My First Forest Setting. Acer Rubrum

[DeepSouth]

I really like the creek design and composition. You will have to stay diligent about preventing that moss from crossing the creek though!

I am not sure that acer rubrum would have been my first choice for the tree selection, but if you do a lot of pinching, you can keep the leaves on the smaller size. My shohin red maples average an inch to an inch and a half if I pinch often during the growing season.

 

[Jetson1950]

Very good first forest and an excellent discussion following! I am in the process of planning a Mexican plum forest and the whole thread is so helpful.

Thanks. Learn along with me.

 

[Wulfskaar]

Very good first forest and an excellent discussion following! I am in the process of planning a Mexican plum forest and the whole thread is so helpful.

Agreed. I'm watching this because I have something similar and will probably do more next year. I got a large batch of new seeds for Christmas, so I'll be making some forests so I don't have 200 individual pots sitting around.

 

[Shibui]

Once the trees leaf out, you won’t be able to see the far end of the creek without moving to another viewing point or see it under the tree lower canopy.

Great improvement IMHO.

I also let a couple of the smaller trees lean a bit so everything is not perfectly straight up. That was hard on my brain. My brain loves symmetry vs a lot of entropy. When it comes to looking at a forest or a beautiful orchard I would pick the orchard every time.

I suspect it is the same for most people. That's one reason why we have to try so hard to avoid even spacing and lines.

With two sides in the forest (each side of the creek) should I consider two peaks or Maybe have a sub triangle on the non dominate side just a bit lower than the dominate side?

Even without a creek/path most forest settings will benefit from '2 peaks' - a dominant tree and a second tree. With deciduous canopy I prefer rounded, billowing canopy rather than rigid triangles but that's a few years off yet.

One thing I am looking at now is which side do I want to be the front. The first picture is how I put it together as the front, but as I look at what was supposed to be to be the back I almost like it better as the front. Maybe come spring as it starts leafing out, it will be more obvious which will be better. I like the little short trees in front of the creek. I need to decide the front before I start working on shape. Suggestions on which you like better at this time for the front of the design? Most of the trees are on the left side in the first picture and right side in the second.

Larger, thicker trees in front help force perspective and makes the planting look way larger than it is. Known as 'close view'
Smaller trees in front is known as distant view but, IMHO, lacks depth because thickest trees in back does not compute with our knowledge of distance and perspective. However, you are welcome to design and grow bonsai that please you.
Smaller trees at each side already make the group look much wider than previous.
From original front, smaller rear trees give impression of greater depth, however stream is fighting that view. See below.

My stream seemed out of proportion so I narrowed it down and made a few turns in it. I really couldn’t give it a lot of depth look front to back in 7”

Narrower stream looks better but still appears relatively similar in width from front to back. I would double the width at the front and taper off to half current width at the rear. That should fool the brain into believing the stream is coming from way back and therefore make us see a much larger, deeper forest.

Forest now has 20 trees in it. I’m thinking at the end of next year I’ll need a bigger pot.

Should not be necessary for quite a few years. Roots are pruned as necessary to make space for new roots. Trunks will get thicker but the trees do not get further apart so the spread of the forest won't change significantly.

 

[Jetson1950]

Great improvement IMHO.

I suspect it is the same for most people. That's one reason why we have to try so hard to avoid even spacing and lines.


Even without a creek/path most forest settings will benefit from '2 peaks' - a dominant tree and a second tree. With deciduous canopy I prefer rounded, billowing canopy rather than rigid triangles but that's a few years off yet.


Larger, thicker trees in front help force perspective and makes the planting look way larger than it is. Known as 'close view'
Smaller trees in front is known as distant view but, IMHO, lacks depth because thickest trees in back does not compute with our knowledge of distance and perspective. However, you are welcome to design and grow bonsai that please you.
Smaller trees at each side already make the group look much wider than previous.
From original front, smaller rear trees give impression of greater depth, however stream is fighting that view. See below.


Narrower stream looks better but still appears relatively similar in width from front to back. I would double the width at the front and taper off to half current width at the rear. That should fool the brain into believing the stream is coming from way back and therefore make us see a much larger, deeper forest.


Should not be necessary for quite a few years. Roots are pruned as necessary to make space for new roots. Trunks will get thicker but the trees do not get further apart so the spread of the forest won't change significantly.

Thanks Shibui. I’ll try and work on the creek a little more. It’s fairly easy to cover up areas of it or put down more granite to make it wider. Anything else with the trees I’m going to hold off on. Once they start growing, I think it will help me see the way forward as the strongest and fastest growers present themselves.

 

[Shibui]

I’ll try and work on the creek a little more. It’s fairly easy to cover up areas of it or put down more granite to make it wider. Anything else with the trees I’m going to hold off on. Once they start growing, I think it will help me see the way forward as the strongest and fastest growers present themselves.

Exactly my thoughts. Trees need to rest, recover and grow after the transplant. Creek and gravel cover can be modified any time.

I think it will help me see the way forward as the strongest and fastest growers present themselves.

Something I've noticed that many may not be aware of: Interior trees usually grow and thicken slower than outer trunks. I guess several factors affect this.
Inner trees have root competition on all sides. Outer trees have less root competition one outer side.
Outer trees tend to have more low branches = more food and energy production. Interior trees only have few branches near the apex = less energy and food.
Faster growing outer trees are trimmed more = more ramification = more leaf = more energy.

You may find it necessary to remove more growth from any outer/ thinner trees that start to grow too much to suppress that energy imbalance.
Allow strategic sacrifice branches to develop on trunks you would like to thicken more.

It is also possible to cut groups apart to reposition trees if necessary. Sometimes separate all trees. Sometimes just separate 1 or more clusters of trunks and reposition those clusters to form a new group.

 

[Jetson1950]

Exactly my thoughts. Trees need to rest, recover and grow after the transplant. Creek and gravel cover can be modified any time.

Something I've noticed that many may not be aware of: Interior trees usually grow and thicken slower than outer trunks. I guess several factors affect this.
Inner trees have root competition on all sides. Outer trees have less root competition one outer side.
Outer trees tend to have more low branches = more food and energy production. Interior trees only have few branches near the apex = less energy and food.
Faster growing outer trees are trimmed more = more ramification = more leaf = more energy.

You may find it necessary to remove more growth from any outer/ thinner trees that start to grow too much to suppress that energy imbalance.
Allow strategic sacrifice branches to develop on trunks you would like to thicken more.

It is also possible to cut groups apart to reposition trees if necessary. Sometimes separate all trees. Sometimes just separate 1 or more clusters of trunks and reposition those clusters to form a new group.

Sounds like a description of a typical real forest. Inner trees go for height to reach sunlight and the outer trees can go for bulk if nothing is blocking their access to sunlight. I’ll watch for it.

 

[Jetson1950]

Okay, tinkering with the stream is done for now. I reduced the far end and tapered it a bit more. Also removed the wiring to hold the trees in place. They all feel solid in their locations now. Have to wait now and see what it looks like once it leafs out in spring. At that time I will also look at adjusting the heights on the trees to give it a cleaner look. I haven’t done much practice in my bonsai journey on defoliation to reduce leaf sizes, but that’s something I’ll need to learn about this year. The leaves on these saplings were 3 plus inches long before they fell off this winter. Hopefully I can start reducing them down this year.

 

[Wulfskaar]

That's a dramatic improvement over day 1! I really look forward to seeing it leaf out and get some branching.

 

[Jetson1950]

That's a dramatic improvement over day 1! I really look forward to seeing it leaf out and get some branching.

Thanks! I have to give credit to all the inputs from everybody who has been guiding me on the overall design. I’ve got more of an abstract mind and need help from the more creative folks. It’s definitely helping me see where I need to go with it.