I.D. this problem!

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Help..

A # of my tridents and JM have been succumbing to brown tips and a little leaf curl. It's not hot yet so I know it's not burn. These are just leafing out and already some bad actors...

ALSO ..

A few shimpaku are doing the needles turn brown routine.. I've been removing the offenders but it seems to continue.. also think this may be fungal? ... but here for your advice.

THANKS! IMG_20190310_182706_1.jpgIMG_20190310_182619.jpg
 

DaveV

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I had the same problem with a trident maple many years ago. I believe its a fungal problem. Try a foliar antifungal. Maybe a drench too. Hopefully more people with tridents chime in here.
 

DaveV

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I will be using Clearys 3336 dg lite granular fungicide this year as a drench. Clearys also makes a liquid that can be used as a foliar spray too.
 

Vance Wood

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Tridents are substantially less tolerant of cold weather, especially in the early Spring, that could be your problem.
 
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If the above picture represents the entire Trident maple tree, then what I would do is defoliate, spray with fungicide and follow the manufacturers recommendations for spraying. I believe most fungicides are to be used every 10 days or so.
I spray all my maples with Daconil as soon as they start budding to prevent and will also spray if I know we're going to have a cool night. Cool nights (in spring and early summer) means dew in the morning and I know for a fact that this can cause a fungicide outbreak here in NJ.
 

rockm

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was this tree exposed outside to the cold snap we had on the east coast last week?
 

Vance Wood

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was this tree exposed outside to the cold snap we had on the east coast last week?
It is often surprising to me how people want to embrace the most complicated and expensive solution without a passing howdy doodie to simpler options without administrating dangerous sprays.
 

VAFisher

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I accidentally let my tridents experience freezing weather last year after they started leafing out and the leaves didn't look like that afterwards. They turned a light greyish color in areas all over the leaf, but stayed on the tree and didn't curl or anything. The outermost leaves were affected with some on the interior being fine. I would not guess cold damage on the trident but I only have that one experience to compare to.
 

markyscott

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THANKS! Do you know if anthracnose is easily transferable from plant-to-plant or is this more of a weak plants become susceptible type thing?

Yes it can be transmitted. This doesn’t look like cold damage to me, but I’ve been surprised before. Anthracnose, however, is very common on tridents in any place with humidity and a cool, wet spring (like your climate and mine). What you’ve shown looks to me just like what I’ve seen many times here in Houston and what the folks at the Texas A&M ag extension diagnosed as anthracnose. I encourage people here to take steps to prevent it rather than focusing on curing it by constantly spraying fungicides. All the steps I know for prevention and treatment are in the article I linked. Here, even with the best preventative measures, I can sometimes see traces of it on the very early growth in spring. But the trees can sometimes “grow past it”, so I’d caution you to NOT prune the growing tip. Fertilize and let it grow and extend - let it get strong and healthy. For treating symptomatic trees, in my experience, a simple Bordeaux mix is the most effective and you can make that yourself at home for very low cost. The instructions are in the resource I posted. However, you’ve missed the window for dormant treatment which is, by far, the best way to avoid this problem to begin with. So make sure you dilute it (as in the instructions) before spraying (and mix well to avoid everything looking blue after you spray).

Scott
 

rockm

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I accidentally let my tridents experience freezing weather last year after they started leafing out and the leaves didn't look like that afterwards. They turned a light greyish color in areas all over the leaf, but stayed on the tree and didn't curl or anything. The outermost leaves were affected with some on the interior being fine. I would not guess cold damage on the trident but I only have that one experience to compare to.
It's not out of the question. The black edges can result from frost damage. The limp leaves are typical for trident just starting growth. Being in S.C., the owner may not have all that much experience with frost protection. Don't know if that's the case though.

The east has a deep cold snap not long ago. My trees here in Va. hadn't pushed new growth, but those down that way had been growing for a couple of weeks.

I would, however, consider the possibility of frost damage.
 

Nanuk

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Looks like anthracnose on the trident and wiring damage on the juniper. Here’s a link to an article I wrote about it.

https://www.facebook.com/notes/hous...ose-on-the-texas-gulf-coast/1384161804947772/


Excellent article @markyscott.
The one thing that stuck out to me was your advice to NEVER water the leaves.
The reason that I say that is because I see so many people advising the opposite. Mainly in youtube videos.
Is your advice based on the conditions in Houston or does this advice apply no matter where someone lives?
Thanks
 

markyscott

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Excellent article @markyscott.
The one thing that stuck out to me was your advice to NEVER water the leaves.
The reason that I say that is because I see so many people advising the opposite. Mainly in youtube videos.
Is your advice based on the conditions in Houston or does this advice apply no matter where someone lives?
Thanks

Thank you. Recognizing I’ve not grown trees everywhere (California Central Valley, Seattle, Houston), I’d advise not to regularly overhead water as part of your care. Every once in a while is fine, but be particularly careful of trees like Tridents that are supsceptible to fungal diseases. If you must overhead water, I’d suggest doing it in the morning so the foliage has a chance to dry out during the day. I try and avoid wetting the foliage at all when I water because, at 100% humidity, it can take a long time to dry out even during the day.

- S
 

markyscott

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Excellent article @markyscott.
The one thing that stuck out to me was your advice to NEVER water the leaves.
The reason that I say that is because I see so many people advising the opposite. Mainly in youtube videos.
Is your advice based on the conditions in Houston or does this advice apply no matter where someone lives?
Thanks

BTW - I synthesized information from a lot of sources for that article, but a particularly important one was Al’s excellent thread on the topic (linked in the article).
 

Vance Wood

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And yet;---God has still not figured it out. He regularly waters everything from above regardless what the book and articles from Al, or whomever have to say about the subject.
 

markyscott

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And yet;---God has still not figured it out. He regularly waters everything from above regardless what the book and articles from Al, or whomever have to say about the subject.

True Vance. But He does not overhead water every single day and He does not overhead water every night before dark so the leaves sit wet all night. There is no problem doing it the way God does it - overhead water every once in a while and make sure the roots stay moist and the foliage dry in between. But do it all the time and you’re asking for trouble. Not according to me or Al, but from pretty much every resource from every Ag extension out there. But soak ‘em down if you like. They’re your trees. Just please don’t recommend it to folks who may be having fungal issues already.

Irrigating your plants with a sprinkler or overhead irrigation system is much less water efficient than using drip lines and can also lead to plants getting wet leaves, which makes them more susceptible to fungal infections.”
https://www.greenwaybiotech.com/blo...s-in-your-plants-and-what-you-can-do-about-it


The environment can be managed in many ways to reduce disease. Humidity and leaf wetness are often conducive to disease, and these can be minimized by spacing, staking and pruning plants to promote airflow. We can remove weeds that impede airflow. We can change watering practices, avoiding overhead watering that increases leaf wetness, and watering in the morning rather than the evening so leaves have time to dry out before night.”.
https://www.extension.iastate.edu/news/2007/jan/071001.htm


“It’s better not to wet most plants as this can cause problems such as fungal diseases...”
https://www.growveg.com/guides/how-to-water-plants-correctly/


“Avoid overhead watering, which will wet the foliage and possibly splash soil-born fungi onto leaves.”
https://www.swansonsnursery.com/blog/controlling-powdery-mildew


“You may be able to stop your spraying program entirely by instituting good garden practices, like cleaning up debris and providing good air circulation around the trees, and avoiding overhead irrigation.”
https://depts.washington.edu/hortlib/resources/wp-resource_search.php?term=2053
 
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Wee

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Thank You for the article....I don't do facebook but it still opened long enough for me to save a copy before that annoying login screen came up.

Brian
 

Vance Wood

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Thank you. Recognizing I’ve not grown trees everywhere (California Central Valley, Seattle, Houston), I’d advise not to regularly overhead water as part of your care. Every once in a while is fine, but be particularly careful of trees like Tridents that are supsceptible to fungal diseases. If you must overhead water, I’d suggest doing it in the morning so the foliage has a chance to dry out during the day. I try and avoid wetting the foliage at all when I water because, at 100% humidity, it can take a long time to dry out even during the day.

- S
So let me see--- according to you I have been growing bonsai wrong for 63 years? I have been using a soil mix that is 30% composted Pine bark mulch and I water at leas twice a day (once the weather gets hot) from above making sure the foliage gets wet and I have pretty good luck. There is one thing about believing Old Wives tales there is another about making up new ones, and I have seen a lot of these new Old Wives Tales over the last several years. Most of what I learned in the beginning in the late 50's was learned by trial and error, failure and success. There was no INTERNET there was no Face Book, Youtube, blogs or decent publications; we depended on the reports for those who failied and those who did not. I have grown bonsai in one form or another in Utah, California, Iowa, and Michigan, forty of the last Sixty-three have been in Michigan where; if I had listened to many I would have never learned how to grow Mugo Pines. I am not advising anyone to grow anything anyway at all, but don't rule something out when it contradicts with what your experience tells you works.
 
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