant to most insecticides from the get go.
They're of the pseudococcicadae family, and a branch on their own in the evolutionary tree. Whereas there's broad spectrum stuff that attacks all aphids, because those all have the same chemical pathways wired in their bodies.. Most insecticides will not hurt mealy bugs whatsoever because they're wired entirely different.

Make sure, absolutely sure, you have the right stuff. So read the darn label. And make sure, absolutely sure, that you treat every plant in the same room - no exceptions and no cheating by relocating plants, which is what my girlfriend did and it only expanded the problem. It took me eight months to get rid of them.
Because if you don't get all of them.. And one of them survives, they'll be resistant to whatever you have used in the past. Here in Europe we have about three options left, all of which are systemics and all of which are highly toxic to everything except plants.

I'm going as far as marking garden centers as being a no-go zone for a year if I spot mealy bugs in their plants. I don't want to use chemicals indoors anymore. Especially with winter around the corner when there's almost no option of safely leaving the plants outside to dry.

I cannot stress enough to read the label. It'll take five minutes but those five minutes might save your pet's life if something goes wrong.

 

[gjones_42]

And make sure, absolutely sure, that you treat every plant in the same room - no exceptions and no cheating by relocating plants, which is what my girlfriend did and it only expanded the problem. It took me eight months to get rid of them.
Because if you don't get all of them.. And one of them survives, they'll be resistant to whatever you have used in the past. Here in Europe we have about three options left, all of which are systemics and all of which are highly toxic to everything except plants.

I'm going as far as marking garden centers as being a no-go zone for a year if I spot mealy bugs in their plants. I don't want to use chemicals indoors anymore. Especially with winter around the corner when there's almost no option of safely leaving the plants outside to dry.

Amen to this on all counts...had a whole room infested this way and it took ages to clear out. I was real irate and will never use that garden center.

To the OP: I'd recomment dormant oil (aka horticultural oil) in addition to hosing down. Did not know neem oil is ineffective on these insects. Horticultural oil is not a pesticide, it suffocates them, but takes many more applications since it evaporates quick. It also works poorly in very warm (>85F) areas that includes leaf temp which can be high outdoors in direct sun. Idk what Georgia's like this time of year.

 

[pinosilvestre]

Thank you all.
Yesterday I pruned the tree, removed all the bugs, and spayed it with Sawyer Permethrin.
I’ll report results.

 

[gjones_42]

Thank you all.
Yesterday I pruned the tree, removed all the bugs, and spayed it with Sawyer Permethrin.
I’ll report results.

Hope it works!

 

[HorseloverFat]

Oh no. These buggers don't give a hoot about neem oil and they're resistant to most insecticides from the get go.
They're of the pseudococcicadae family, and a branch on their own in the evolutionary tree. Whereas there's broad spectrum stuff that attacks all aphids, because those all have the same chemical pathways wired in their bodies.. Most insecticides will not hurt mealy bugs whatsoever because they're wired entirely different.

Make sure, absolutely sure, you have the right stuff. So read the darn label. And make sure, absolutely sure, that you treat every plant in the same room - no exceptions and no cheating by relocating plants, which is what my girlfriend did and it only expanded the problem. It took me eight months to get rid of them.
Because if you don't get all of them.. And one of them survives, they'll be resistant to whatever you have used in the past. Here in Europe we have about three options left, all of which are systemics and all of which are highly toxic to everything except plants.

I'm going as far as marking garden centers as being a no-go zone for a year if I spot mealy bugs in their plants. I don't want to use chemicals indoors anymore. Especially with winter around the corner when there's almost no option of safely leaving the plants outside to dry.

I cannot stress enough to read the label. It'll take five minutes but those five minutes might save your pet's life if something goes wrong.

Maybe this is BECAUSE of all the different treatments/ immunities gained, on your continent.

Because, I had mealy bugs on a Rosa Sinensis... And the proper NEEM schedule did the trick... I even WITNESSED the NEEM killing them on contact.

I'm curious, though, because I DO believe this is YOUR experience... I'd just like to compare notes.

 

[gjones_42]

Maybe this is BECAUSE of all the different treatments/ immunities gained, on your continent.

Because, I had mealy bugs on a Rosa Sinensis... And the proper NEEM schedule did the trick... I even WITNESSED the NEEM killing them on contact.

I'm curious, though, because I DO believe this is YOUR experience... I'd just like to compare notes.

I had a similar thought...wondering if there are local differences in exact species traits or resistances. Maybe composition of the neem oil?

Upside of mealybugs is they are glaringly obvious, so it's pretty easy to tell if a treatment worked or not. Now if only folks would check for them BEFORE bringing a plant as a "gift"...

 

[Wires_Guy_wires]

Maybe this is BECAUSE of all the different treatments/ immunities gained, on your continent.

Because, I had mealy bugs on a Rosa Sinensis... And the proper NEEM schedule did the trick... I even WITNESSED the NEEM killing them on contact.

I'm curious, though, because I DO believe this is YOUR experience... I'd just like to compare notes.

Oh yeah absolutely! It's a local thing.
Maybe it's also the neem oil source, the kind of soap used as an emulsifier (potassium or sodium based can make a difference) and even the concentration.

Our garden stores traditionally receive plants from a global market, you know, because of the tulip and orchid trade. On top of that we've had decades, generations of fruit growers spraying whatever they could get their hands on.
So I'm fairly sure it's local resistance in naturally ocurring populations here.

I've rubbed straight neem oil from the bottle on them and they just.. lived.

 

[gjones_42]

I've rubbed straight neem oil from the bottle on them and they just.. lived.

That's rough... I wonder if the neem needs some water to distribute the droplets and improve uptake/reduce evaporation rate... Isopropyl is like that where the 99% is less effective at killing fungus/bacteria than the 70% because that 30% water improve permeation into organic material.

 

[HorseloverFat]

Oh yeah absolutely! It's a local thing.
Maybe it's also the neem oil source, the kind of soap used as an emulsifier (potassium or sodium based can make a difference) and even the concentration.

Our garden stores traditionally receive plants from a global market, you know, because of the tulip and orchid trade. On top of that we've had decades, generations of fruit growers spraying whatever they could get their hands on.
So I'm fairly sure it's local resistance in naturally ocurring populations here.

I've rubbed straight neem oil from the bottle on them and they just.. lived.

This is FASCINATING!!!! How does this mechanism compare with Big-Ag's "Round-up" crops.

Also...I NEVER THOUGHT of the difference between NA and K emulsifiers..

DUH! Those are fairly different elements which behave markedly different "cross the board".

Neat!!

Whoops!! Sorry OP.

 

[Wires_Guy_wires]

That's rough... I wonder if the neem needs some water to distribute the droplets and improve uptake/reduce evaporation rate... Isopropyl is like that where the 99% is less effective at killing fungus/bacteria than the 70% because that 30% water improve permeation into organic material.

I think that the active compound needs the oil as a transporter/solvent because it's in the limonoid compound group.
In general, animals have an epidermis to keep those kind of materials (and water) out.

I think the neem mode of action isn't contact based but based on the fact that it'll cover the tree and prevents them from eating, or messes with their intestines and hormonal functions if bugs do eat from it. Which is why it possibly is a bad material to treat scale, because scale covers its own feeding ground with a shell and hardly moves.
From what I can find online, the neem needs to be ingested to work. But I'll happily learn more.

 

[gjones_42]

I think that the active compound needs the oil as a transporter/solvent because it's in the limonoid compound group.
In general, animals have an epidermis to keep those kind of materials (and water) out.

I think the neem mode of action isn't contact based but based on the fact that it'll cover the tree and prevents them from eating, or messes with their intestines and hormonal functions if bugs do eat from it. Which is why it possibly is a bad material to treat scale, because scale covers its own feeding ground with a shell and hardly moves.
From what I can find online, the neem needs to be ingested to work. But I'll happily learn more.

interesting, I thought neem was the active compound itself (and is an oil inherently as opposed to a solid), which is why it is marketed as an organic/natural pesticide. It would make sense they need to injest as opposed to getting in through the carapice. I know mineral oil (aka horticultural oil, aka dormant oil) is contact based and works by suffocating them. It does have to be diluted down or it will evaporate too fast (the emulsion hides the oil from the air)

*edit: neem oil is the crude extract from neem tree seeds, which contains a number of compounds that kill bugs. cool stuff!

I try to keep good bugs handy (lacewings & ladybugs), which makes me look like a loon when Im running around outside catching them... ah well

 

[pinosilvestre]

......

Upside of mealybugs is they are glaringly obvious, so it's pretty easy to tell if a treatment worked or not. Now if only folks would check for them BEFORE bringing a plant as a "gift"...

In my case this is a sort of mystery. I have had this tree since April this year. Always kept indoor, never seen any of those bugs and I have checked regularly. All other plants I have inside my house do not show signs of mealy bugs.
Few weeks ago I purchased six of those mini cacti, brought them home and repotted and they also do not show any bugs.

 

[gjones_42]

In my case this is a sort of mystery. I have had this tree since April this year. Always kept indoor, never seen any of those bugs and I have checked regularly. All other plants I have inside my house do not show signs of mealy bugs.
Few weeks ago I purchased six of those mini cacti, brought them home and repotted and they also do not show any bugs.

Were you in a greenhouse/garden center when you got those cacti? It's very possible they hitch-hiked on you from brushing up against a plant that was infested.

I just had the issue with contaminating a few indoor plants with whiteflies that I brought in from my garden. First time it happened and a valuable lesson...