What is this tree and how do i save it?

[brodie]

Greetings! I have long been an admirer of penjing, but know little of caring for the trees. I currently live in Taipei, and bought myself a small (6 inch tall) young tree. The issue is that my Chinese is not good, so the only care instructions i was able to understand from the woman selling me the tree (for $25 which I thought was a good deal) was to water it every day until water came out of the bottom. However, doing that method, many of the leaves just under the outermost canopy have been drying up and dying. There was one shoot that grew out to 3 inches length but i cut it back. Recently the leaves have stopped dying, and several other shoots have popped out, which i suppose is good news.
So, questions:
- Any guess what this is?
- Any advice on how to keep it healthy besides what I'm doing?
- Should I cut the shoots back right now, or wait?

In general I'm not a brown thumb, and have successfully kept two other bonsai, but this one seems termpermental. It currently has moderate ambient light, no direct sun (which is hard to get in Taipei).

Any help is appreciated, thanks!

 

[Vance Wood]

Greetings! I have long been an admirer of penjing, but know little of caring for the trees. I currently live in Taipei, and bought myself a small (6 inch tall) young tree. The issue is that my Chinese is not good, so the only care instructions i was able to understand from the woman selling me the tree (for $25 which I thought was a good deal) was to water it every day until water came out of the bottom. However, doing that method, many of the leaves just under the outermost canopy have been drying up and dying. There was one shoot that grew out to 3 inches length but i cut it back. Recently the leaves have stopped dying, and several other shoots have popped out, which i suppose is good news.
So, questions:
- Any guess what this is?
- Any advice on how to keep it healthy besides what I'm doing?
- Should I cut the shoots back right now, or wait?

In general I'm not a brown thumb, and have successfully kept two other bonsai, but this one seems termpermental. It currently has moderate ambient light, no direct sun (which is hard to get in Taipei).

Any help is appreciated, thanks!View attachment 26828View attachment 26829

Looks a little like a Fukien Tea. They are fussy and easily damaged by improper watering techniques. I suspect the tree has been over watered. Watering every day is not necessarily a bad idea unless the tree does not need water every day. If the soil seems wet you have probably been watering too much.

 

[bonsai barry]

Do you keep it outside? Keeping a bonsai inside can kill it quick.

 

[brodie]

I do keep it inside. My understanding was that this was an inside tree.

And it does look like a Fukien tea tree, thank you, Vance.

It is confusing, however: I would agree that, if anything, I have been over-watering it, however a website I found online said that if you overwater it the leaves turn yellow and oozy, and if you underwater it, they turn black and fall off, which is what happened. Now that I think about it, it was pretty hot here when I bought the tree at first, and it has stabilized as the temperature dropped, so maybe it was just the heat, and not enough water?

Also, online it said to trim the branches back after they have 6 to 8 leaves on them. Does that sound about right?

 

[Vance Wood]

I do keep it inside. My understanding was that this was an inside tree.

And it does look like a Fukien tea tree, thank you, Vance.

It is confusing, however: I would agree that, if anything, I have been over-watering it, however a website I found online said that if you overwater it the leaves turn yellow and oozy, and if you underwater it, they turn black and fall off, which is what happened. Now that I think about it, it was pretty hot here when I bought the tree at first, and it has stabilized as the temperature dropped, so maybe it was just the heat, and not enough water?

Also, online it said to trim the branches back after they have 6 to 8 leaves on them. Does that sound about right?

I'm sure there are more qualified people to answer you FT questions. I have not fooled with one for at least fifteen years. I found them too fussy. Watering issues will drive you nuts, they get a variety of bugs and do not like any kind of pesticide when they do get infected.

 

[markyscott]

Greetings! I have long been an admirer of penjing, but know little of caring for the trees. I currently live in Taipei, and bought myself a small (6 inch tall) young tree. The issue is that my Chinese is not good, so the only care instructions i was able to understand from the woman selling me the tree (for $25 which I thought was a good deal) was to water it every day until water came out of the bottom. However, doing that method, many of the leaves just under the outermost canopy have been drying up and dying. There was one shoot that grew out to 3 inches length but i cut it back. Recently the leaves have stopped dying, and several other shoots have popped out, which i suppose is good news.
So, questions:
- Any guess what this is?
- Any advice on how to keep it healthy besides what I'm doing?
- Should I cut the shoots back right now, or wait?

In general I'm not a brown thumb, and have successfully kept two other bonsai, but this one seems termpermental. It currently has moderate ambient light, no direct sun (which is hard to get in Taipei).

Any help is appreciated, thanks!View attachment 26828View attachment 26829

I think that this is perhaps not a Fukien Tea. I suggest instead that it may be a Chinese Sweet Plum (Sageretia theezans). In terms of general daily care, the difference is not so important. Here in Houston, I grow mine on the benches beside my other tropicals including my Fukien Tea trees. In general, do not let the soil dry out, leave outside in full sun as much as possible, protect from temperatures less than 40F. In term of pruning, they are a bit different than Fukien Tea's as their growth habit is much more similar to a Chinese elm. Enjoy!

Scott

 

[brodie]

I think that this is perhaps not a Fukien Tea. I suggest instead that it may be a Chinese Sweet Plum (Sageretia theezans).

As i was looking around at info on the sweet plum online, i noticed that its leaves are very finely serrated, which the leaves on mine are not. And as for the Fukien Tea, it does look like one, however none of the (very small) leaves are lobed. Perhaps this only happens when they get older?

 

[Kevster]

It's leaves do look similar to a Fukien tea but I have to agree with it being something different.
The new shoots of growth resemble but are not of a Fukien and the bark of the tree is not typical of a Fukien either.

Also you can NOT believe everything you read online. Yes it's a great source of information. But what you are reading is coming from a place that wants to sell you trees. This is a forum where people have the knowledge from experience and only want to guide you in a direction to make you successful and help you love the lifestyle known as Bonsai.

With that said. All plants should be grown outside. Some can survive inside but do not thrive as they would outside. All bonsai should be grown outside. There is only one bonsai I know of that does good inside without any special treatment and that is a schefflera. Anything else will need extra care.
I bring my tropicals inside every winter and have a designated enclosure for them that has lots of artificial lighting. With this not only do my trees live through the winter, the continue to grow considerable but still not like they would outside.

You don't list what planting zone you live in so tell us what the summer/winters are like there. If you must keep the tree inside you might want to consider a grow light.

 

[markyscott]

As i was looking around at info on the sweet plum online, i noticed that its leaves are very finely serrated, which the leaves on mine are not. And as for the Fukien Tea, it does look like one, however none of the (very small) leaves are lobed. Perhaps this only happens when they get older?

I've never notced any serration on the he leaves on my sweet plum. Perhaps there is some variability in the species. I think that's probably what you have, but it does not matter very much in terms of their daily care as they seem to respond alike to similar conditions:

1) As many hours of full sun as you can give them. Both species respond well to lots of light. I know that you'll find recommendations that will describe Fukien Tea's and Sweet Plums as "indoor trees", and I imagine, with sufficient artificial lighting, that both may tolerate it. But I have found that both species languish in even partial shade outdoors (still much higher light levels than indoors without supplemental artificial lighting) and grow like weeds in the full sun.

2) They like well drained soil, but do not like really damp or soggy conditions. I grow mine without any organic material in the substrate at all.

3) They like lots of water. During the summer in my substrate, I water 2-3 times a day.

4) They cannot tolerate freezes - I move mine into the greenhouse at the first sign of frost.

Although they both have a reputation as being a bit tempermental, in my experience, and under these conditions in Houston (similar to Taipei, I would guess), they grow rapidly and are pretty easy to care for.

Good luck!



Good luck

 

[Vance Wood]

I think that this is perhaps not a Fukien Tea. I suggest instead that it may be a Chinese Sweet Plum (Sageretia theezans). In terms of general daily care, the difference is not so important. Here in Houston, I grow mine on the benches beside my other tropicals including my Fukien Tea trees. In general, do not let the soil dry out, leave outside in full sun as much as possible, protect from temperatures less than 40F. In term of pruning, they are a bit different than Fukien Tea's as their growth habit is much more similar to a Chinese elm. Enjoy!

Scott

That's a good possibility and probably a better choice------but-----similar difficulties.

 

[brodie]

This is all very helpful, thanks for all of your replies. I looked again, closely, and the biggest leaf does seem to be lobed, but i will defer to all of your expertise.

The climate here in Taipei is sub-tropical, very hot and humid in the summer, mild and rainy in the winter, maybe 50 degrees, and wet. Even outside, I'm afraid, there is very little actual sunlight during the winter, although I know the ambient light is better than inside. All Taiwanese apartments have ledges outside the window, so I'll start keeping it out there.

I also bought some plant food today. In my limited Chinese I asked for food good for the kind of tree i have (i know the name in chinese, but, because of chinese, i dont know the characters or how to look it up) and was given a bag of dark brown pellets that i was assured were meant for my specific tree. I dont know, however, how often or much to give it. Toughts?

 

[JudyB]

Plant food is not really tree specific. Sounds like you have a type that you just sprinkle on top of the soil. Let it sit there, every time you water, some of it will go into the soil. Eventually it'll all get used up. Then depending on where you are in your seasons, you can put more on it. Be careful to watch out for this type of fertilizer clumping in your soil, and creating drainage problems, I take a little root rake, and break it up if it does.