Desperately Need Help on Cuttings!

[JoeR]

I have taken hundreds of cuttings. Tried different media, different species, different set-ups, etc. Out of all the cuttings I have taken, I have had one root. A cherry.

I also have some seiju cuttings in a tent with perlite that I think are rooting so maybe they will add to my score.


I just cant win!


I need serious schooling on taking cuttings.

I would like to know your timing, what hormone you use, media, light, tent or not, how many leaves you keep, and water/misting schedule that you use for taking cuttings!

I would like a general rule of thumb; however, some of the species I am specifically looking for are:

-Chinese juniper
-Citrus
-seiju elm
-Japanese Maple
-Trident Maple
-Bald Cypress
-Sparkleberry

Thanks for anything you can help me with. I hope this will be a good resource for me as well as others.

 

[Dav4]

Chinese juniper cuttings should be taken in late winter, imo. I've had 90% + success striking hardwood cuttings taken in February and March. I use rooting hormone and plant in straight soil conditioner. Place in the shade...most will be rooted by the summer but some may not root until next year
Japanese maple cuttings should be taken as semi hardwood cuttings after the spring's flush of foliage has hardened off. Make them 4-6 inches long, remove all but the last two leaves, use rooting hormone. My rooting medium for these is a mix of conditioner and sand. Cover with a clear plastic bag for humidity and place in the shade. remove the bag periodically to refresh the air inside. Your mileage will vary depending on cultivar...I get about 50% to take. I've done a few tridents and the process is the same. I've never tried any of the other species but I'd think seiju elm would strike easily if taken in spring, like maples, with a tent for humidity.

 

[barrosinc]

Do you move them?
Do they die in the first days?
Are you in a windy spot?

I started getting very lucky with these when I started using plastic soda bottles with large holes at the top, protects from wind and stays more humid without being 100% relative humidity.

 

[JoeR]

Do you move them?
Do they die in the first days?
Are you in a windy spot?

I started getting very lucky with these when I started using plastic soda bottles with large holes at the top, protects from wind and stays more humid without being 100% relative humidity.

I dont move them. I did with a batch or two but realized its not a good Idea.

Theres relatively no wind here since we live in a little valley except when we get those horrible summer storms.

Plastic bottles Is a good idea. I tried something similar which seemed to be working until my dog decided it was food.

 

[JoeR]

Chinese juniper cuttings should be taken in late winter, imo. I've had 90% + success striking hardwood cuttings taken in February and March. I use rooting hormone and plant in straight soil conditioner. Place in the shade...most will be rooted by the summer but some may not root until next year
Japanese maple cuttings should be taken as semi hardwood cuttings after the spring's flush of foliage has hardened off. Make them 4-6 inches long, remove all but the last two leaves, use rooting hormone. My rooting medium for these is a mix of conditioner and sand. Cover with a clear plastic bag for humidity and place in the shade. remove the bag periodically to refresh the air inside. Your mileage will vary depending on cultivar...I get about 50% to take. I've done a few tridents and the process is the same. I've never tried any of the other species but I'd think seiju elm would strike easily if taken in spring, like maples, with a tent for humidity.

It can take an entire year for the cuttings to root? Surprized they wouldnt brown first.

Thanks for the info. What about large caliper japanese maple cuttings?

Also you say late winter. Whats the que to take them?

 

[Dav4]

It can take an entire year for the cuttings to root? Surprized they wouldnt brown first.

Thanks for the info. What about large caliper japanese maple cuttings?

Also you say late winter. Whats the que to take them?

I take this year's growth from the maples after the leaves have hardened off, so the cutting itself may be 3-4 mm in width. As far as when to take the juniper cuttings, you can do it anytime with some success, but I've found that they tend to strike best after a period of cold- Michael Dirr feels the same way. I'll take cuttings anytime I'm pruning my junipers in the late winter to early spring, which is typically February into April...but I prefer earlier.

 

[Eric Group]

I love to propagate! Been a big part of bonsai for me for years... Really had the most success with it lately though. I think I just have a great spot for cuttings which is a big part of it: I keep them under the partial shade of a large oak tree close to my garden.. Close enough so that most of them get some spray from the sprinkler twice a day.. I generally go around and water everything again mid day. Many of my trees are kept in an area very close by and get the same watering... Yes, THREE times a day! Root rot is just not a concern of mine. Used to be and I had countless deaths due to UNDER watering because zi was scared of the dreaded "root rot"... About 3-4 years ago I realized that I have Never lost a single tree due to root rot. It is more common in INDOOR trees, so perhaps those who keep Tropicals indoors or people who have longer, harder winters (thus keeping trees indoors and protected for long periods and more mild summers, that don't dry the soil so fast) have a bigger concern for root rot than I do?

Any hoo, back to cuttings:
The biggest success factor for me: perlite. Pretty much 100%, you can mix in some turface or Akadama, Lava, pumice.. Peat.. Soil conditioner.., mixing 10-15% of something like that to give the perlite a little more "weight" is fine. I like to put a layer of something heavier- like Lava rock- on the top to keep it from washing out.. But perlite is the key for me! Rooting hormone helps obviously, but some of the species you mentioned- Juniper, Elm, maybe even some citrus- I'd say it is optional. Maples can be a little more stubborn and I recommend deff using the rooting hormone...

So, again- mostly shade, sheltered from wind, relax watering schedule that wets the ENTIRE PLANT AND POT, even use some humidity trays under the cuttings if you like- keep it shallow. Fill the bottoms wih pebbles if the tray is deep. Leave them alone while rooting, and once the plants start growing, you should have roots. Leave it alone a couple weeks/ months depending on the tree (juniper roots grow a little slower, Maples, Quince, Pyracantha... Grow faster) then repot the cuttings into a good soil mix to let them run and fill the pot.

A few points to keep in mind: nothing is 100%, so take more cuttings than you need/ want.

Time of year... Well I have had success all through the growing season. Some trees do better early in the season: Junipers are famously rooted in late winter by most! Late Jan even I have been told. I usually start them about a month later than that. Maples can get done early too- PRIOR to leafs breaking, large HARDWOOD cuttings are possible!! 1.5, even 2-3 inch trunks on multiple large hardwood cuttings I took in EARLY Spring this year! Pretty good success rate.. Better than the smaller ones! Better than the "semi- hardwood" cuttings most recommend, and you get a tree with 5, 10, maybe even 15+ years more growth/ girth on it!? Yes please! Some trees root crazy easy/ fast. Pomegranite for instance- did some emperor cuttings this year and they were rooted in less than 2 weeks I think! Pyracantha seems very fast and easy to root as well.

I know nothing of Sparkleberry, and I don't think Bald a Cypress is one I would ever do a cutting from... Just don't personally want anything except a big, massively tapered old trunk on those- which would take you 50+ years from the kinds of twigs most people take as cuttings...
Just how zi do it and what has worked for me- any fast draining soil medium that is kept moist but drains quick to allow lots of air.. Wpshould do. Perlite is great because you can buy a bag of it as talk as you are DT a local feed and seed in most areas for about $18.. Compare that to the cost of Akadama, pumice, lava- which is the common base for many a great bonsai mix, and should work greet for rooting cuttings- and you will see why I love perlite so much! Efficacy and cost combine to a perfect option as a rooting medium! It is also sterile, clean and easy to work with...

 

[sorce]

A long time ago, I would use perlite/peat.

In a clear container.

I don't much consider sharp or disease for trimming, but with cuttings, you gotta have a sharp, clean, blade.

I put juniper cuttings in my indoor catchall in fall, it has one cfl on it when my kids don't move it, they root by summer.
Same for a yew branch.

As soon as you don't care if they root, they will!

Sorce

 

[JoeR]

I love to propagate! Been a big part of bonsai for me for years... Really had the most success with it lately though. I think I just have a great spot for cuttings which is a big part of it: I keep them under the partial shade of a large oak tree close to my garden.. Close enough so that most of them get some spray from the sprinkler twice a day.. I generally go around and water everything again mid day. Many of my trees are kept in an area very close by and get the same watering... Yes, THREE times a day! Root rot is just not a concern of mine. Used to be and I had countless deaths due to UNDER watering because zi was scared of the dreaded "root rot"... About 3-4 years ago I realized that I have Never lost a single tree due to root rot. It is more common in INDOOR trees, so perhaps those who keep Tropicals indoors or people who have longer, harder winters (thus keeping trees indoors and protected for long periods and more mild summers, that don't dry the soil so fast) have a bigger concern for root rot than I do?

Any hoo, back to cuttings:
The biggest success factor for me: perlite. Pretty much 100%, you can mix in some turface or Akadama, Lava, pumice.. Peat.. Soil conditioner.., mixing 10-15% of something like that to give the perlite a little more "weight" is fine. I like to put a layer of something heavier- like Lava rock- on the top to keep it from washing out.. But perlite is the key for me! Rooting hormone helps obviously, but some of the species you mentioned- Juniper, Elm, maybe even some citrus- I'd say it is optional. Maples can be a little more stubborn and I recommend deff using the rooting hormone...

So, again- mostly shade, sheltered from wind, relax watering schedule that wets the ENTIRE PLANT AND POT, even use some humidity trays under the cuttings if you like- keep it shallow. Fill the bottoms wih pebbles if the tray is deep. Leave them alone while rooting, and once the plants start growing, you should have roots. Leave it alone a couple weeks/ months depending on the tree (juniper roots grow a little slower, Maples, Quince, Pyracantha... Grow faster) then repot the cuttings into a good soil mix to let them run and fill the pot.

A few points to keep in mind: nothing is 100%, so take more cuttings than you need/ want.

Time of year... Well I have had success all through the growing season. Some trees do better early in the season: Junipers are famously rooted in late winter by most! Late Jan even I have been told. I usually start them about a month later than that. Maples can get done early too- PRIOR to leafs breaking, large HARDWOOD cuttings are possible!! 1.5, even 2-3 inch trunks on multiple large hardwood cuttings I took in EARLY Spring this year! Pretty good success rate.. Better than the smaller ones! Better than the "semi- hardwood" cuttings most recommend, and you get a tree with 5, 10, maybe even 15+ years more growth/ girth on it!? Yes please! Some trees root crazy easy/ fast. Pomegranite for instance- did some emperor cuttings this year and they were rooted in less than 2 weeks I think! Pyracantha seems very fast and easy to root as well.

I know nothing of Sparkleberry, and I don't think Bald a Cypress is one I would ever do a cutting from... Just don't personally want anything except a big, massively tapered old trunk on those- which would take you 50+ years from the kinds of twigs most people take as cuttings...
Just how zi do it and what has worked for me- any fast draining soil medium that is kept moist but drains quick to allow lots of air.. Wpshould do. Perlite is great because you can buy a bag of it as talk as you are DT a local feed and seed in most areas for about $18.. Compare that to the cost of Akadama, pumice, lava- which is the common base for many a great bonsai mix, and should work greet for rooting cuttings- and you will see why I love perlite so much! Efficacy and cost combine to a perfect option as a rooting medium! It is also sterile, clean and easy to work with...

Do you sift the perlite?

Also when thw leaves emerge on the large maple cuttings do you leave them on or do you cut most off?


And with the bald cypress, I wanted to do a forest planting with them. They are protected in this state so I would have to drive down to SC to be able to collect some and even then I dont have the permits for them.

 

[Eric Group]

Do you sift the perlite?

Also when thw leaves emerge on the large maple cuttings do you leave them on or do you cut most off?


And with the bald cypress, I wanted to do a forest planting with them. They are protected in this state so I would have to drive down to SC to be able to collect some and even then I dont have the permits for them.

I do not sift the perlite.

I Absolutely do NOT remove leaves as they emerge!
Now, there are two distinctions here: when you take a cutting from a branch with leaves already emerged? Yes- remove most of them. I usually lave a couple and if there is an active growing tip, I try to leave that. If the cutting either A- has no leaves when started or B- drops all leaves due to stress soon after being started, it is usually a sign it has begun to grow roots and you definitely do not want to or need to remove those. I have found cuttings will not usually outgrow their new root structure, so they will only make as many leaves as the emerging roots can handle. The more growth you get on top, the more food those roots get and the faster your new tree will develop.

 

[Eric Group]

Oh... And I am not touching your comment about collecting Bald Cypress. Intentionally just deleted a paragraph of smart ass comments about people with sticks up their arses who rain their superiority complexes down on you if you even say the word "collected" regarding a tree you own on this site because I don't want to even TOUCH that discussion. (Did I just stick my foot in it anyways...?)


I know for a fact Wigert's down in south Florida has (well HAD earlier this year anyway) a TON of BC and I know they had a whole table of smaller ones (I bought one in the Spring, the last of the curly Q trunks they had... I thought it was cool, maybe I can post a pic later..) if you wanted to reach out to them to see if they are able/ willing to sell one or two by mail. If you are just looking for seedling sized trees, I believe the Arbor Day foundation offers them at a reasonable price, or will send you some if you simply sign up to become a member. I know nothing of making cuttings from this tree though/ never tried it and as far as I know, all the small ones I have seen were seed grown.

 

[cmeg1]

I know with Zelkova I have done I had best success when they are semi ripe(starting to get slightly woody)they will not rot before it throws roots.And use a propagator cover to maintain humidity.

 

[JoeR]

I just ordered Michael Dirrs book 'The Referance Manual of Woody Plant Propagation', super excited for it to come in. I was going to order some bonsai today magazines but I don't know what issues I want yet.


It Does say second edition on the cover- what's the difference from the first one?

 

[Smoke]

It means there was enough interest for a second printing. My book "Runway modeling for plus size men" is in its third printing

 

[Bonsai Nut]

I just ordered Michael Dirrs book 'The Referance Manual of Woody Plant Propagation', super excited for it to come in. I was going to order some bonsai today magazines but I don't know what issues I want yet.

It Does say second edition on the cover- what's the difference from the first one?

I'm gonna spank Al. Oh wait... he might like it

2nd Edition means there has been some revision in the material. I don't know what was changed, but SOMETHING was Otherwise it would just be a 2nd printing. There can be several printings of the same edition.

 

[Smoke]

Well they included the addition of the oval leaf deciduous foemina but I thought that was common knowledge by now...

 

[JoeR]

I'm gonna spank Al. Oh wait... he might like it

2nd Edition means there has been some revision in the material. I don't know what was changed, but SOMETHING was Otherwise it would just be a 2nd printing. There can be several printings of the same edition.

Thanks I thought so.


Foemina never get a oldm

 

[discusmike]

Cleanliness,timeing and good medium!

 

[JoeR]

Cleanliness,timeing and good medium!

Timing is the hardest part for me.

 

[sorce]

Timing is the hardest part for me.

I feel you. I was waiting for "after the leaves to harden" And I think it slipped by in the high 40's, nothing was growing to well, then all of a sudden, it was too late!

I would follow Eric Groups methods and timing, he is close to you yes? And pretty successful!

Good luck JoeR,

Sorce