Shohin Juniperus " PRO" cumbens

[Poink88]

My 2 cents is that the problem that I see with myself, Dario, yourself and perhaps a few others is that we are still green and it shows in our trees along with our posts. That doesn't mean that your trees are not better than the majority of those posted on these forums however there is still a lot to be learned and that's evident. Nobody likes to be told what to do by somebody that they do not yet respect and to earn respect you must prove yourself in any arena that you are in. No offense but you have not done that yet nor has Dario nor has myself. In actuality very few here have. I think I could name them on one hand. Now let's get back to eating some of that pie together Dario would you like a piece?

LOL...yes please.

The problem is that some "masters" (so they believe) have as much to learn as we do. They just happened to play this game earlier.

 

[Nybonsai12]

The problem is that some "masters" (so they believe) have as much to learn as we do.

Ah dario, always trying to get the last word, always trying to make the field seem level between himself and much more experienced folks.

 

[Poink88]

Ah dario, always trying to get the last word, always trying to make the field seem level between himself and much more experienced folks.

No sir. I know there are really great ones there but not all who claim it are.

Me I am a newbie but choose who to listen to and what. I filter everything as much as possible...that is just me.

 

[nathanbs]

LOL...yes please.

The problem is that some "masters" (so they believe) have as much to learn as we do. They just happened to play this game earlier.

This is actually a greater problem than the newbie know it all. In So. Cal we have what some refer to as the "old lawnmower club" that were students of John Naka and have chosen to limit their learning and skills to what they were taught almost 2 decades ago. It has severely handicapped bonsai in So. Cal as they will literally bad mouth, blackball, and bully those that try to embrace change. a perfect example is they think Ryan Neil is a quack.

 

[ChrisV]

To get back to The tree. Nice movement you created in The trunk but I recommend bringing The foliage and The upper part of The trunk down a bit to compact The overall look.

One thing i'm from europe and our procumbus have needle like foliage. In juvinile and mature state. Just like The pictures shown later And like The one dorothy has.
I hate to dissapoint you but it's definitly not procumbus.
There is a big differente between juvinile foliage and needle like foliage in junipers.

 

[berobinson82]

Plant species aside, I'm glad you're posting so many trees up recently, Stacey. Good to get a gander. Even if it's a response to a not-so-pleasant exchange, the result is a bonsai forum with more bonsai trees.

Kudos!

 

[Poink88]

This is actually a greater problem than the newbie know it all. In So. Cal we have what some refer to as the "old lawnmower club" that were students of John Naka and have chosen to limit their learning and skills to what they were taught almost 2 decades ago. It has severely handicapped bonsai in So. Cal as they will literally bad mouth, blackball, and bully those that try to embrace change. a perfect example is they think Ryan Neil is a quack.

What impressed me a lot by Kathy Shaner is her attitude that we are all learning everyday. She out right admitted to me that she learned something new the day before we met from folks she is teaching.

We need more of that mentality I think.

 

[nathanbs]

What impressed me a lot by Kathy Shaner is her attitude that we are all learning everyday. She out right admitted to me that she learned something new the day before we met from folks she is teaching.

We need more of that mentality I think.

Kathy is definitely on the boat and on the ball. Shes a great asset to bonsai in America. You should have seen the look on her face when she heard someone say "The lawnmower club" last month. It was almost like I cant believe you just said that but Im glad you did. To clarify this is my interpretation of the look she gave but not her words.

 

[Poink88]

Kathy is definitely on the boat and on the ball. Shes a great asset to bonsai in America. You should have seen the look on her face when she heard someone say "The lawnmower club" last month. It was almost like I cant believe you just said that but Im glad you did. To clarify this is my interpretation of the look she gave but not her words.

Agreed!

LOL...I like the description and I would love to see that look.

 

[bonsaibp]

This is actually a greater problem than the newbie know it all. In So. Cal we have what some refer to as the "old lawnmower club" that were students of John Naka and have chosen to limit their learning and skills to what they were taught almost 2 decades ago. It has severely handicapped bonsai in So. Cal as they will literally bad mouth, blackball, and bully those that try to embrace change. a perfect example is they think Ryan Neil is a quack.

I think this is an over simplification. Have you ever actually heard this happen or is this second or third hand information? Ben Oki was very supportive and I believe even Ryan says, instrumental in getting Ryan hooked up with Kimura. And if anybody is, he would be the head of that "old lawnmower club". There my be a few old timers who feel that way but that bulk of them are happy there is a new push to improve bonsai. Some may feel they may be too old to learn new tricks but definitely do not put down anybody trying new things, in my experience with them. And they definitely respect Ryan. What they don't like is self promoting showmanship- which is not what people like Ryan, Kathy etc. are doing, but there are some who are.
I'm not saying there aren't people bad mouthing etc. but none of the one's I know have ever done so in my presence and I spend a good bit of time with some of them.

 

[ChrisV]

Ryan Neil is probably the best thing that happened to bonsai in the US in the last years. I like his approach and how he wants to put the US on the world bonsai map.
No bad words about him from me.

 

[nathanbs]

I think this is an over simplification. Have you ever actually heard this happen or is this second or third hand information? Ben Oki was very supportive and I believe even Ryan says, instrumental in getting Ryan hooked up with Kimura. And if anybody is, he would be the head of that "old lawnmower club". There my be a few old timers who feel that way but that bulk of them are happy there is a new push to improve bonsai. Some may feel they may be too old to learn new tricks but definitely do not put down anybody trying new things, in my experience with them. And they definitely respect Ryan. What they don't like is self promoting showmanship- which is not what people like Ryan, Kathy etc. are doing, but there are some who are.
I'm not saying there aren't people bad mouthing etc. but none of the one's I know have ever done so in my presence and I spend a good bit of time with some of them.

I think you are defending the lawnmower club with one or two names in mind, Ben Oki being one of them and I am referring to a handful of others that are not being supportive in the push to improve bonsai. They are actually going out of their way to do the opposite. For the most part its second or third hand info because i am not a "threat" in their eyes so I have not been the target of any of their bullying personally. Not yet at least. But i trust and believe the sources that give me my info, which in most cases is coming straight from the mouth of someone who was targeted. The term "lawnmower club" may be a little misleading as those that are creating an issue were never landscapers/gardeners. However I guess it has become a little bit of a guilty by association situation. Call it the "old guard", the "lawnmower club", "CBS", what ever you want.
Its one of those situations where not all CBS and/or lawnmower club members are holding back bonsai in So. Cal, but all those who are holding back bonsai in So. Cal are members of CBS and/or lawnmower club.

EDIT** sorry Sawgrass for hijacking your thread

 

[amcoffeegirl]

I have 3 procumbens and this one is lovely. Mine wish to see the day they look so well aged. You've done a great job styling. To the others put your egos away this is not your thread.

 

[Vance Wood]

No sir. I know there are really great ones there but not all who claim it are.

Me I am a newbie but choose who to listen to and what. I filter everything as much as possible...that is just me.

OK as long as we keep entertaining this statement I don't think it would be in bad form to ask you put up some names or stop making that veiled pjoritive. It seems that you come from the position that there are some recognized bonsaiists that you believe your skill level is greater than thiers. Let's put some meat on the table instead of boasting.

 

[Poink88]

OK as long as we keep entertaining this statement I don't think it would be in bad form to ask you put up some names or stop making that veiled pjoritive. It seems that you come from the position that there are some recognized bonsaiists that you believe your skill level is greater than thiers. Let's put some meat on the table instead of boasting.

Read my message again...I never CLAIMED I am better than anyone. You feeling some pain Vance? I wonder why?

 

[Nybonsai12]

Ok so who claims to be a master that is not in your humble opinion? You sure make that statement a lot but never quite expand on it.

 

[Poink88]

Ok so who claims to be a master that is not in your humble opinion? You sure make that statement a lot but never quite expand on it.

You better get digging your great dawn redwoods...that 's better use of your time . I refuse to waste my time on you, maybe when you have better things about bonsai to say, we can talk. Right now you are just trying to stir poop and I refuse to play. Bye!

 

[Nybonsai12]

You better get digging your great dawn redwoods...that 's better use of your time . I refuse to waste my time on you, maybe when you have better things about bonsai to say, we can talk. Right now you are just trying to stir poop and I refuse to play. Bye!

Typical Dario. All talk.

 

[GO-OK]

Nice tree, great potential. It is a procumbens......Steve Cratty at plant city bonsai has hundreds sitting waiting to be plucked up, all with adult foliage.

It is an over looked variety, I believe this is also called a Sonar juniper in other regions. There are many nice old specimen around to be found.

As for the other 99% of this thread, save it for face book or some other social media. The jostling back and forth is less tHan becoming for anyone, regardless of experience level, age, talent or intelligence. Have some class.

 

[Vance Wood]

Read my message again...I never CLAIMED I am better than anyone. You feeling some pain Vance? I wonder why?

I suppose you are spliting hairs? You did not say that you were specifically better, but you as much implied that it was so, otherwise did you find it necessary to say what you did with the frequency you have found it necessary to repeat it? It is possible that some people can aquire the artistic sikills to accomplish some things in a short amount of time but the question still remains: How did you acquire the skilll you have to do what you have done? It had to come from somewhere.

The thing that pisses me off is the indication that there are some Palm-"F"ing-Olive-Green-Soap beginner people that think bonsaiists like me shoiuld just go away, our contribution means nothing, because they alread know more than we do. Personally I like to know who I am dealing with. I don't get paid to do this, I do it out a love for bonsai, and if I can find those who think my advise is worthless I want to make sure I don't trouble them with it.