Chop suggestions for Acer Rubrum

[Tim.E]

Hey nutters!

Need some suggestions on an appropriate chop height for my collected acer Rubrum. I like some of the movement halfway up the trunk I find the lack of taper a little boring. I really would like to keep the second trunk to develop a mother daughter style.

All suggestions are welcome!

 

[MichaelS]

 

[Tieball]

There appears to be a lot of nice budding in development. Did you just collect the tree?...or collected some time ago? Myself?....I would hold off chopping more and let some of those buds develop out before chopping further so I know I didn't lose a valued development low down on the trunk. But....I'm really not as aggressive at chopping trunks as I should be.

 

[Tim.E]

There appears to be a lot of nice budding in development. Did you just collect the tree?...or collected some time ago? Myself?....I would hold off chopping more and let some of those buds develop out before chopping further so I know I didn't lose a valued development low down on the trunk. But....I'm really not as aggressive at chopping trunks as I should be.

Collected this spring and just allowed to grow freely. Tree has buds everywhere on the trunk and has many design options. I was considering an air layer in the second pic as the top of the tree has some nice wiggle to it as well

 

[Tieball]

Nice tree collected! What's the trunk diameter above the soil?

 

[Tim.E]

Nice tree collected! What's the trunk diameter above the soil?

Trunk is about 3.5" at soil level and about 2.5" all the way up from there

 

[Tieball]

Trunk is about 3.5" at soil level and about 2.5" all the way up from there

Nice. Thanks for the details.

 

[Nomiyama]

Here are a few things I've picked up in my brief time working with one. They don't take trunk chopping well, expect to see some die back maybe. My friend in Louisiana gifted me one a couple years ago, so I've been building branch structure. The branches are brittle and not the easiest to wire movement into. Also internode spacing and petiole length can be an issue. Not to mention leaf size is a bit large. I'm hoping with more ramification the leaves will become smaller. Last season I cut all leaves in half to allow more light and air in. This seemed to help with keeping inner buds alive. Fun trees to work on with great Fall colors, keep at it. You will have a nice tree in time. Here are a few pics of mine, it's about 30" tall or so now. One last thing, they love water, make sure they don't dry out. Keep us posted on the progress of your tree in the years to come.

 

[sorce]

I like them MichaelS cuts, but I'd bring the new trunks forward right after, to hide the chops, and let the little one get a bit fatter first.

Then more slight movement so mom stays protective.

Sorce

 

[Zach Smith]

Here are a few things I've picked up in my brief time working with one. They don't take trunk chopping well, expect to see some die back maybe. My friend in Louisiana gifted me one a couple years ago, so I've been building branch structure. The branches are brittle and not the easiest to wire movement into. Also internode spacing and petiole length can be an issue. Not to mention leaf size is a bit large. I'm hoping with more ramification the leaves will become smaller. Last season I cut all leaves in half to allow more light and air in. This seemed to help with keeping inner buds alive. Fun trees to work on with great Fall colors, keep at it. You will have a nice tree in time. Here are a few pics of mine, it's about 30" tall or so now. One last thing, they love water, make sure they don't dry out. Keep us posted on the progress of your tree in the years to come.

It's likely you'll start seeing rot beginning at the chop point and working its way down to the base, which happens beginning about year three from collection. This is common for red maple (or swamp maple, the species drumondii down here). I haven't figured out why this happens in my 30 years in bonsai, which is a shame. The leaves will reduce in length with ramification, with the petioles reducing as well. Red maples can make really nice looking bonsai, provided you can work around the difficulties.

 

[Tim.E]

Here are a few things I've picked up in my brief time working with one. They don't take trunk chopping well, expect to see some die back maybe. My friend in Louisiana gifted me one a couple years ago, so I've been building branch structure. The branches are brittle and not the easiest to wire movement into. Also internode spacing and petiole length can be an issue. Not to mention leaf size is a bit large. I'm hoping with more ramification the leaves will become smaller. Last season I cut all leaves in half to allow more light and air in. This seemed to help with keeping inner buds alive. Fun trees to work on with great Fall colors, keep at it. You will have a nice tree in time. Here are a few pics of mine, it's about 30" tall or so now. One last thing, they love water, make sure they don't dry out. Keep us posted on the progress of your tree in the years to come.

Nice maple and thanks for the advice. I've found similarly that these maple are thirsty all the time. The thing I love about them is how vigorous they are. I have a few that put out 7' canes this year. It was crazy

 

[Tim.E]

It's likely you'll start seeing rot beginning at the chop point and working its way down to the base, which happens beginning about year three from collection. This is common for red maple (or swamp maple, the species drumondii down here). I haven't figured out why this happens in my 30 years in bonsai, which is a shame. The leaves will reduce in length with ramification, with the petioles reducing as well. Red maples can make really nice looking bonsai, provided you can work around the difficulties.

I've heard everywhere that reducing the petiole length is neigh impossible. How are you achieving this? Through leaf pruning or defoliation?

 

[Tim.E]

Also I'm a long way away but does anyone have experience with defoliation acer Rubrum? Does it take well yo defoliation or is it more like Japanese maples where partial defoliation is more the game?

 

[Zach Smith]

I've heard everywhere that reducing the petiole length is neigh impossible. How are you achieving this? Through leaf pruning or defoliation?

It happens without any effort, because leaves don't get smaller while petioles stay long. It happens with sweetgum as well. Also with tridents and other maples.

 

[Tim.E]

Well time for choppy choppy. Will be repotting the tree as well in the next week and will be screwing the tree to a board a la Ebihara.

 

[aml1014]

Well time for choppy choppy. Will be repotting the tree as well in the next week and will be screwing the tree to a board a la Ebihara.

I'd sand those chops smooth and use a cut paste. Youll get awkward healing with the way they are now.
Great start none the less.

Aaron

 

[Tim.E]

I'd sand those chops smooth and use a cut paste. Youll get awkward healing with the way they are now.
Great start none the less.

Aaron

Sounds great, I'll try and get to it this weekend