Extended season starting trees indoors

cmeg1

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ok, tricked out the main grow tent ——blue/uv


Well,have to give this a go.Added a 3rd pure uv,they turn on for 15 minutes every hour for the inside 10 hrs of the light cycle(18 hr cycle).
And then added two blue spectrum suppliments and also added the hlg 300L B-spec light yesterday with the added sky blue diodes.
Wow,done for the day.

Was able to spread out and overlap the two lights and turn down the power.......at about 600-850 par across the grow.Also some good penetration down into the bottom branches mostly about 400 par (minimum veg) down there.
Good deal for sure.
Ready to see some extra photosynthesis,more stomata and tighter growth on the pines from blue spectrum and uva/uvb.
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cmeg1

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already results from blue spectrum light recipe.

So lately been tweaking absolutely everything with the grow.Nutrient formulations,EC,storage of premixed solutions,light recipes and also improved propogation techniques.

Really got into the nitty gritty with nitrient formulations(maybe never ending really).
For sprouting seeds I use a 1:1 custome Mother formula with all the base npk from probably 60% or more ammoniacal nitrogen by means of pure ammonium nitrate as opposed to all nitrate.This can get very scientific as to why ammonia form is better at the young seedling stage.What I understand is ammonia has to be broken down first ,so essentially more chemical reaction happen right in the root from protien reactions after the ammonia absorption(or something) along with the ise of Amino acids,fulvic acid,kelp.
All micro-mineral in this formulas comes from kelp and fulvic acid.....maximum dosage ...and oh a light dose of calmag.Fulvic acid has over 7% calcium.
Along with the calmag Ca is quite good.
Also mono ammonium phosphate right at the start......for big roots taking in the calcium and bio-stimulants right at the start.
Sprouts at .3 ec———.4——.5——- then on up to proper veg and lots more nitrate nitrogen with grow/mother a&b bases.
So these are custom made by me with a %——-ppm calculater.Mother formulas right from the start loaded with calcium,amino,fulvic acid......amino and fulvic are organic chelaters of all ions!!!!!............not to mention to take in the goodies in the kelp also!!!

So went big time with the blue spectrum.....not much info out there on percentage to use.Was just taight for sprouts,seedlings ,cuttings and veg to use lots & lots of blue and also some red too.
So I am envisioning some super dwarf type starts.........thick stems......maximum chlorophyl,photosynthsis and chemical reactions happening here.With big vascular systems from Ca....certain amino’s actually increase Ca uptake thousands of times.

Can already see a pigmentation improvement in just two days of extra blue.Using 30-60% extra blue in this(around 100-170 par of straight up blue)!!!

The leaves are quite thick already from this!!!!
Cotyledon leaves look like they are on steroids😃
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cmeg1

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all three tents are dialed in perfectly TEMP/RH

No small feat sometimes.....get the lighting distance and intensity right it all falls into place........1000 -1200 ppm co2 in all tents.
If they go over 84f for an extended time it can stress them and reduce performance.......... BUT,the sweetspot with co2 fertilization is 80-84f!!!!!
RH just under 60%🙌🏻
Here are each of the 3 tent controlers this evening.
 

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leatherback

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You are slowly getting into the territory of pushing plant growing boundaries here. Ever thought about collecting some data and putting results together in a paper?
 

cmeg1

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You are slowly getting into the territory of pushing plant growing boundaries here. Ever thought about collecting some data and putting results together in a paper?
Well,I do record all nutrient formulas.Definately putting to practice new iseas from last season like much less nitrate nitrogen( at the start anyway). Not being in a rush.My goal this season is to literally stunt the growth of sprouting seeds with the blue spectrum light suppliment.And give everything the young plant needs to photosynthesize at high rate.I have read i struction from reputable sources of letting the plant subside a bit from meristem elongation will actually build energy reserves in the plant and make phospherous and natural rooting agents at the roots.
I am exploring this so as to have no need for seedling cuttings( deciduous) and get quite nice rooting on relatively tiny plants.Dearf them and make masses of low budding and eventually push the plant on or after selling them.

Light recipe experiments are intersting.These seedlings are getting vast blue lighting.I wonder if there is a OD limit..........probably bot when accented with a regular full spectrum white light source.

Usually no time to record much data(for proofing),
But enough charting to improve.....for sure.
So doing everything I know for these this season.
Mainly starting at seed sprouting...low EC(.2),almost all ammoniacal nitrogen,Motherplant 1:1 ratio (rooting) nutrient base,essentially 2-9-2 (ratio)high mono ammonium phosphate starter boost with Calcium at 5 respectively..... right at germination,all fulvic acid and select amino acid as organic chelaters of all mineral ion( organic are taken into plant as a whole with the chelated ion) unlike synthetic chelaters like etda? or whatever which the outer chelate does not get into the plant...so less efficient.
All this happening with ammoniacle nirogen is supposed to be very good as when ammonia nitrogen is finally absorbed it releases a protein based something or other similiar to microbial type amino acid avaiable npk......essentially like lots of chemical reactions going on in the roots first.......like nature.Coupled with co2 fertiliation and blue light ,foliar feeds of kelp................well lets just say I want photosynthetic machines........at the earliest age possible.Extra blue can do this alone.......I tried to up all the parameters in this direction this year.

Ammonium nitrate is only safe in very high amounts at first 1 mnth........otherwise will throw off ph........ammonium takes one direction and nitrate goes the other........there are benchmark percentages.
Each form will produce a different ph root exudate?
Check these!!!
See how long I can keep this going......hopefully extraordinary low branching is the outcome with air-layer like rooting(especially on the deciduous seed stock).
These are definately being meristem suppressed( not always a bad thing).
The fulvic/kelp foliar will make backbudding extraordinarily also( as usual). Lets see what happens.
Even the cotyledon leaves look high brix to me!!!
I want masses of roots to form first.....full of calcium in the stems for future mineral and water uptake and overall a great start .
Letting them stall for as long as possible.........very fun experiment.......instant cuttings or air-layer without the extra work.

oh well we’ll see.Learn by doing
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Leo in N E Illinois

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How will these pampered thoroughbred seedlings adapt to cultivation by "mere mortals"? Will the shock of being moved to a "average person's" backyard be a problem? I would expect growth to slow to a "normal rate". I don't think there would be problems, but have you gotten feedback from customers?
 

kale

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How will these pampered thoroughbred seedlings adapt to cultivation by "mere mortals"? Will the shock of being moved to a "average person's" backyard be a problem? I would expect growth to slow to a "normal rate". I don't think there would be problems, but have you gotten feedback from customers?
I am a noob and have kept mine alive! Here’s when I first got them compared to two days ago (sorry for the one being hidden behind another pot, that one has like 5 candles on top btw)82B489D1-271D-40B7-9951-50146EBDAE23.jpegC42D5B70-1BAB-4B4B-B1A2-18FBEBE60741.jpeg
 

cmeg1

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How will these pampered thoroughbred seedlings adapt to cultivation by "mere mortals"? Will the shock of being moved to a "average person's" backyard be a problem? I would expect growth to slow to a "normal rate". I don't think there would be problems, but have you gotten feedback from customers?
Ahhh it’s ok.
Even mortals have the means to get this 😃
Ok ,I really get into this...I get it.Sorry ‘man fun is fun.
I say healthy roots can accompmish anything...that is the real jist of my post above........and then the plants can photosynthesize from blue light like I do 😃😃😃🙌🏻
You should see me in my grow room......I stop stretching,get energetic,grow as nature intended and just relax!!! Ha haaaaaaa🥳🥳🥳

Ok all jokes aside.....its just fun.I love the hobby.
 

kale

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Ahhh it’s ok.
Even mortals have the means to get this 😃
Ok ,I really get into this...I get it.Sorry ‘man fun is fun.
I say healthy roots can accompmish anything...that is the real jist of my post above........and then the plants can photosynthesize from blue light like I do 😃😃😃🙌🏻
You should see me in my grow room......I stop stretching,get energetic,grow as nature intended and just relax!!! Ha haaaaaaa🥳🥳🥳

Ok all jokes aside.....its just fun.I love the hobby.
You have a loyal customer here! I think all the vigor and energy you send them off with sets them up for a bright future. Here is a pic of both. Of all the pics I see of young jbp I really think these are off to a better than average start. I know they are in development but I am very tempted to decandle this spring already and see how bushy I can get them.A2018DFD-8605-4FC7-9B40-87B748BDE773.jpeg
 
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cmeg1

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You have a loyal customer here! I think all the vigor and energy you send them off with sets them up for a bright future. Here is a pic of both. Of all the pics I see of young jbp I really think these are off to a better than average start. I know they are in development but I am very tempted to decandle this spring already and see how bushy I can get them.View attachment 352693
Wow.Cool thanks!
What is your media there? Or is that just a top layer........if that your media you must be pouring water on them all day!!!
 

kale

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Its kind of a smorgasbord of stuff I had. Lava, DE, haydite and a small amount of orchid bark. Yeah in the summer I had them watered for 1 min every 6 hours!
 

jevanlewis

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I am another satisfied customer and mere mortal who has seen tremendous growth in the seedlings I purchased from cmeg1 last year. Here are the before and after shots:

April 2020
JBP_04-April-2020.jpg

Feb 2021
JBP_1_05-Feb-2021.jpg
JBP_2_05-Feb-2021.jpg

My substrate is 100% pumice (w/ lava rock on the top to prevent the pumice from washing away), buried in a grow bed with sandy topsoil and lots of organic material. My plan this year (and I guess for the next 10 years!) is to cut back the lower branches to reduce the internodes and get back buds in an effort to keep compact growth and ramification at the bottom of the tree. Of course, I'll let the sacrifice grow like crazy for several years until I transition to a new sacrifice coming off the lower branches. I'll also do limited wiring, primarily to ensure the lower branches get sun.
 

rollwithak

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After you pull the trees up out of their containers and the roots are exposed, is there a thought process with how you place the roots when you put them in their next container? Are you spreading them out flat?
 

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Dystopics

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Having bought some of the regular JBP from cmeg1, i can say with certainty that I will be grabbing a couple of the Mikawa JBP when they are available.
 

weetree3

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Wow.Cool thanks!
What is your media there? Or is that just a top layer........if that your media you must be pouring water on them all day!!!
You sir are a monster. I have never seen anything like this JBP development. Hope some will be on your E-Bay site.
 

cmeg1

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You sir are a monster. I have never seen anything like this JBP development. Hope some will be on your E-Bay site.
Thanks.Been on a vacation......quite long one befor new job and nothing but the growroom for something to do.
 
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