Other than bonsai

[Canonfodder]

I am just starting out in the bonsai world and have been thinking of new ways to display the trees I am able to keep alive. I have been looking at many sites and videos, yet I feel a little restricted in some ways. Today I thought of a unique idea, but as I am to understand it, if I decide to try it, is not considered bonsai. My question is, is there another art form like bonsai but allows a different type of artistic expression?

 

[leatherback]

Ikebana?

In the end.. If it is display for yourself, how cares whether it is considered bonsai?

 

[HorseloverFat]

I’m with Jelle, who cares what label is on it...

My plants are for me...

If you NEED it.,

Penzai Wanzu... “Potted plaything”

No rules.. no real specifics.

But Penchi.. is, i believe, just potted plant... beyond that.. it’s JUST expression.

Just a couple neat Ideas “burrowed” in the construction of traditional Japanese Bonsai..,

Even THAT... can be too much...

I like thinking that I do “TinyTrees”.. in North America.

Some would ask, “Like Bonsai?”

And I’d reply, “Yeah, kind of.”

 

[leatherback]

And I’d reply, “Yeah, kind of.”

EXCEPT when you are begging to dig a tree from someones yard, I am sure!

 

[Brian Van Fleet]

Do the thing, and don’t worry about a name.

 

[ShadyStump]

Bonsai really just means a potted tree. In that respect, potted topiary is just the european form of the same thing. Any plant in a pot is still the application of the same concepts, and you'll find that many of us here grow all sorts of things in all sorts of ways. There may not be a generally accepted terminology for a give thing, but it's still appreciated.
Bronchi is specifically bonsai concepts applied to peppers. Even outside of pots, there's the concept of niwaki: stylized garden trees.

Though, here on the forum, it's polite to restrict posting things not very specifically bonsai to the Tea House or other appropriate sub-forum. I started a thread there for people to share their annual gardening, for example. People also share their landscape projects in different threads.

 

[leatherback]

Bonsai really just means a potted tree

sorry, but is a translation of words, not of meaning.
Just like yamadori is not any woody plant dug in the mountains

 

[ShadyStump]

sorry, but is a translation of words, not of meaning.
Just like yamadori is not any woody plant dug in the mountains

That's the point I was trying to make. We don't have to add more meaning to the idea of bonsai than we want to.
See my signature: bonsai = tree in pot; don't over complicate it.
Lol

 

[leatherback]

That's the point I was trying to make. We don't have to add more meaning to the idea of bonsai than we want to.
See my signature: bonsai = tree in pot; don't over complicate it.
Lol

guess I disagree with the point you are trying to make then

 

[ShadyStump]

guess I disagree with the point you are trying to make then

Fair.

 

[sorce]

allows a different type of artistic expression?

You know who else didn't listen to the "rules"?



Sorce

 

[LittleDingus]

Ikebana?

In the end.. If it is display for yourself, how cares whether it is considered bonsai?

I disagree...well, sorta.

While I agree with the "if it is display for yourself, who cares" bit...few of my trees are "bonsai", for example...I disagree that not knowing other terms and styles is not helpful.

When you search "bonsai" a set of results shows up. Search "penjing", and a different set of results shows up. At the base level, they are both "trees in pots". Artistically, there is much difference...

While google can find anything, it still needs to be told what to search for

 

[Mikecheck123]

That's the point I was trying to make. We don't have to add more meaning to the idea of bonsai than we want to.
See my signature: bonsai = tree in pot; don't over complicate it.
Lol

Just like Kristallnacht means crystal night, nothing more nothing less. Don't over complicate it!

 

[LittleDingus]

I am just starting out in the bonsai world and have been thinking of new ways to display the trees I am able to keep alive. I have been looking at many sites and videos, yet I feel a little restricted in some ways. Today I thought of a unique idea, but as I am to understand it, if I decide to try it, is not considered bonsai. My question is, is there another art form like bonsai but allows a different type of artistic expression?

I don't know the forms and their breakdowns myself...I grow what I want and style it as I like...if I bother to style at all But most of my "how to grow" type searches eventually dump me here. Bonsai people have accumulated a ton of "how to grow trees" knowledge that is valuable even if you don't do "bonsai". As much as it aggravates some in this community to talk non-bonsai...growing from seed, buying saplings, etc...that will take 20 years to begin to be "bonsai" in the true sense of the word...it is what it is. This community knows a lot and most of them are willing to put up with us "less than bonsai" folk as long as we don't get too out of hand

But some "styles" you might look up:

bonsai
saikei
penjing
hon non bo

If you want to get more "fanciful"

topiary

I'm sure there are lots of other search terms but I'm not well versed

Maybe if you mentioned what you were thinking to do someone would know what "style" it might fall under and provide a hint on how to research more??

 

[ShadyStump]

Just like Kristallnacht means crystal night, nothing more nothing less. Don't over complicate it!

But is bonsai a singular historical event?
No, it's millennia of varying and broad ranging horticultural and artistic development. You can make something that might not resemble what people call bonsai today, but maybe it does resemble something from hundreds of years ago that called bonsai. Is it not bonsai just because tastes have changed?

I guess, to me, it's this: people talk like it doesn't count as bonsai until it's in final refinement or display ready. I disagree. A sculpture is a sculpture as soon as the artist starts working, it's just not finished. A sculpture is a sculpture even if critics think it's awful, it's just an awful sculpture.
Bonsai is the same way to me.

 

[PA_Penjing]

shame we can't just all agree on an American word for it and set ourselves free. it would be something like "tree miniatures" or "scaled trees". Seems like historically it's been two words if we want to honor tradition. Alas.. bonsai it is, or you can be a pain in the ass and call it penjing

 

[Mikecheck123]

But is bonsai a singular historical event?
No, it's millennia of varying and broad ranging horticultural and artistic development. You can make something that might not resemble what people call bonsai today, but maybe it does resemble something from hundreds of years ago that called bonsai. Is it not bonsai just because tastes have changed?

I guess, to me, it's this: people talk like it doesn't count as bonsai until it's in final refinement or display ready. I disagree. A sculpture is a sculpture as soon as the artist starts working, it's just not finished. A sculpture is a sculpture even if critics think it's awful, it's just an awful sculpture.
Bonsai is the same way to me.

Hey anyone can call anything whatever they want, but just don't pretend like you have some kind of authoritative opinion when you do that.

If you say that it's correct to take a literal translation from a foreign language, throw away all historical context as well as how those terms as actually used in that foreign language, you're simply a crappy translator regardless of what word we're talking about.

 

[penumbra]

I guess all responders are way ahead of me because I see no clue as to what the original post was about. The word unique stands out but that really doesn't tell me anything.

 

[leatherback]

I disagree...well, sorta.

I do not diagree with what you are writing. It was more a reference to the "bonsai is too limiting". One does not have to grow bonsai if you want to create penjing!

 

[HorseloverFat]

I do not diagree with what you are writing. It was more a reference to the "bonsai is too limiting". One does not have to grow bonsai if you want to create penjing!

Hehe! I read a VERY “boiled down” article (Actually two) , regarding this, from “Bonsai Mary” RIGHT after starting my “TinyTree Journey”