PLEASE, everyone, read this!!!!!
- Thread starter jk_lewis
- Start date
mc4mc44
Mame
Thanks for posting this, it was a long read but worth it. I'm always trying to learn more about pesticide and all the chemicals we spray on our trees. The part about systemic insecticides hit me hard for some reason, even though I've only used them once on a pine.
There's a lot of other good information there too, everyone should look around at that thread.
There's a lot of other good information there too, everyone should look around at that thread.
jkd2572
Masterpiece
Sorry I tried being nice to bugs all it got me was dead trees. I go nuclear once a month. I now even rotate pesticides like crop growers so they don't have a chance to become immune. I do enjoy reading his posts though.
october
Masterpiece
I completely agree with the dissertation. In fact, I have subscribed to this for years. I use the least toxic pesticides there are. I have killed mite and scale infestations, 2 of the toughest ones just by using the least toxic stuff. Also, I only spray when there is a problems. Lastly, with the exception of like 10 years ago using a systemic maybe 1 time. I have not used them since. In my opinion, I believe that the only thing that should be taken up by a tree's roots are nutrients and fertilizer. Of course, this is just my opinion.
Rob
Rob
coh
Imperial Masterpiece
Can't find anything to argue with in that set of posts, except perhaps for the part about systemics. I feel they do have their place, though in a limited role. I won't apply systemics to any plant growing in my yard. I will use them on potted plants, subject to the following constraints: (1) I've tried other control methods and they have not succeeded, plant is being damaged to point of danger to its health, and (2) the plant doesn't (or won't) produce flowers/pollen/nectar that would attract pollinators. So, for example, I will apply to my pine and juniper bonsai to control the scale that has resisted all other control methods. I won't apply to something like crabapple, quince, etc.
Otherwise, I always try to identify the problem before deciding on any treatment. I'll try water sprays to dislodge pests, then something like oil or soap. I don't mind some damaged leaves and would prefer to allow natural predators to do as much of the work as possible.
Chris
Otherwise, I always try to identify the problem before deciding on any treatment. I'll try water sprays to dislodge pests, then something like oil or soap. I don't mind some damaged leaves and would prefer to allow natural predators to do as much of the work as possible.
Chris
Does anyone know what eats mites? Maybe juvenile lacewings? I know plenty of things that eat aphids, and insecticidal soap seems to take mites out, but if there's a "good bug" that eats them I'll happily hunt some down. And how about scale while we're on the subject?
I'm all for the most natural ways to manage pests. Especially when warning labels on many chemical pesticides read just shy of wearing hazmat suits with oxygen during application...
I'm all for the most natural ways to manage pests. Especially when warning labels on many chemical pesticides read just shy of wearing hazmat suits with oxygen during application...
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monza
Shohin
Are you talking spider mites? These bugs work wonders:
http://www.thebuglady.ca/buying.htm. I'm sure you could buy similar in your area. Pretty spendy but they work.
http://www.thebuglady.ca/buying.htm. I'm sure you could buy similar in your area. Pretty spendy but they work.
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jkd2572
Masterpiece
The problem I have with this is that once you discover your junipers have a spider mite problem it can kill them or make them look like they are going to die for two years after. Preventative poison is the answer for me.
dick benbow
Omono
Reminds me of my 35 years with Koi. People would ask me about killing diseases and paracites. I'd ask specifically what they were dealing with. they didn't know. So they'd use a broad spectrum antibiotic. end result the disease would mutate and the antibiotic would become
less and less effective.
In the water column is tons of good bacteria, that also get killed with the antibiotic treatment.
interesting to me that tho the hobby's are quite different, there is a common thread that runs between them.
less and less effective.
In the water column is tons of good bacteria, that also get killed with the antibiotic treatment.
interesting to me that tho the hobby's are quite different, there is a common thread that runs between them.
Paradox
Marine Bonsologist
I only use pesticides when necessary and if I cant solve the problem with something milder.
I dont use systemics, because they are no longer allowed for sale on Long Island.
I dont use systemics, because they are no longer allowed for sale on Long Island.
jk_lewis
Masterpiece
I guess that would depend on ho closely you monitor your trees. But for spider mites (especially) simply wetting the foliage periodically will keep the mites away.
Arthur noted in passing, also, that keeping your growing area clean and well maintained will go a LONG way to reducing insect problems.
jkd2572
Masterpiece
I always water my junipers foliage when I water. I guess I have some kind of super mites swimmers here. My growing areas are very nice and clean.
GrimLore
Bonsai Nut alumnus... we miss you
There is a time and place for everything no matter if it is considered good or bad by the general public. When it comes to heavy duty things like Malathion I have a good example of logical use.
I spray the concrete and stone surfaces surrounding all our plants. This eliminates ants and most cutworms. By eliminating ants I find very little problems with aphids.
We have found and photo'd all varieties of pollinators, praying mantis, spiders, and assassin bugs on our plants(they are fine and abundant). This morning I took a clover bee from an orbed spider web that was woven last night.
With caution even the nasty stuff can be effective and non destructive.
My final opinion is you must use caution and common sense with anything including organics.
Do not put yourself in the general opinion pool unless you buy Charmin Toilet Tissue based on Mr. Wiffle saying it is squeezably soft...
Intelligence coupled with Logic is where you want to be, a leader not a follower.
Just my 2 cents,
Grimmy
I spray the concrete and stone surfaces surrounding all our plants. This eliminates ants and most cutworms. By eliminating ants I find very little problems with aphids.
We have found and photo'd all varieties of pollinators, praying mantis, spiders, and assassin bugs on our plants(they are fine and abundant). This morning I took a clover bee from an orbed spider web that was woven last night.
With caution even the nasty stuff can be effective and non destructive.
My final opinion is you must use caution and common sense with anything including organics.
Do not put yourself in the general opinion pool unless you buy Charmin Toilet Tissue based on Mr. Wiffle saying it is squeezably soft...
Intelligence coupled with Logic is where you want to be, a leader not a follower.
Just my 2 cents,
Grimmy
jk_lewis
Masterpiece
I'm sorry, but any use of Malathion around the home is downright scary.
Tell me all is well at your place in 20 years, please.
Tell me all is well at your place in 20 years, please.
GrimLore
Bonsai Nut alumnus... we miss you
jkd2572
Masterpiece
Malathion is my pesticide of choice as well. I switch out with avid. I put the gas mask on when using avid. Avid is a leave no survivor bad to the bone stuff. You mix only 1/4 teaspoon per gallon of water. 8oz=$100. It's worth it when you have $1000 trees being killed.
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JudyB
Queen of the Nuts
Yowza, you guys are using stuff you have to wear gas masks for? I'm glad that my pest problems are not so bad. I use mostly insecticidal soap, once in a while I'll use something with pyrethrin in it, but that's rare. I did put some systemic on my worst case trees this year for the first time. I may or may not try that again next year. The thing I've had to do the most this year is spray for fungus each week for almost 2 months with the wet wet wet weather. I hope that this isn't too harmful.
But I have a medium sized orchard (20 trees) a large garden (50x100') and 15 acres, more than half of which is landscaped and groomed, the rest is wildish woods. And I don't spray ANYTHING on ANY of that. Or for that matter fertilize, unless you count compost. I have innumerable flowering plants to attract bees and beneficials, and a pond for frogs and dragonflys. So I feel that the little enough that I do spray and use a systemic if needed for the bonsai is not very large of a footprint for my overall foot. I will do what I need to do to keep the trees healthy, but at the low end of the chemical scale.
Good discussion, keep it going.
But I have a medium sized orchard (20 trees) a large garden (50x100') and 15 acres, more than half of which is landscaped and groomed, the rest is wildish woods. And I don't spray ANYTHING on ANY of that. Or for that matter fertilize, unless you count compost. I have innumerable flowering plants to attract bees and beneficials, and a pond for frogs and dragonflys. So I feel that the little enough that I do spray and use a systemic if needed for the bonsai is not very large of a footprint for my overall foot. I will do what I need to do to keep the trees healthy, but at the low end of the chemical scale.
Good discussion, keep it going.
GrimLore
Bonsai Nut alumnus... we miss you
Every time I mention proper use of items that many consider BAD it seems every thread dies. Honest I do not see why but sorry 
