Your Vote - which pot for my Cascade

[chicago1980]

Rayner pot. No questions.

 

[Japonicus]

Rayner pot. No questions.

LOL the plot thickens. What brings you to that choice?
Well it's safe to say we won't be finding out this month, today being the 27th.
I like for the foliage to be opening, fluffy and juicy. Just tonight lows in the upper teens to low 20's F.
May 10th last frost date, so I'd say April 17-20th given the full moon is on the 16th.

 

[Shogun610]

Rayner pot. The edge on that one is softer and does not extend out as far as the Chinese pot does. It will create more negative space opportunities for branches that are cascading , bs the Chinese pot the rim extends out , so there is more of a clearance you’ll have to meet. The Rayner pot will accentuate the overall composition, holding the specimen, vs the Chinese pot will restrict it based on its extended lip.

 

[penumbra]

If you think your juniper is deserving, it deserves a hand made pot.

 

[Japonicus]

Rayner pot. The edge on that one is softer and does not extend out as far as the Chinese pot does. It will create more negative space opportunities for branches that are cascading , bs the Chinese pot the rim extends out , so there is more of a clearance you’ll have to meet. The Rayner pot will accentuate the overall composition, holding the specimen, vs the Chinese pot will restrict it based on its extended lip.

Thanks, you know, I had not any thought into the rim width. Good point
but we don't know the orientation of the current drop to the lower apex
without having it in hand out of pot, in pot to see if the clearance is an issue.
Angle and length of departure that branch takes from the trunk, then when it
descends, sure I can measure it up beforehand, but we're going to rotate and wiggle
it around as we find the final resting spot. I'm not disagreeing, I'm thinking your point aloud
and how I will approach all good input. I like your reasoning, and I think the volume of the
SR pot is best suited for the task. If the volumes were same, and a perfect fit, I would go
with the one that makes the foliage more distinct. The SR hazes the background in a smoky
way that to me obscures or blends...with the foliage.
Y'all's making me antsy to get started on this.

 

[Japonicus]

I've got some wiring damage going on that showed up in January on one branch.
I took this coming Mon and Tues off from work to pot up a couple of projects, this being one
and my JWP another. However I like the tips to be more plump and juicy when I pot up procumbens.
Last 2 cold snap s including an 8" snow for one, and low 20's for the other slowed down the awakening.
Almost lost this one last repot starting too soon (March for me), so I may wait, we'll see.

 

[BrianBay9]

Thanks @TinyArt I’m in the same boat. Neither pot is the size I requested upon commissioning inquiry.
I am afraid with the Sara Rainer pot that the overlay dusting colour will be too static, obscuring the green foliage.
I have 3 or 4 other cascade type juniper that could use a pot and I see the same issue with each.
Sara really increases the price on pots that are not round or oval as they’re more difficult for her,
so not sure I’d ever get my $ back if I decide to sell It. In the right light the brown has a coppery look.

If you do decide to sell it, give me a shot.

 

[Japonicus]

Well today was the day.


I could not remove the root ball without using a bolt and hammer through the drain holes.
The cascade makes handling in all categories from moving to over wintering, to repotting difficult at best.

I had to use the sawzall and channel lock pliers to break the pot apart.
As I approached this I knew the SR pot was ...

I think the volume of the
SR pot is best suited for the task.

...still I put it in both pots and took pictures. I was right, the Chinese pot gives best definition the the individual pads.
The SR pot muddies the waters and confuses the negative space by blending.

...also the SR pot makes the lower apex lower, longer, so over wintering is going to be different.
Still, good to zone 4 IIRC, so should not be an issue slightly elevated and mulched up.

 

[Japonicus]

Both apexes are 12" above the pot rim, and below the bottom of the feet.
It stretches a total of 28.5" including the pot.

I really wanted to use the darker Chinese pot, but this far along, it is time to start
downsizing the pot, not upsizing.

 

[Shogun610]

View attachment 435547

View attachment 435548
View attachment 435549

Both apexes are 12" above the pot rim, and below the bottom of the feet.
It stretches a total of 28.5" including the pot.

I really wanted to use the darker Chinese pot, but this far along, it is time to start
downsizing the pot, not upsizing.

Japonicus , May I please see a picture of the lip and the cascade branch? I’m glad you went with that pot I just want to see a side view , where is the front?

 

[Mayank]

Totally thought the Chinese pot at first but now I really like Sara's pot!

 

[Japonicus]

Japonicus , May I please see a picture of the lip and the cascade branch? I’m glad you went with that pot I just want to see a side view , where is the front?

Sure I'll get some more pics of it up tomorrow including the side views.
In the meantime

...this is all I have that comes close to that.

The front is pictured accurately in all 3 pics, post 29 just before your question.
I removed all but 2 pieces of wire. The bottom left pad that covers up the trunk
moves back and left more to expose the trunk.
The cascades pads do not have near the definition the upper ones do, but they will.
I think the upper pads are just thicker and more robust.

I nearly lost this cascade at last repotting 3/2018 so it's been a very stressful day for me.
I had thinned it late 2017. The difference today, is I've not done much thinning over the last 4 years
and very little last year in anticipation of building energy prior to todays work.
I would have liked to have done more today on the roots here, but stopped short.
I'm afraid I've damaged some foliage man handling it to remove the wooden pot.
None that I'm aware of, but like wiring damage really. We'll see soon enough.

 

[Brian Van Fleet]

Good choice. The foliage and bark color work well with the pot color.

 

[Japonicus]

May I please see a picture of the lip and the cascade branch?

It's kind of hard to get all of that in focus with this lens in one shot.
Not sure this is what you're looking for.

Plus having just watered it, it's really dark and pot is spotted some.
The cascading branch comes off of the trunk a hair above soil level, not much.

I just want to see a side view

Having not done much to the foliage in the last 4 years other than just enough to wire a bit
that is not really an attractive shot, but here goes

Right side


Left side


Back displaying more dangling foliage which will get cleaned up soon.

 

[Japonicus]

Good choice. The foliage and bark color work well with the pot color.

Thanks Brian. If the Chinese pot were same volume I would have used that one.
I haven't seen one, but a white sand semi cascade pot is now in my sights for this one.
I'm sure Sara could make one in a lighter clay when she's working with it.
I mean going through a ton of dark clay, she doesn't change clays until she's done
with what she's working with. Not sure if that's twice/yr or just how often, but it will
be a while before I need another pot for this one I hope.

 

[rockm]

It's kind of hard to get all of that in focus with this lens in one shot.
Not sure this is what you're looking for.
View attachment 435646View attachment 435647
Plus having just watered it, it's really dark and pot is spotted some.
The cascading branch comes off of the trunk a hair above soil level, not much.


Having not done much to the foliage in the last 4 years other than just enough to wire a bit
that is not really an attractive shot, but here goes
View attachment 435648
Right side

View attachment 435649
Left side

View attachment 435650
Back displaying more dangling foliage which will get cleaned up soon.

FWIW, going with the Rayner pot you may have dodged a bullet. If you've had spalling on other Yixing pots in the past because of overwintering, you'd likely get the same with that Chinese pot. I have had several higher end Yixing pots have that same issue over the years. They tend to spall, crack, and leach salts through their walls...I no longer buy them.

On the flip side, I've never had an issue like that with any of the pots I've gotten from Sara Rayner. They wear very well over the years. Can't say the same for Yixing pots.

 

[Japonicus]

If you've had spalling on other Yixing pots in the past because of overwintering

Actually no, because this is the 1st time I've been serious about acquiring decent pottery.
Retiring next year, I may not have the funds to do this very often either.
Now I'm stuck with a big cascade pot I may never use LOL.

 

[rockm]

Actually no, because this is the 1st time I've been serious about acquiring decent pottery.
Retiring next year, I may not have the funds to do this very often either.
Now I'm stuck with a big cascade pot I may never use LOL.

That split and cracked pot from Amazon? I'd bet it's Chinese-made.

 

[JeffS73]

FWIW, going with the Rayner pot you may have dodged a bullet. If you've had spalling on other Yixing pots in the past because of overwintering, you'd likely get the same with that Chinese pot. I have had several higher end Yixing pots have that same issue over they years. They tend to spall, crack, and leach salts through their walls...I no longer buy them.

On the flip side, I've never had an issue like that with any of the pots I've gotten from Sara Rayner. They wear very well over the years. Can't say the same for Yixing pots.

I'm sticking my neck out here but to the best of my knowledge / research Yixing pots are fired lower, and hence are less vitreous than ones fired to less than 3% porosity. In fact the fine, porous nature of the clay is what makes Yixing quite unique. Perhaps more suitable for milder climates.

To pick up another point, slab / coil building or carving a pot takes much, much more time than throwing on a wheel. SR is right to charge more for these pots. Press moulding is fairly quick, but it's a cookie cutter method, of course nothing wrong with that, but as I'm finding, there are degrees of hand building.

 

[Japonicus]

That split and cracked pot from Amazon? I'd bet it's Chinese-made.

I'd bet you're right. How bad would it be to put that cascade in the oversized darker pot?
I mean in terms of internodes on new growth. It may not be that bad really. It needs a pot
and the extra growth rate may play into the cascading branch just fine, you think?