Thanks to all who offered advice...on the Ponderosa Pine

[sorce]

I didn't want to say this before...
Well I did but...
You know...dissin Lance's peeps and all...

But then Lance brought up "doting" and how nurseries don't...

So.

Exposed root bonsai...
Like YOUR azalea....
Takes a technique...

A good raft, with proper roots, also includes a lot of technique.

What really gets me is this one was so close, to ruin it like that, rather than work it that one extra step.....which is almost just laying out the roots neat....
That really irks me, shows lack of good future vision.

All the thin dead roots, even if there is a nice exposed set under it...
Just shows lack of care...

"We do pretty"

But......

It was well worth the price.
And we know I'm a cheap Ass..

I understand you don't want to rush.

But IMO...a decision needs to be made this year.
Or it will wobble in between Awesome and Ew for many years.

The best thing is...

There are excellent people here to guide you in the right direction!

add soil and ground layer so no roots are exposed and work it into a shallow pot.

The good bonsai in this hot mess is the part you have already cropped into your avatar

I just wish one person would agree with me on that far big root.

Is that not bound for ugly?

Sincerely!

Sorce

 

[Cadillactaste]

I didn't want to say this before...
Well I did but...
You know...dissin Lance's peeps and all...

But then Lance brought up "doting" and how nurseries don't...

So.

Exposed root bonsai...
Like YOUR azalea....
Takes a technique...

A good raft, with proper roots, also includes a lot of technique.

What really gets me is this one was so close, to ruin it like that, rather than work it that one extra step.....which is almost just laying out the roots neat....
That really irks me, shows lack of good future vision.

All the thin dead roots, even if there is a nice exposed set under it...
Just shows lack of care...

"We do pretty"

But......

It was well worth the price.
And we know I'm a cheap Ass..

I understand you don't want to rush.

But IMO...a decision needs to be made this year.
Or it will wobble in between Awesome and Ew for many years.

The best thing is...

There are excellent people here to guide you in the right direction!





I just wish one person would agree with me on that far big root.

Is that not bound for ugly?

Sincerely!

Sorce

I feel I missed something on dissing anyone's peeps. ?

The guy was in his 90's...who worked this. For that...I think he may have seen his vision come to play in his time...I would hope to think so. One who may not have seen the bigger circle group of bonsai and what others have done with exposed root. For that...I give him a free pass.

The big far root is a tree that grafted to this group. Now, in my mind's eye...I wonder if that tree would not just grow faster and be a larger tree on that end if left. But, I can see a nice piece in the tree without that thick root.

I do disagree that one has to rush this or any tree. I think true skill is in the patience to chew on ones direction. To rush a better design maybe over looked.

I hadn't mentioned the price...assuming you looked it up. That says A LOT coming from you. That you felt it worth it. So...THANKS!

Anyways, snow is on the way again. Hoping for a snow day. Baby it's cold outside...secondary heater going in the cold greenhouse. All are oblivious to the outside conditions. Loving that.

 

[sorce]

I do disagree that one has to rush this or any tree. I think true skill is in the patience to chew on ones direction. To rush a better design maybe over looked

I think this one is the exception, if there is one.

Not rush tree.

But keep everyone's gerbils going as fast as possible to discuss what this or that may become by repot time...(can of worms)

I would love to hear from @MACH5 ,
If it was mine I would ask him his thoughts for sure!

Reckon he'd be here if it wasn't for the title!

NEbonsai...I had to look it up.

I agree and understand Everything else!

This will be fantastic and I know you will enjoy it no matter what!

Sorce

 

[Cadillactaste]

I think this one is the exception, if there is one.

Not rush tree.

But keep everyone's gerbils going as fast as possible to discuss what this or that may become by repot time...(can of worms)

I would love to hear from @MACH5 ,
If it was mine I would ask him his thoughts for sure!

Reckon he'd be here if it wasn't for the title!

NEbonsai...I had to look it up.

I agree and understand Everything else!

This will be fantastic and I know you will enjoy it no matter what!

Sorce

Ahhh yes, I had thought I cropped the photo. Which I had. Loaded the wrong one. No biggie on your knowing. I felt it worth it. As the saying goes...a tree is worth what the new owner is willing to put out.

Ahhh yes I see a can of worms, lol...

As for Sergio...I planned on waiting until in hand. For closer up photos of what I'm looking at. Then...ask his opinion. He did comment if not mistaken...early on. On page 1.

Thanks...yes, fun project.

 

[Cadillactaste]

I've even thought penjing...and the right side that has the fine roots @sorce wishes all to be removed...the bank leading to a ravine or water feature. Would have those roots leading down into the gully. It's just fun to think of what all it could be.

 

[LanceMac10]

I can be at NEBG in under an hour if I'm by myself and a little longer if I have @WeeMac with me, so I frequent there quite often. ALOT!! Not so much these days, sadly. And certainly not disparaging them in any way. So maybe that is what @sorce is referring to. I can be at Bonsai West in half that time and when I first started out, I would sometimes be there 4 times a week!! So I've observed quite a bit.

I do disagree that one has to rush this or any tree

And that's all there is to it! Enjoy your tree, that's all it wants........

 

[Cadillactaste]

I can be at NEBG in under an hour if I'm by myself and a little longer if I have @WeeMac with me, so I frequent there quite often. ALOT!! Not so much these days, sadly. And certainly not disparaging them in any way. So maybe that is what @sorce is referring to. I can be at Bonsai West in half that time and when I first started out, I would sometimes be there 4 times a week!! So I've observed quite a bit.








And that's all there is to it! Enjoy your tree, that's all it wants........

I so would be in trouble if I had that sort of access, my small head count number for the bench would be blown! Shoot I have that distance to get groceries.

Thanks Lance...so did WeeMac get anything for being the 10,000 member other than the title?

 

[thumblessprimate1]

I didn't want to say this before...
Well I did but...
You know...dissin Lance's peeps and all...

But then Lance brought up "doting" and how nurseries don't...

So.

Exposed root bonsai...
Like YOUR azalea....
Takes a technique...

A good raft, with proper roots, also includes a lot of technique.

What really gets me is this one was so close, to ruin it like that, rather than work it that one extra step.....which is almost just laying out the roots neat....
That really irks me, shows lack of good future vision.

All the thin dead roots, even if there is a nice exposed set under it...
Just shows lack of care...

"We do pretty"

But......

It was well worth the price.
And we know I'm a cheap Ass..

I understand you don't want to rush.

But IMO...a decision needs to be made this year.
Or it will wobble in between Awesome and Ew for many years.

The best thing is...

There are excellent people here to guide you in the right direction!





I just wish one person would agree with me on that far big root.

Is that not bound for ugly?

Sincerely!

Sorce

I agree on the big root. Best see what roots are alive first before acting. But ultimately it's her tree, she can do with it what as she likes.

 

[Cadillactaste]

I agree on the big root. Best see what roots are alive first before acting. But ultimately it's her tree, she can do with it what as she likes.

That root is actually a sucker tree. Not a root feeding the main root raft. quite easily to remove without a hiccup. At least that's what I gather from the photo of that side. But...I see it most likely being gone as well. For it is the same thickness as the branch above it, because it's part of the sucker.

 

[Don Blackmond]

I just wish one person would agree with me on that far big root.

Is that not bound for ugly?

Sincerely!

Sorce

You need one person to agree that root is going to be ugly? Okay. In my opinion, its already ugly. That's just my opinion though; that doesn't mean I'm right. I'd remove that root and never give it a second thought. Why? Its out of place and doesn't match anything else at all and most likely never will; its most likely going to cause what it feeds to grow out of proportion and out of scale; it isn't necessary to the tree's survival (if it is then your material is just plain awful [its not]). On the other hand, it may serve a utilitarian purpose; it may make a nice handle for moving and repotting the tree, or pouring excess water out of the pot (kidding, of course).

All that really matters though is that Darlene likes that root and it fits into her plan for the tree. My opinion should not affect her opinion, and I sure hope it doesn't unless it helps her design and like her tree even more.

 

[Don Blackmond]

I didn't want to say this before...
Well I did but...

What really gets me is this one was so close, to ruin it like that, rather than work it that one extra step.....which is almost just laying out the roots neat....
That really irks me, shows lack of good future vision.

All the thin dead roots, even if there is a nice exposed set under it...
Just shows lack of care...

Sorce

Please keep in mind that there are many reasons stuff like this happens. It sounds like age and physical ability were factors here. Try not to be overly critical of the human being simply because you would have done it differently. You don't know the former owner lacked good vision, or that any lack of care was by choice.

 

[sorce]

Thanks @Don Blackmond that is one of the best things I've ever read on here!

Here's why....

I have a goal to turn every tree into the best it can be. For Bonsai.
But I also totally appreciate people being happy with trees "as is". For Self wellness.

For me it is a matter of understanding how people learn, and in what way they understand things. To "balance" those 2 things.

I'm a friggin newb for all intents and purposes....
I'll hit a thousand foul balls to get the homer.

I feel Darlene is more apt to have a better tree by hearing things from a heavy hitter like yourself.

Please keep in mind that there are many reasons stuff like this happens. It sounds like age and physical ability were factors here. Try not to be overly critical of the human being simply because you would have done it differently. You don't know the former owner lacked good vision, or that any lack of care was by choice.

For the record...I skipped over the "old guy" part until Darlene mentioned it quoting me.

No way in hell I would have disrespected an elder had I known.

That said....

I would try to honor them in finishing what they began....
No matter what was involved.

Even if it means 20 years of grafting roots onto this to complete the vision.

That's who I am.

Sorce

 

[Cadillactaste]

You need one person to agree that root is going to be ugly? Okay. In my opinion, its already ugly. That's just my opinion though; that doesn't mean I'm right. I'd remove that root and never give it a second thought. Why? Its out of place and doesn't match anything else at all and most likely never will; its most likely going to cause what it feeds to grow out of proportion and out of scale; it isn't necessary to the tree's survival (if it is then your material is just plain awful [its not]). On the other hand, it may serve a utilitarian purpose; it may make a nice handle for moving and repotting the tree, or pouring excess water out of the pot (kidding, of course).

All that really matters though is that Darlene likes that root and it fits into her plan for the tree. My opinion should not affect her opinion, and I sure hope it doesn't unless it helps her design and like her tree even more.

See that too was my thought process...that it will feed that one branch making the tree on that sucker far larger than the rest of the material. You agreeing is what I wished to hear. That my grasp on the horticultural aspect of what the root offers in feeding the branch above it, That root is a sucker...looks like it from all ends. If the branch is well grafted to the piece I do intend to remove the thicker root. Leaving the branch as is, that...is my intended first plan of action. It is the same thickness as the tree/branch above it, that in my mind's eye...is wrong. But even a handle during repotting sounds humorous...I think I'm okay without one on this occasion. It's not a large tree. Lol

Thanks @Don Blackmond that is one of the best things I've ever read on here!

Here's why....

I have a goal to turn every tree into the best it can be. For Bonsai.
But I also totally appreciate people being happy with trees "as is". For Self wellness.

For me it is a matter of understanding how people learn, and in what way they understand things. To "balance" those 2 things.

I'm a friggin newb for all intents and purposes....
I'll hit a thousand foul balls to get the homer.

I feel Darlene is more apt to have a better tree by hearing things from a heavy hitter like yourself.



For the record...I skipped over the "old guy" part until Darlene mentioned it quoting me.

No way in hell I would have disrespected an elder had I known.

That said....

I would try to honor them in finishing what they began....
No matter what was involved.

Even if it means 20 years of grafting roots onto this to complete the vision.

That's who I am.

Sorce

I wish to respect the previous owner...by, not rushing it. I do intend to clean up a few of those dead roots. It's in leaf...so I will study it every time it's watered. And...if I feel the sucker has grafted then, remove its root. That's all I'm intending to do at this time once it arrives. Nothing more. For now...I said earlier on that thick root bothered me. It's even removed in the image on my avatar. It's a distraction being as thick as a branch above it. Pondered making it a larger tree. But that's once I actually see it in person. From photo intentions...the root goes. It looks like a sucker from looking at it from the side it grows on, that's ugly in my opinion. And saps the energy from trees.

 

[sorce]

I feel good!

I just feel good!

I can't wait to see the new spring pic with this on your lovely ohiohusband.com crafted bench with the beautiful stain glass!

We have 2inches of snow!

Pretty pretty pretty!

Sorce

 

[Cadillactaste]

I feel good!

I just feel good!

I can't wait to see the new spring pic with this on your lovely ohiohusband.com crafted bench with the beautiful stain glass!

We have 2inches of snow!

Pretty pretty pretty!

Sorce

I'm glad you feel good...has to be the snow! Is it heavy laden and sticking to branches of trees? We are to get 6" they say. Down from the original 9" states yesterday. I just want a snow day for my youngest from school!!! I'm worse than a kid with those snow days. We've only used two.

I can't wait to see it in leaf. To be honest...seen they are to get 24" of snow where the tree sits currently by the news forecast today. Not shipping was a wise decision. My husband's favorite tree is a Japanese Maple. I have a feeling this may be his favorite once it arrives. Had one offer to buy/trade me for it. And I told him...and he was upset thinking I considered it. It's not going anywhere he states other than your bench! Lol


Lol honestly, I think the older gentleman planned all along to remove the root to the sucker. I think his intentions all along was to graft that branch onto the raft/clump all along if you look at the tree and how it was done. He just never removed it in his life time of having the tree. That's my mental direction of being able to remove the root. No guilt...because he surely intended to later himself. I do feel he improved the look by adding that graft though.

 

[sorce]

I do feel he improved the look by adding that graft though.

Absolutely!

I think there may have been a little confusion somewhere as to the "root, graft, sucker, branch" talk....

But that branch is excellent IMO!

As excellent as the root is bad!

But you got it figured!
I understand that now!

Please tell your husband I said hello and I hope he is well!

A great man!

Sorce

 

[Paradox]

This is an interesting tree IMO.

I'm wondering if you could graft some seedlings around where you envision the soil line to be in your picture to use to develop a better root base. Maples are usually very amenable to approach grafting. If it was mine, I would probably try that.

I also might be inclined to make 2 trees out of it because the two sides are competing with each other

 

[Adair M]

Yes, that isn't a "sucker", that's the stem of a grafted on seedling. The upper part is now larger than the lower part, so it's safe to remove the "root", which is actually part of the trunk of the seedling used for the graft.

There's another grafted on branch (trunk) on the other side.

Are we absolutely sure there's not a rock in the middle?

 

[sorce]

Are we absolutely sure there's not a rock in the middle?

Amen....

We won't know anything till we know what is really going on in there!

Still could be a perfect exposed root!

The suspense is killing me....

@LanceMac10 how bout that half hour trek before you get that snow!

Sorce

 

[Cadillactaste]

Yes, that isn't a "sucker", that's the stem of a grafted on seedling. The upper part is now larger than the lower part, so it's safe to remove the "root", which is actually part of the trunk of the seedling used for the graft.

There's another grafted on branch (trunk) on the other side.

Are we absolutely sure there's not a rock in the middle?

Thanks Adair. The graft was pegged root when ones didn't see the other angle. One swore it was a sucker...so it went by many names. When removing the base of the graft. How close can I cut it? Do I need to worry about die back?

Will look at it again once it arrives...I'm sure you're right about other grafts. As for the rock,my friend Paul questions as well if it might have one. Only by the way the roots are forced downward. Puzzles him... One really won't know until the thing is cleaned up I imagine. States no rock on the site...but you are not the first to really question if they missed the mark listing it with it not properly cleaned up after its stint with creating the roots in the manor they look know. One may not know I recon until repotting time and one gets in that mess to see what is there.