Gbhunter77
Mame
If you could please do so
i like my trees, this feeling might not last.
- Thread starter Gbhunter77
- Start date
M. Frary
Bonsai Godzilla
When does this happen? I have a couple and never see back budding ever. Through hard pruning?
I also keep my foliage where it is by pinching too. Constantly. Not all but everytime I walk by I'm pinching the new growth.
Mike, as I said, I'm not the hinoki expert.
But I will say this:
Pinching constantly is a poor technique.
The tree has to be allow to grow. That's how it get gets fresh new foliage, and that's what it needs to make food for the rest of the tree. New foliage produces the hormone auxin, which stimulates root growth. By constantly pinching, you're removing the auxin, therefore you get poor root growth. Poor root growth, the tree is weak. Weak tree: no back budding.
Instead, let it grow out. Let the tree get strong. Then cut back. A strong tree will respond with pushing new growth.
This is true for all trees, not just hinoki.
Please see Mike Hageforn's blog: www. Crategeous.com. His particular blog is on junipers, but it applies to all bonsai.
Back in the day (40 years ago) I, too, was taught to pinch. Turns out, we were taught wrong.
It's better to let it grow, then cut back.
But I will say this:
Pinching constantly is a poor technique.
The tree has to be allow to grow. That's how it get gets fresh new foliage, and that's what it needs to make food for the rest of the tree. New foliage produces the hormone auxin, which stimulates root growth. By constantly pinching, you're removing the auxin, therefore you get poor root growth. Poor root growth, the tree is weak. Weak tree: no back budding.
Instead, let it grow out. Let the tree get strong. Then cut back. A strong tree will respond with pushing new growth.
This is true for all trees, not just hinoki.
Please see Mike Hageforn's blog: www. Crategeous.com. His particular blog is on junipers, but it applies to all bonsai.
Back in the day (40 years ago) I, too, was taught to pinch. Turns out, we were taught wrong.
It's better to let it grow, then cut back.
Hinoki like to stay full. When you cut back, it's better to leave it "too full" than "too thin". Asi posted earlier, they like to have the trunk shaded by their foliage. If you can easily "see thru" the canopy, it's probably too thin.
M. Frary
Bonsai Godzilla
If you don't pinch, it will only have foliage at the ends of branches. I don't pinch it all at once but I do some here and there.
I know all about a tree needing new growth to survive. It has it all over. It is very bushy. I've had these trees. My very first bonsai was a hinoki cypress. I kept it perfectly fine until it died while I was on vacation.6 years.
Pinching is not a poor technique if utilized right. I pinch junioers also. And Hagedorn also says turface is no good when there are people who have fine trees growing in it. Just because someone says something is wrong or isn't the correct way or didn't utilize something the way it should be used and had bad things happen doesn't make them right. We all do things differently in every aspect of life. We figure things out for ourselves in different ways because we are all different. I never had someone tell me how to do bonsai. I figured everything out for myself. I'm still learning. Teaching myself. I sift through all of the information I come across on this internet thing and use what coincides with what I already know about trees and use that. Pinching has its place just as cutting the shoots does. Use them both once and see what happens Adair. Do something different. Be your own teacher.
I know all about a tree needing new growth to survive. It has it all over. It is very bushy. I've had these trees. My very first bonsai was a hinoki cypress. I kept it perfectly fine until it died while I was on vacation.6 years.
Pinching is not a poor technique if utilized right. I pinch junioers also. And Hagedorn also says turface is no good when there are people who have fine trees growing in it. Just because someone says something is wrong or isn't the correct way or didn't utilize something the way it should be used and had bad things happen doesn't make them right. We all do things differently in every aspect of life. We figure things out for ourselves in different ways because we are all different. I never had someone tell me how to do bonsai. I figured everything out for myself. I'm still learning. Teaching myself. I sift through all of the information I come across on this internet thing and use what coincides with what I already know about trees and use that. Pinching has its place just as cutting the shoots does. Use them both once and see what happens Adair. Do something different. Be your own teacher.
Vance Wood
Lord Mugo
You should always like your trees, they deserve that. What you need to understand is as you grow your opinion of them may change. Some people go through this transformation and decide they have out grown their trees. They will then go out and get rid of them, sell them or give them away or throw them in the dumpster. I have a problem with that. What you need to do is make your trees grow artistically as your vision changes.
I know what it is like to have people accuse you of using second rate trees but when some of them start turning into first rate bonsai they will start to shut their mouths. They may never reach that state of existence, or state of mind, because for some of them it is too financially expedient to just go out and buy material that is nearly finished. Personally I think you are better served by forcing yourself to make something good out of something that is not so good. It is always rewarding to have someone complement you on a tree that some big wig told you that you could never make a bonsai of it.
That's fine too, and I suppose it is good advise for someone who does not care how much money they spend on a new tree and maybe a teacher. However; not everyone falls into that category. Not everyone can go to major shows all over the country. I am every bit as interested and passionate about bonsai as those who seek material west of the Rockies and visit shows from coast to coast. I try not to judge people that roll according to the gas in the tank.
Vance,
I commented on the Hinoki because in my opinion it had been pruned incorrectly in the past. I think he mentioned he wanted it to back bud. So, I related what I knew of the species, and how to grow them.
I'm sorry you don't like constructive comments.
I may be able to travel to get instruction. And, I try my best to share what I've learned. I'm sorry you don't appreciate that.
I do hope GB makes a nice tree out of what he has.
Mike: I was taught to pinch 40 years ago. Believe me, cutting back is better.
Hinoki is a bit of the exception, they tolerate pinching back better than other species. Just don't use fingernails.
I commented on the Hinoki because in my opinion it had been pruned incorrectly in the past. I think he mentioned he wanted it to back bud. So, I related what I knew of the species, and how to grow them.
I'm sorry you don't like constructive comments.
I may be able to travel to get instruction. And, I try my best to share what I've learned. I'm sorry you don't appreciate that.
I do hope GB makes a nice tree out of what he has.
Mike: I was taught to pinch 40 years ago. Believe me, cutting back is better.
Hinoki is a bit of the exception, they tolerate pinching back better than other species. Just don't use fingernails.
M. Frary
Bonsai Godzilla
Hahaha. I don't have any really. I chew the crap out of them. Take them right down till they bleed.
I've been told I'm the most hyper fat guy you will meet.
Gbhunter77
Mame
I have also been told the shaded trunk thing is tottaly wrong. Hynoki do not back bud on the branch, just in the croch of the branches which is what mine is doing right now. I think hiding the trunk is not a good idea. But cleaning the whorling fans is really hard.
M. Frary
Bonsai Godzilla
Can you take a picture of the back budding and post it here please. I've never seen one bud on old wood.
If that is possible I need to know how it was made to do it. Everyone that owns needs to know how to get one to back bud on old wood.
At the crotch where the branch comes out of the trunk right?
That would be awesome because in your picture you need foliage close to the trunk.
If that is possible I need to know how it was made to do it. Everyone that owns needs to know how to get one to back bud on old wood.
At the crotch where the branch comes out of the trunk right?
That would be awesome because in your picture you need foliage close to the trunk.
GB, my point is you don't prune these things so that all the foliage and branches are way out on the tips. You need to leave branches that eminate close to the trunk so that there will be crotches for new budding. If you cut off those branches, no crotches, no budding.
Gbhunter77
Mame
Nature did that pruning for me. I did not remove the inner foliage.
Gbhunter77
Mame
That sounds oh so wrong lol.
