I plan on planting my Trident maple in the ground or in a grow box. As far as the soil medium goes, is regular potting soil used or is the best to put the tree in a mix of akadama – bonsai soil. I’ve seen both methods done and I’m not sure which one is better for faster Growth. I do know the bonsai soil will create fibrous roots. I’ve also seen Akadama added to regular soil
Trident in ground for growth
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SeanS
Omono
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In the ground I like to use ground soil. My raised beds are filled with compost and large grit sand (building sand), so they’re quite free draining. Akadama is reserved for pots.
leatherback
The Treedeemer
One of the key roles of akadama as I see it is to reduce top growth. So -besides that I never use it- I would not use it to encourage growing out a tree.
Deep Sea Diver
Masterpiece
We plant tridents and Japanese Maples in our landscape beds which are amended with compost, soil is acidic due to all the conifers around and well worked with good drainage. Somewhat similar to @SeanS
Given appropriate pruning practices.
Just to be clear, absolutely not saying another media will not do as well, just reporting what I’ve experienced over time.
cheers
DSD sends
We use akadama as appropriate on trees in middle to advanced secondary developmental stage and beyond. Based upon personal observation of many museum and our own tree roots and branches…..akadama ramifies the roots, which in turn becomes reflected in the branching.
Given appropriate pruning practices.
Just to be clear, absolutely not saying another media will not do as well, just reporting what I’ve experienced over time.
cheers
DSD sends
Kalebh
Sapling
I'm actually trying to decide if I should plant my trident in the ground or in a large container to achieve the best growth. It's already partially developed as far as tapper, so I'm not sure. Very interest to see what everyone says. Good Luck
eugenev2
Shohin
Ground growing vs large grow box/container is used for slightly different reasons, people who use large containers either do not have the option to grow in the ground or they want to control the growth more. Ground growing on species like tridents provides explosive growth, which is extremely beneficial for trunk growth, but could also negatively impact branching/taper that you have already started.
For an example my trident maple was in a grow box for about a season which grew a leader just slightly thicker than a pencil and about 5 feet tall, the leader was struggling to stay straight up due to it's lanky proportions, so when i planted it in the ground to grow wild for a few years, a season later a new branch had taken over as the leader and is now twice as thick and taller than the previous.
Shibui
Imperial Masterpiece
We can change the soil at transplant to something that suits small pots better so it doesn't matter what soil is used during grow out.
When planting in the ground the local soil is probably best but soil varies so much from place to place. Some soils are already great for growing trees. Some soils need some additives to help with better growth. A very few soils are so bad it's not worth planting in. You really need to get to know what sort of soils you have before deciding what needs to be added.
Beware of just adding stuff to any soil. Replacing clay soil with an open bonsai mix could backfire because that may just produce ponds where all the water collects and can possibly drown the trees planted there. Definitely need to understand soil structure to get the best results.
Grow pots are larger than bonsai pots. The larger the pot the less special the soil mix needs to be as gravity and evaporation will help with drainage. In large grow pots there's no need for akadama or special bonsai soil. Those are used because they work better with smaller pots. Use a regular potting soil for grow pots if you wish but you will need additional fertilizer for good results as most commercial soil mixes only have minimum fertilizer added to reduce cost. There's usually a range of quality in commercial potting soils. Avoid the cheapest as they usually save by using inferior components. Try mid range or high end potting soil if you can afford it.
When planting in the ground the local soil is probably best but soil varies so much from place to place. Some soils are already great for growing trees. Some soils need some additives to help with better growth. A very few soils are so bad it's not worth planting in. You really need to get to know what sort of soils you have before deciding what needs to be added.
Beware of just adding stuff to any soil. Replacing clay soil with an open bonsai mix could backfire because that may just produce ponds where all the water collects and can possibly drown the trees planted there. Definitely need to understand soil structure to get the best results.
Grow pots are larger than bonsai pots. The larger the pot the less special the soil mix needs to be as gravity and evaporation will help with drainage. In large grow pots there's no need for akadama or special bonsai soil. Those are used because they work better with smaller pots. Use a regular potting soil for grow pots if you wish but you will need additional fertilizer for good results as most commercial soil mixes only have minimum fertilizer added to reduce cost. There's usually a range of quality in commercial potting soils. Avoid the cheapest as they usually save by using inferior components. Try mid range or high end potting soil if you can afford it.
sorce
Nonsense Rascal
I just come here to see if @Shibui came to answer and to like the post cuz there's the experience.
I reckon a basket, a proper root pruning basket can be used before cuz the tree won't abandon those fine roots iffin you keep em wet.
But after will work too.
Either way, I'm all about a basket stage or it's an unnecessarily uphill battle.
Sorce
I reckon a basket, a proper root pruning basket can be used before cuz the tree won't abandon those fine roots iffin you keep em wet.
But after will work too.
Either way, I'm all about a basket stage or it's an unnecessarily uphill battle.
Sorce
Maiden69
Masterpiece
I'm one of the very few that use rootpouch to grow out trees here, and from the growth I get I don't see the need to grow in the ground. I also allows me to grow the root ball in a bonsai soil mix (no akadama, that is for refinement). I think you could get the same growth in a basket, BUT, and it is something that most people ignore, you have to water and fertilize more often to get the full benefits. If you follow the same regime that you would use for trees in a pot or in the ground you will get the same growth as a tree in a pot.
Here are a few pics of my trident.
September 2020
March 2020 after 1 year in a bag
August 2022
August 2023 not the best angle...
January 2024
Here are a few pics of my trident.
September 2020
March 2020 after 1 year in a bag
August 2022
August 2023 not the best angle...
January 2024
Nice looking trident! Am I looking at a pot with a pot? I’m not sure what a root pouch is, but the growth looks excellent
Rodrigo
Shohin
I agree that akadama is for refinement, so what are you using as substrate? It's hard to tell from the pics but it looks rather organic?
That's great growth in just a few years!
Maiden69
Masterpiece
Yes, it is called a pot-in-pot, but the inside pot is a Rootpouch (brand name), you can get it at Greenhousemegastore. They also have it at Lowes, and sometimes depending on the size and quantity it will be cheaper there. The two below are the ones I use, mostly the grey ones. It prunes the root tips when they get entrapped in the fabric, so not air-pruning as 90% of the bags in the market. You can use them in-ground, and while there will be some escape roots, they will be minimum and usually only at the bottom seam.
Root Pouch Grey Fabric Pot
Improve root development and moisture absorption for your developing plants by adding them to semi-degradable root pouches for above-ground or in-ground use.
www.greenhousemegastore.com
Root Pouch Brown Fabric Pot
The Boxer Brown Fabric Pots are the most durable Root Pouch products yet. With strong, breathable fabric made from recycled water bottles and featuring an industrial lockstitch technique with finished seams, the synthetic blend of PET materials in the Boxer Brown pouches will stay tough season...
www.greenhousemegastore.com
Full inorganic substrate. Mostly Bonsai Block and Monto Clay for deciduous and for conifers I add pumice. Lately I have been doing a 1:1:1 for deciduous as well when they are in the ground.
Best part about the above substrates is that they will not breakdown, so upon repotting I usually pressure wash it and put it back to use. In the event of any infection on the tree, I treat the substrate after pressure washing with a heavy dose of H2O2 and chemicals if needed, then wash again before reusing.
The reason it looks "organic" is because I add a thin layer of sphagnum moss on the top to prevent the soil from drying too fast, I'm in the Texas Hill Country, so that means high winds almost everyday and very high temps during summer. The white stuff is just perlite, I needed something cheap to pot the trees when I removed them from the ground when I moved 2 months ago.
You have a very organized growing method to add size to your trees. Thank you for your feedbackYes, it is called a pot-in-pot, but the inside pot is a Rootpouch (brand name), you can get it at Greenhousemegastore. They also have it at Lowes, and sometimes depending on the size and quantity it will be cheaper there. The two below are the ones I use, mostly the grey ones. It prunes the root tips when they get entrapped in the fabric, so not air-pruning as 90% of the bags in the market. You can use them in-ground, and while there will be some escape roots, they will be minimum and usually only at the bottom seam.
Root Pouch Grey Fabric Pot
Improve root development and moisture absorption for your developing plants by adding them to semi-degradable root pouches for above-ground or in-ground use.Root Pouch Brown Fabric Pot
The Boxer Brown Fabric Pots are the most durable Root Pouch products yet. With strong, breathable fabric made from recycled water bottles and featuring an industrial lockstitch technique with finished seams, the synthetic blend of PET materials in the Boxer Brown pouches will stay tough season...
Full inorganic substrate. Mostly Bonsai Block and Monto Clay for deciduous and for conifers I add pumice. Lately I have been doing a 1:1:1 for deciduous as well when they are in the ground.
Best part about the above substrates is that they will not breakdown, so upon repotting I usually pressure wash it and put it back to use. In the event of any infection on the tree, I treat the substrate after pressure washing with a heavy dose of H2O2 and chemicals if needed, then wash again before reusing.
The reason it looks "organic" is because I add a thin layer of sphagnum moss on the top to prevent the soil from drying too fast, I'm in the Texas Hill Country, so that means high winds almost everyday and very high temps during summer. The white stuff is just perlite, I needed something cheap to pot the trees when I removed them from the ground when I moved 2 months ago.
zeejet
Yamadori
I'm having a similar dilemma as a beginner with small stock. Would it possible to grow directly in a larger root pouch instead of a pond basket or Anderson flat? Or maybe an Anderson flat on top of a large root pouch? My understanding is that large root pouches do not pose the same issues as large containers as the water drains and evaporates through the fabric, which is more similar to growing in the ground.
Last edited:
zeejet
Yamadori
Sorry for the double post (couldn't edit past 20 minutes).
Correct if I'm wrong, but the theory behind your method of root pouch w/ inorganic soil inside a slightly larger nursery container with organic soil is that the inorganics offer drainage/aeration while the organics on the outside offer moisture retention - the root pouch then additionally prunes/keeps the roots from reaching the wet organics and rotting. Have you compared this method to growing in ground or by regularly up-potting? It does seem like you grew a 1/2" twig into a 7" monster in 4 years (albeit with a vigorous Trident).
Correct if I'm wrong, but the theory behind your method of root pouch w/ inorganic soil inside a slightly larger nursery container with organic soil is that the inorganics offer drainage/aeration while the organics on the outside offer moisture retention - the root pouch then additionally prunes/keeps the roots from reaching the wet organics and rotting. Have you compared this method to growing in ground or by regularly up-potting? It does seem like you grew a 1/2" twig into a 7" monster in 4 years (albeit with a vigorous Trident).
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