New Trident

[Q-Bonsai]

Over 50 posts in I thought I'd toss in my opinion.

First - this tree has excellent nebari and first section of trunk - if it were my tree, I would be satisfied with it as is, at least concerning the basic building blocks, you will always find things to refine, but the "bones" are in place for the first section.

Paradox, I assume you want a tree that will look "pretty okay" in say maybe 5 years or less. Otherwise why spend what you did? In which case - trunk chops and air layer will not meet this time line. So options one & 2 proposed by Brian are good ideas.

If it were my tree (this means to my tastes) I would go with Brian's option #2 he outlined in post #55. Good eye Brian. This plan can create a nice, quiet, serene tree fairly quickly.

I would not be too worried about the bulges on the trunk, yes you need to begin addressing them now, but they can be fixed, good enough for local shows or club meetings, within a 5 year time line.

The first photo in the OP, is the one I would pick for a front, if seeing it in "real world" did reveal anything the photo didn't capture. That given, I would eliminate all the bar branching right away. One my tree, I would keep one of the lower branches for the time being. You can get rid of it later if you want to expose more of the trunk later. At each point where you remove a bar branch there will be a tendency for buds to break around the callus, once the callus begins to form. If you are lucky, buds will break at the top and bottom of the callus, which you would let grow out a bit, to help heal the wound, and since they are no longer in line with the opposite branch, if needed they can become new branches. But if it were my tree I would initially just plan on using the existing branches as BVF outlined in post #55.

Sacrifice branches allowed to run for a couple years at several levels of the tree would also help, but basically, you got the framework that if it were mine could be made into a "pretty okay" tree in fairly short amount of time.

Making a wild, exciting, radically different masterpiece from this tree would require starting over and spending more than 20 years rebuilding from scratch and refining. I would go with the "pretty okay" plan, and maybe pick up a second trident, to do the "radical" stuff with, with a long time line in mind. I know you like a more naturalistic design, but that was not how this tree was trained before you got it. You could do a second tree in the naturalistic design, starting with younger material, and train it that way from the start.

Here is how I see it. Regardless of what someone spent on a tree, that money is already gone, so there is no point in referring to the cost. In business, that is called a "sunk cost" where the money is already spent. For example, in retail, the owner buys a shirt for $10. For him to make a profit on that shirt, he must sell it for more than $10. But as it sits on the shelf, it is worth $0. Many people are reluctant to sell that shirt for less than $10 because they feel like it's worth at least what they paid. But what they paid is irrelevant, establishing cash flow is relevant.

How does that relate of bonsai? If you buy a tree for $200 that tree might be worth $5 or it can be worth $1000. Regardless of the worth, you've already spent that money, you have to determine what the best route for the tree may be. To say, because I spent X dollars on a tree, I must accept what it looks like, will lead to a collection of very mediocre trees.

The benefit of Paradox's tree being a trident is, they grow fast and are easy to fix. Reverse taper can easily be fixed through carving or air layering or chopping. I am certain it won't take 20 years to develop the tree because the tree isn't that large.

If he chooses to air layer, it will take 1 year to get the new roots to take, one year to let the roots get strong. Then chop off all of the branches, one year to let them grow out, and two years to get secondary, perhaps tertiary branches in place. In 5 years, it's a much better tree.

If he chooses to not air layer, then year one, chop off all of the branches and let the new ones grow wild. Branches are selected and left to grow to the preferred thickness in year 2. In year 2, you can work on the apex by controlling the growth up top while the bottom half of the tree is left to grow. Year three, cut the bottom back, then years 4 and 5 is spent on ramification. Carving out the reverse taper can occur in any of the years. Once again, an excellent tree in 5 years.

 

[Paradox]

They would have to be addressed, along with all the scars that were unfortunately left. Better foresight by the grower could have led to those being mostly closed before digging, or at least to the back.

Yeah, I kind of figured, but thought I would ask anyway.

Thank you again to everyone that added to the discussion.

I actually really like Brians first vert better than the second one overall considering the problem with the bumps and the scars.

Now that Ive kind of gotten over the realities of this tree.... I will spend some time over the next few days to sit the tree on a table and look at it in more detail up close, but...

Yes I like naturalistic trees, but it just doesnt seem like this one will be best going that way. Then maybe I can find a better trunk with fewer or no scars to make more into a formal upright, naturalistic tree. I had one, but it unfortunately never came out of dormancy, never formed buds and leafed out so I threw it out late last August because it was pretty much dead.

I think right now I am going to repot it into a big anderson flat next spring for starters. Then I am leaning on possibly starting with Smokes suggestion to let the lower branches run for a while to see how much we can thicken that trunk. Then I might go with something like Brians first vert. I kind of like where his predicted progression went.

So what do people think of that as a plan?

 

[JudyB]

Sounds like a good safe plan for you. I myself am a big proponent of working with the best aspects that the tree presents to you instead of trying to change a dog into a cat.

For me- working in this way, I've been able to make my collection pretty varied, and I've become more proficient at different things. And I have learned to appreciate other styles and aesthetics than I naturally lean toward.

 

[wireme]

I'm thinking that if you're going with Brians first virt then no need to run the bottom branches first? If going for the second virt then grow them like smoke says.Thats what I'd try I think. If going for a big chop I was wondering about a line from the bottom right branch to the second left on Brian's virtvirt (the pic with chop lines drawn)?
Sorry, not trying to give advice over the folks who have actually grown these things out just enjoying thinking of development plans with your tree!

 

[Paradox]

I'm thinking that if you're going with Brians first virt then no need to run the bottom branches first? If going for the second virt then grow them like smoke says.Thats what I'd try I think. If going for a big chop I was wondering about a line from the bottom right branch to the second left on Brian's virtvirt (the pic with chop lines drawn)?
Sorry, not trying to give advice over the folks who have actually grown these things out just enjoying thinking of development plans with your tree!

No worries it is a good question. Thanks for asking.

 

[coh]

I think Brian's first virt will (potentially) give the nicest outcome. But it will be a long term process. Please document as you go and let us know how long it takes in your climate.

Agree with the comment that you don't want to let those lower branches run if you're going that approach, just make the chop and go from there (or layer off the top, that's probably what I would do...you lose a year that way but gain a potentially nice specimen).

The second virt I view more as the "putting a skirt on it" approach...in which you use branching and foliage to hide the trunk deficiencies. But they will be visible during the winter, at least until you get scars covered or carved, reduce any inverse taper, etc. Still, nothing wrong with that.

Should be a fun process regardless.

Chris

 

[Adair M]

Paradox,

There's a second lesson to be learned from your experience with this tree:

The best time to purchase deciduous materiel is during the winter when you can really see what's there!

 

[Paradox]

Paradox,

There's a second lesson to be learned from your experience with this tree:

The best time to purchase deciduous materiel is during the winter when you can really see what's there!

The only problem with that is when you have a dormant tree end up being a dead tree.
I have had that happen so I am a bit gun shy about buying dormant trees now.

 

[Paradox]

Update:

Took this guy to my first bonsai class last week at NEBG. Result: it is keeping its trunk. Neither John nor anyone else thought it warrented a chop. We decided on a front. It got trimmed and a new growout pot. We cut back the long root to promote some root ramification.

More than one person commented on the tree. I had it on a cart taking it back out to my truck and someone driving in stopped and rolled down the window to say what a nice tree it is.

 

[coh]

Update:

Took this guy to my first bonsai class last week at NEBG. Result: it is keeping its trunk. Neither John nor anyone else thought it warrented a chop. We decided on a front. It got trimmed and a new growout pot. We cut back the long root to promote some root ramification.

More than one person commented on the tree. I had it on a cart taking it back out to my truck and someone driving in stopped and rolled down the window to say what a nice tree it is.

Good! You'll have a nice tree in a shorter time period without the chopping and re-growing process. Please keep us posted as it develops.

Photos sometimes give a somewhat misleading impression of a tree, there's nothing like seeing it in person.

Chris