Any recommendations for a 'good' moisture meter?
- Thread starter ajoe
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Cadillactaste
Neagari Gal
The only one I would recommend is found in this link. 
www.bonsainut.com
Watering Bonsai Trees
Watering Along with proper siting, proper watering is among the most critical tasks to master to become successful in the art of bonsai. Water too frequently, or too infrequently, and the tree's health declines. Usually, the symptoms of...
Lutonian
Chumono
I use these it's free and effective
Cadillactaste
Neagari Gal
LuZiKui
Shohin
LOL yeah, good thing I wasn't drinking my coffee when I scrolled down to that eyeballThe eyeball... oh my word!!! I'm dying over here.
Wires_Guy_wires
Imperial Masterpiece
A wooden chopstick seems to be the best. It lasts about 2 years and it works as a bird deterrent as well.
Cadillactaste
Neagari Gal
That would have been bad.LOL yeah, good thing I wasn't drinking my coffee when I scrolled down to that eyeball
Now...you make me want coffee.
Paradox
Imperial Masterpiece
Yup fingers, eyeballs and brain is the only moisture meter you need
very effective, free and don't need batteries
very effective, free and don't need batteries
Eckhoffw
Masterpiece
I’m going to reiterate that the finger is your best tool.
I didn’t wanna believe it at first, because I knew that my soil was moist below the level where my finger would touch.
So I continued to buy moisture meters.
Once my trees got into free draining soil, I realized that I could be confident in watering when the top 2 “ or so felt dry.
On that note, I still find the moisture meters useful in trees still in nursery cans.
I buy the cheap 10$ ones
Paradox
Imperial Masterpiece
I prefer the good ole chopstick stuck in the pot if Im not sure
rockm
Spuds Moyogi
I've said this every time electronic moisture meters come up--they don't work correctly when used with bonsai soil, no matter what the cost. They measure electrical activity between soil particles--which is fine IF you're working with fine particled soil like potting soil where particles are packed together. Bonsai soil, by design, has HUGE voids between soil particles comparatively. That means moisture meters will mostly always say the soil is dry, since the meter can't compensate for the distance between soil particles. It senses "dry" because the electrical activity is less between the larger particles. Relying on that alone leads to overwatering and bonsai root death.
Best measuring devices are as said--your eyes, your finger and your muscles. Proper watering for bonsai is learned by understanding the 'look' of dry or dryish soil. Bonsai soil changes color when it dries, it also becomes lighter in weight as if gives up water. Eyes and fingers are valuable to observe those changes. Muscles in your arm can lift a pot to see if it is lighter than it was when you last watered it--if you want to get a baseline for what a well-watered bonsai pot feels like, water it well until water runs out the drain holes. Lift the pot either on one side or completely--that's is how heavy it is when it doesn't need to be watered. During the day (especially in spring as the tree begins to use a lot of water) do the same. Do it a lot and you will notice the weight difference. When it gets lighter, observe the color of the top of the soil, push your finger down an inch. See if it's still moist that far down, if so, let it be. If it's dry that far down, water.
All this takes experience. There are no effective shortcuts and trying to get around that leads to problems.
Best measuring devices are as said--your eyes, your finger and your muscles. Proper watering for bonsai is learned by understanding the 'look' of dry or dryish soil. Bonsai soil changes color when it dries, it also becomes lighter in weight as if gives up water. Eyes and fingers are valuable to observe those changes. Muscles in your arm can lift a pot to see if it is lighter than it was when you last watered it--if you want to get a baseline for what a well-watered bonsai pot feels like, water it well until water runs out the drain holes. Lift the pot either on one side or completely--that's is how heavy it is when it doesn't need to be watered. During the day (especially in spring as the tree begins to use a lot of water) do the same. Do it a lot and you will notice the weight difference. When it gets lighter, observe the color of the top of the soil, push your finger down an inch. See if it's still moist that far down, if so, let it be. If it's dry that far down, water.
All this takes experience. There are no effective shortcuts and trying to get around that leads to problems.
You all laugh and carry on here, and that's ok, but a lot of us struggle with this ALL THE TIME. I would think, with all our technology, that someone would have invented something that would measure moisture levels in pots using granular soils. I've wondered if those devices that measure moisture levels in hay before baling it would work.
Now would someone please explain how your answers above work. Let's assume no akadama, peat moss, potting soil or anything that makes testing easy. Let's say we have a pumice and lava mix.
How does a chop stick work to measure moisture levels? Does one just stick a chop stick in and leave it in the pot or stick it in every time you want to measure. I've done the stick in and leave it and the chop stick turns brown/black over time but how does it tell me if there is moisture in the pot? I would also assume that if the stick was totally dry, then the soil would be dry and the tree dead or heading that way. Sorry, but I have never understood how this is supposed to work.
How does a finger work to measure moisture? Can I assume that if I stick my finger in the pot about an inch of so and it feels cool, then there is enough moisture?
How do your eyes work to measure moisture? Yes, if the leaves are wilting on deciduous or something, but how would you tell if a conifer in this soil mix needs water by using your eyes to measure?
I am not being a smart ass and I'm not stupid. I am serious and would like an explanation how you all make these answers to the moisture problem work. Thank you.
Now would someone please explain how your answers above work. Let's assume no akadama, peat moss, potting soil or anything that makes testing easy. Let's say we have a pumice and lava mix.
How does a chop stick work to measure moisture levels? Does one just stick a chop stick in and leave it in the pot or stick it in every time you want to measure. I've done the stick in and leave it and the chop stick turns brown/black over time but how does it tell me if there is moisture in the pot? I would also assume that if the stick was totally dry, then the soil would be dry and the tree dead or heading that way. Sorry, but I have never understood how this is supposed to work.
How does a finger work to measure moisture? Can I assume that if I stick my finger in the pot about an inch of so and it feels cool, then there is enough moisture?
How do your eyes work to measure moisture? Yes, if the leaves are wilting on deciduous or something, but how would you tell if a conifer in this soil mix needs water by using your eyes to measure?
I am not being a smart ass and I'm not stupid. I am serious and would like an explanation how you all make these answers to the moisture problem work. Thank you.
rockm
Spuds Moyogi
THere is nothing easy about it. It's the hardest part of doing bonsai. Ask any expert. All trees and all soils will use moisture in unique ways. Pots and containers also have a huge impact. There are endless combinations.
Trying to find some machine to take the guess work out makes you less knowledgeable and dependent on a machine that can't compensate for everyday individual requirements of your bonsai.
All of your suggestions are intuitive and work. Stop making things so complicated...--yes, if the end of the chopstick isn't wettish, it needs water. This is pretty simple to suss out...BTW staining by brown/black by the soil doesn't make a difference. I urge you to learn the weight test and in turn, the soil surface color test. They're straightforward and reliable.
Most of us who have done this for a while have gone through the same things as you, including the frustration.
There is no "moisture problem" there is a learning curve. It takes a few years to water correctly and accurately. Trying to get around that with short cuts is more frustrating than just bearing down and learning how to do it.
Rockm...I appreciate you answer and the help. You make this sound very simple and easy. You said this..."Stop making things so complicated...--yes, if the end of the chopstick isn't wettish, it needs water." Again I know not if the chop stick is left in all the time, how deep it is in the pot, or how I detect moisture on the stick. It will obviously not be dripping wet so do I just feel it and am looking for what. Also, I asked a question about the finger testing method that was not answered. Come on now. Help the old folks out here pls.
rockm
Spuds Moyogi
It is simple if you stop overthinking it and requiring absolutes. There are no absolutes in watering except when a plant is wilting from lack of water. All other times it's mostly subjective on timing, which depends on your judgement.
Bottom line fact--Water is needed where the root are consistently. So that's where the stick has to go --about an inch or two into the soil. Wood takes time to absorb water and to dry out (Same as soil particles). That means it has to be in the same environment as the roots--all the time--the same as an oilpan dipstick remains in the engine. You pull the stick out tolook at it. Moisture present on the stick, darker hues on the wood indicate moisture. If it's dripping you're watering too much.
FWIW, the "lift the pot" by weight method is superior to the chopstick, but for some reason people relate more to the chopstick. It's a security blanket...
BTW, The CONCEPT of watering isn't complicated., but it is not easy to LEARN to water.
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rockm
Spuds Moyogi
Also if you go to the link Cadillac provided in the post higher up, it provides photos of dry-wet chopstick images...
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Eckhoffw
Masterpiece
I know your spot on about this. I think, like anything though, practice and repetition is the only way to become sensitive to the variants.
Without this, the confidence and experience needed isn’t there. It just seems... complicated
Good reminder. I blew right on past that. Will study after I get chopo sticks
August
Chumono
The weight test is hard to manage. I come from the garden center world where the wait test is our bread and butter. I find bonsai soil and pots (and trees) tend to always feel heavy to me. Certainly heavier when wet but usually the weight test works by surprise; if I find myself surprised by the weight, over or under, when I pick it up, that helps me decide when to water. Bonsai never "surprise" me... they always feel heavier than they look.
With my smaller pots I often find myself lifting them up above my head and taking a look at the drainage holes and the soil through the mesh. If it's wet and I can see the cohesion or a lot of dew, thats a sign it's good. If it looks damp but theres no standing water, Ill water if I know the species is thirsty (most tropicals, deciduous from cooler, wetter parts of the world, etc.). For succulents and dryland species I water when it looks dry. Still who wants to lift their whole collection over their head on watering day?
Im new to the chopstick method but finding it helps. Sometimes if I cant tell if its wet or dry, ill stick the chopstick in another spot for a couple hours and come back. The "wood" of the chopstick holds more moisture than the soil I think. I use bamboo skewers as opposed to chopsticks so im not cramming a rod in the soil all the time. Hope this helps.
With my smaller pots I often find myself lifting them up above my head and taking a look at the drainage holes and the soil through the mesh. If it's wet and I can see the cohesion or a lot of dew, thats a sign it's good. If it looks damp but theres no standing water, Ill water if I know the species is thirsty (most tropicals, deciduous from cooler, wetter parts of the world, etc.). For succulents and dryland species I water when it looks dry. Still who wants to lift their whole collection over their head on watering day?
Im new to the chopstick method but finding it helps. Sometimes if I cant tell if its wet or dry, ill stick the chopstick in another spot for a couple hours and come back. The "wood" of the chopstick holds more moisture than the soil I think. I use bamboo skewers as opposed to chopsticks so im not cramming a rod in the soil all the time. Hope this helps.
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