Anyone know what this is on my Japanese willows?
- Thread starter power270lb
- Start date
Bonsai Nut
Nuttier than your average Nut
They look like they are getting cooked. Do you have them under artificial lighting? A combination of missing some watering and hot direct light may be scorching the leaves.
Japanese willows use a ton of water. I can pretty much water mine twice daily and each time I check the soil is almost dry.
Japanese willows use a ton of water. I can pretty much water mine twice daily and each time I check the soil is almost dry.
power270lb
Shohin
I do, under 3 spider farmer sf-1000s but they're off to the side and I'm watering 1-2x a day. These things suck water like I've never seen. Doesn't make sense because this plant in particular is in between 2 lights plus there's a fan and humidifier.
Bonsai Nut
Nuttier than your average Nut
Did you always have these trees under your lighting setup? Or did you recently add the trees? With professional grow lights, they sometimes have spectral intensities that plants aren't used to. I don't think this is currently the case though - this looks to me more like a case of sun scorch - of an instance where a tree can't keep up with the rate of transpiration from the leaves. When leaves are getting scorched from the sun, they tend to dry on the flat inner portion of the leaf. When they get dried from the wind, the damage usually starts on the leaf tips and margins, and works inwards.
sorce
Nonsense Rascal
Does it not?
Benching that much, you can take me so I'm not making fun, but read that again.
Between there and your outdoor oven, I reckon even Japanese Maples would pick the oven!
Sorce
power270lb
Shohin
I've always had this setup and since I've gotten more trees I've now added the first willow to my south facing window. Got three rootless trunks, stuck in water then fox farms ocean soil. Watered twice a day and the supplier said after a month it should be a normal watering schedule but in my set-up I'm watering almost everything daily. Doesn't make sense that the first tree shriveled the way it did. After 36 hours basically? There's no way these lights are stronger than the sun and they're not directly under them.
power270lb
Shohin
Lol my outdoor oven? I'm so confused. Are you saying my lights are too strong?
sorce
Nonsense Rascal
Your hot west facing balcony!
I'm saying, I never seen a humidifier, fans, or led lights in the woods!
Sorce
Bonsai Nut
Nuttier than your average Nut
It is possible that your willows don't yet have the vascular capacity to stay up with the rate of evaporation. If someone sends you some willow switches, and says stick them in water and you'll be good to go, that's very different than having a well-established tree in soil. The short roots may do fine when in water, but when you move to soil you may very well need 10x the root volume to draw up the same amount of water - and if you miss watering for a day it may just make things worse. The volume of roots to the volume of foliage is a constant balancing act, and if something happens to compromise the roots, the foliage may indirectly suffer.
And though you may not believe it, it is absolutely possible for artificial grow lights to be brighter than the sun, because they are designed to deliver light spectra in two very specific bands that plants use for photosynthesis. If you can buy artificial lights that will burn shallow water tropical corals in marine aquaria, I guarantee you that you can burn up a Japanese willow with short roots. I'm not sure that is what is happening here... but it is possible.
power270lb
Shohin
Oh yes but at the moment it's cold and very windy. I started this hobby in late November and have absorbed as much as I can. I know plants love humidity, warmth and light and I've tried to replicate that as best as possible. I thought fans were good because there is wind in the first yes? And my apartment gets dry so I try to keep the humidity up. Every article I've read on this forum you've commented so you've been around for a while and I value your opinion. What would you do different? Genuinely asking, all I want is for my trees to thrive. Have a pruning question I'm about to post as well.Your hot west facing balcony!
I'm saying, I never seen a humidifier, fans, or led lights in the woods!
Sorce
power270lb
Shohin
Oh wow, so what would you do? I've trimmed the branches as well because they were roughly 3 feet long and standing straight up, simply no room. I wanted to encourage more ramification and more branches coming out of the Branches already in place. In regards to pruning (actually about to post a thread asking cuz it genuinely confuses me) when I cut the ends of the branches (on all my trees) it's like that branch just stops growing. It'll grow other leaves and Branches but it terms of length it just stops. Idk but it confuses me. Trying to prune to get the most out of the tree and encourage more growth.
sorce
Nonsense Rascal
The self adjustment that came first for me was a story from Zen in the Martial Arts by Joe Hyams. In it, while having tea, someone tells about wasting time, which makes Bruce Lee get up and cancel some appointments. I think besides the lesson of not wasting time, the additional lesson is to not waste time thinking about if you are wasting time.
With everything shitty in this world, the only way to find balance is to always put out less effort than the benefits you receive. This way you keep plenty of "room in your cup" for the bullshit.
For me, when the return for the effort is the need for more effort, I start thinking about how much money I can get for the lights if I can sell em almost new in box, wondering why I made the poor decision in the first place, which usually leads back to something simply evil, like greed, or a want for something I have no reason to put out any effort towards at all.
I would realize the end goals, with more possible means.
Sorce
power270lb
Shohin
Echo your sentiments on world being shitty, I got into this because I was so sick of politics and overall toxicity of social media. It's reduced my stress 1000 fold.
power270lb
Shohin
Soooo lol what would you do different?
sorce
Nonsense Rascal
The amount of enjoyment people get from different activities is too different to make judgements on anyone's path.
I always find there is more happiness in seeking better things to put effort into. Our definitions of "better" are also equally vast.
What would YOU do differently?
Sorce
AJL
Chumono
Willow is a hardy deciduous genus not well suited to indoors .what youre doing is keeping them in an unnatural envitronment which is unsustainable for them to survive in the long term and will not be realistic for developing into bonsai.. they would be far better off outdoors, growing in soil and daylight. Almost all willow will grow from cuttings outdoors so why not put them outside and focus your energies on species more suitable to indoor bonsai if thats what you want??
power270lb
Shohin
Haha this convo is so over my head bro just trying to figure out what's up with my willows. Me personally, I love my setup and so far every penny/minute spent has been beyond worth it.
power270lb
Shohin
I started this in late November and for rootless trunks in late January. Once it warms everything is going outside permanently. Feel like I have to write my bonsai life story to let people know "yes I know they all belong outdoors, I started in winter" plus I have a balcony and nowhere to plant.
sorce
Nonsense Rascal
That's all that matters. The hoopla is to avoid acting like anyone else's opinion matters!
My Mugo pine thrived in my oven, elms do fine, my willow, well...there's a larger opinion! Lol...
But focusing on stuff that can be out there will bring you peace and tranquility.
Keep the Indoor rig for some wicked easy fun tropicals that will be happier adapting to Indoors.
I think BNUT nailed it with too much transpiration. I'd run the fan just above allowing mold, but not so high you're pouring good tree $ into the electric bill!
Sorce
